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Old Jan 6, 2005, 10:35 PM   #11
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I just wanted to reinforce what others have said here.
Not nearly enough information was given to say that the tests were conducted even remotely properly. This includes things like shooting with similar settings (focal length, fstop, shutter speed, iso), using a tripod, with an identical target and lighting.... and there is more. Basically you have to make sure you are actually looking at pictures where the differences are caused only by the camera.

And even then, for all we know the sharpest/best fstop used on the G6 is actually a bad fstop to use with the 16-35. Comparing cameras is not easy, this is why you look at reviews on sites that do it properly.

The settings in one camera don't mean the same thing in the other. So the incamera sharpening might be set to the default in both cameras but the G6's probably does more sharpening at that setting.

Also, looking at the picture at 200% isn't really useful. You are going beyond what anyone would do with a lope when viewing negatives on a light table. You really don't need to go beyond 100% when comparing things.

And last, the output of the 20D is soft. It's intentional. This is because not all pictures are intended to be tac sharp. Most people don't want a portrate where every pore in their skin is visible. All DSLRs I know have lower default sharpening because this gives the photographer more control in post production to add as much or as little sharpening as they want. Taking out sharpening (and still having a good picture) is hard... it rarely looks good. Adding sharpening is much easier.

Please post examples of crops at 100% in PS... with no editing and specifically no reduction. I know that I can produce very sharp images with my 20D. It's possible that your 20D or lens is defective. It's possible that you just want a sharper out-of-camera image and you should turn up sharpening in the camera. Personally, I'd never do that... but that is just me.

There are many owners of the 20D here, I'm sure we could quickly tell you where the problem lies.

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Old Jan 7, 2005, 3:14 AM   #12
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1. P&S digicams have greater depth of field than DSLR's because of their smaller actual focal length.


2. Canon ultra-wides are not the last word in sharpness (not even the 16-35 f/2.8 L).

3. P&S digicams typically do in-camera sharpening whereas DLSR owners typically do manual post-processing sharpening. (Using USM or something more sophisticated.)

4. There's more to image quality than sharpness (e.g. noise, CA, distortion, flare).

5. Fine focusing with a wide-angle lens is not easy / there are many ways to make images unsharp.
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Old Jan 7, 2005, 5:59 PM   #13
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Avery knowledgeable Calumet salesmen explained to me that in order to properly compare an image from a DSLR and a Point and Shoot camera, the images had to be shot in RAW format.
According to him a Point and Shoot processes a jpg more efficiently than a DSLR.
Does this make sense?
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Old Jan 8, 2005, 10:58 AM   #14
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In my opinion... maybe. Actually, now that I think about it more... probably.

The issue here is that different cameras will do JPG compression at different strengths. So the "fine" setting on one camera won't be the same as "fine" on another.

By shoting in RAW you bypass all of that. If you use a standard utility to do the RAW conversion (like photoshop, breezebrowser, or capture one) and then view the images then you have done a good job a leveling the playing field. And if you save it to JPG you know it will be done the same way for each picture.

Ya, there is something to be said for saying that the best way to compare pictures is to use RAW on both cameras.

But there is a problem with that. If you are not going to use RAW when you actually use the camera it doesn't really matter. What you should compare really is the settings you'll use it at. If you will always shoot in JPG then compare them at JPGs from the camera.

Its the difference between a technical and a practical one.

A technical review says that in an absolute sense X is better than Y. Its like a "lab" test vs. a real world test.

A F1 race car might go really fast, but if I compared one to my car that wouldn't matter... I wouldn't drive it at 200MPH. What would matter more (probably) is that it handled, accelerated and breaked better. Because I'd never take advantage of its top speed, but I would use those other things.

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Old Jan 8, 2005, 12:45 PM   #15
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Most high-end Point & Shoot cameras can shoot in raw as well :idea:

-> the comparison will be more even then with all the same post conversion tool
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Old Jan 8, 2005, 1:16 PM   #16
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I ran into a very simual situation working for Canon. I was working a Canon promotion for the NFL. We were using several Canon's G5, G6, Digital Rebel, etc. taking pictures of fans with the 49er players and printing them on the Canon cp300 printer and making little photos to go around your neck like press passes.

The Drebels were all coming out underexposed while the G5 and G6 were coming out perfect.

Also, it takes the drebel a long time to print directly from camera to printer while the point and shoots discoer printer almost instantly.

Yes, I believe the Drebel is a better camera, but it takes a lot more work to get good shots from it. Basically you have to know what to do to solve these problems.
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