Go Back   Steve's Digicams Forums > Misc Forums > Computers and Operating Systems

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old Jun 23, 2013, 3:52 AM   #11
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Comox, Vancouver Island, BC Canada.
Posts: 102
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb View Post
A few days ago I acquired a used Dell Dimension E520 tower. It looks like new, but it had no hard drive. It had previously been operating Windows Vista Business edition.

I added a hard drive (formatted to FAT32) and tried to install several versions of Windows on it. They included Windows 2000, both an old and a much newer version of Windows XP Pro, and Windows 7. Every time, after going through most of the install process, it suddenly halted and a screen was displayed saying that there had been a serious error and that to prevent damage to the computer, everything had been halted.

So I tried installing my favorite version of Linux - Peppermint 3. It installed quickly and operated perfectly. So did a couple of other versions of LInux.

But my aim was to have a double boot - with Windows on one partition and Linux on the other partition.

Fortunately, the computer came with two Dell disks
a brown one to reinstall Windows Vista and a blue one to reinstall extra Dell software.
DELL (Alien Ware), & Sony use system specific BIOS chips. Which built into the bios, it scans the drive looking for the DELL Boot sequences that get embedded into the boot sequence.

As a systems tech, I hated (and refused many times) to work on DELL & Sony machines.

Do yourself a favor, take that DELL and toss it off a bridge. If you're lucky it'll bounce at least once..
__________________
Weapons of choice:

FujiHS20 (used all the time)
Nikon Coolpix L24 (used all the time)
Nikon D60 DSLR (rarely used anymore)
Olympus 8000 (never used anymore, as I lost my data cable).
Pantharen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 23, 2013, 11:39 AM   #12
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Victoria, B.C., Canada
Posts: 865
Default

Pantharen -

Apropos DELL, I'm certainly never going to buy another. But I believe that if I did throw it off a bridge, somebody using Linux Peppermint would catch it on the way down.....

P.S. - does "Tiger Man" ring any bell?
Herb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 23, 2013, 1:54 PM   #13
Administrator
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Savannah, GA (USA)
Posts: 22,378
Default

4 out of my last 5 PC purchases have been from Dell (refurbished from Dell Outlet) using coupon codes for more off.

Chances are, the next PC I buy will also be from Dell Outlet (waiting for coupon codes for more off before making the purchase, since they have them for 15 to 30% off on a regular basis.

I doubt your install issue using XP or older has anything to do with it being a Dell. It's more likely that the disk drive had errors, or that the system is using a chipset that's newer than supported by XP, or something similar.

Why FAT32? How did you format the partition you tried to install XP on?

XP won't even format a partition larger than 32GB using FAT32. One work around to getting a larger partition with FAT32 is using fdisk by booting into the install disk for an older Operating System like Win 98, or format it using a third party tool (GParted live, etc.). Microsoft probably did that to discourage the use of FAT32 beginning with XP (and rightly so, as it's a poor choice for an OS installation).

I'd use NTFS instead for XP, since FAT32 has too many limitations that make it a bad choice (no journalling features for better reliability, limitations on the number of files and folders in the root directory, file size limitations, etc.).

I'd never use FAT32 for XP. Use NTFS instead.

But, even using NTFS, you can have disk errors that will result in the type of symptoms you're reporting. For example, you may see something like this when you get that warning, followed by other numbers and text about damaging the system.

STOP 0x00000024

That's a file system error stop code, and you'd need to try and run chkdsk /f from a Windows install disk to find and correct the errors (probably bad sectors).

So, I'd make sure to perform a full format of the partition you install it to if you see something like that, and make sure to check it for errors using chkdsk /f from the Windows install disk, as you may have sector read errors causing the install to fail (as the default format only recreates the file allocation tables and doesn't try writing to the rest of the partition or check it for read errors).

You can also see similar errors due to driver problems (as Windows will need drivers for the IDE and SATA controller chipsets, USB chipsets, audio chipsets, video chipsets, etc. etc. etc.).

For manufacturers like Asus, Gigabyte, etc,. a driver disk is usually included with the system for supported operating systems so you can install them during a Windows install (you can press a function key to install drivers during a Windows installation). With Dell Systems, the same thing applies. I'd check their drivers download pages and make sure they have drivers for the OS you're trying to install.

http://www.dell.com/support/drivers

The newer the system, the less likely a manufacturer will have drivers for XP (as most new systems have been shipping with Vista, Windows 7 for a while now). IOW, you may find that no XP Compatible drivers are available for newer USB chipsets, video chipsets, SATA controller chipsets, etc. if you buy a new system now. The newer the Operating System, the more likely a Microsoft Windows install disk will already have any needed drivers on it. But, the opposite applies for newer chipsets and older versions of Windows (as XP came out before many newer chipsets were designed, requiring you to install drivers from a disk during the install process before disk drives are recognized properly, since drivers for the chipsets may not be on an older XP install disk, etc.)

But, for a Dell Business system that had Vista Preinstalled (as it sounds like your system did), XP drivers are probably available for it from Dell's download pages, as many businesses preferred to stick with XP with Vista came out.

You may also see an Operating System setting in the BIOS with many setups to allow better compatibly with a given OS. So, check the BIOS options, too.

But, in any event, I certainly wouldn't use FAT32 for a Windows Operating System installation. I'd use NTFS instead. If you format a partition as NTFS and point the XP installer to that partition during the install (making sure to load any needed drivers for XP, which you can do via a function key for "Load Drivers" when you get to the page asking where to install to) and still see any type of crash like that, I'd make note of the stop code you see and google for it.

But, I suspect you just had some kind of file system error (for example, a sector read error) during the install that caused the crashes, because the partition you were trying to install to had issues. I'd format a partition as NTFS using GParted from one of you linux disks, and make sure to check it for errors before trying to install XP to it for starters.
JimC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 24, 2013, 10:50 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Comox, Vancouver Island, BC Canada.
Posts: 102
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb View Post
Pantharen -
P.S. - does "Tiger Man" ring any bell?
Nope.. should it?
__________________
Weapons of choice:

FujiHS20 (used all the time)
Nikon Coolpix L24 (used all the time)
Nikon D60 DSLR (rarely used anymore)
Olympus 8000 (never used anymore, as I lost my data cable).
Pantharen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 25, 2013, 12:27 AM   #15
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Victoria, B.C., Canada
Posts: 865
Default

Jim - Thanks for the good advice. To format to FAT32 I used a floppy disk very similar to an earlier Windows install disk. But from now on it's going to be NTFS - that is if I ever go back to using Windows. Over the last several months I've become increasingly inclined to use only Linux Peppermint.

Pantharen - my mentioning "Tiger Man" was just a wild guess. Pantha sounds like "Panther" and "Ren" sounds like what (I've been told) is Mandarin Chinese for "person". I wondered if perhaps you knew rather more Chinese words than I do!
Herb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 25, 2013, 9:44 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Comox, Vancouver Island, BC Canada.
Posts: 102
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb View Post
Jim - Thanks for the good advice. To format to FAT32 I used a floppy disk very similar to an earlier Windows install disk. But from now on it's going to be NTFS - that is if I ever go back to using Windows. Over the last several months I've become increasingly inclined to use only Linux Peppermint.
FAT32 is extremely limiting. First it is limited to a maximum of 2GB. Anything over 2GB will cause FAT32 to hang. I personally despise Windows XP, but like everything it was a progression towards total NTFS. *IF* I had to go back in time, I would still use NT4 or Windows 2000 (NT5). Windows XP will work under NTFS, but it does have issues running on that platform. once again you have to deal with limits of maximum HD capabilities, and maximum ram limitations. Just because you might have 4GB of ram, does not mean that XP is going to know or recognize all 4GB, at best it might recognize 2GB. *IF* you need to run Windows, then at least install Vista or better option Seven.

Sorry, but Linux is EWWWW... Too bad Caldera has gone.. I cherish my final edition of UNIX 10.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb View Post
Pantharen - my mentioning "Tiger Man" was just a wild guess. Pantha sounds like "Panther" and "Ren" sounds like what (I've been told) is Mandarin Chinese for "person". I wondered if perhaps you knew rather more Chinese words than I do!

Pantharen is a nickname I've had since the mid to late 80's from the era of the BBS, I dont remember why we spelt it that way, but it stuck..
__________________
Weapons of choice:

FujiHS20 (used all the time)
Nikon Coolpix L24 (used all the time)
Nikon D60 DSLR (rarely used anymore)
Olympus 8000 (never used anymore, as I lost my data cable).
Pantharen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 27, 2013, 12:59 PM   #17
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Victoria, B.C., Canada
Posts: 865
Default

Pantharen -

I heartily agree with you about Windows 2000. I've always liked it.

The one thing that is bad about newer machines especially Dell - they seem to be designed to refuse to run Windows 2000

You sound a bit disappointed with Linux - but have you tried Peppermint 4? I have it running my HP Compaq dc 7800 p. I don't know what the "p" indicates but I can't find an answer on the Internet. The Compaq is an RCMP surplus item, so maybe the "p" signifies that it was made for the RCMP? I increased the RAM in it from 2gb to 4gb (the two extra inserts exactly match the existing two) and also installed a solid state hard drive. Peppermint 4 is very easy to use and the Compaq runs on it beautifully - and faster than any system I've every owned.

The only (slight) irritation is that I have to run Photoshop Elements under Wine.
Herb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 30, 2013, 2:53 AM   #18
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Comox, Vancouver Island, BC Canada.
Posts: 102
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb View Post
Pantharen -

I heartily agree with you about Windows 2000. I've always liked it.

The one thing that is bad about newer machines especially Dell - they seem to be designed to refuse to run Windows 2000

You sound a bit disappointed with Linux - but have you tried Peppermint 4? I have it running my HP Compaq dc 7800 p. I don't know what the "p" indicates but I can't find an answer on the Internet. The Compaq is an RCMP surplus item, so maybe the "p" signifies that it was made for the RCMP? I increased the RAM in it from 2gb to 4gb (the two extra inserts exactly match the existing two) and also installed a solid state hard drive. Peppermint 4 is very easy to use and the Compaq runs on it beautifully - and faster than any system I've every owned.

The only (slight) irritation is that I have to run Photoshop Elements under Wine.
I've used every "interface" version of Linux. I've also used the root version produced by Linus Torvalds, it is just a cheap rendition using a lot of short cuts from Unix & Sun Micro. I refuse to use Linux, because like OS2 it isn't quite the real thing, but a very cheap copy, made using short cuts.

Get a copy of Unix and you will see what I am talking about.
__________________
Weapons of choice:

FujiHS20 (used all the time)
Nikon Coolpix L24 (used all the time)
Nikon D60 DSLR (rarely used anymore)
Olympus 8000 (never used anymore, as I lost my data cable).
Pantharen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jun 30, 2013, 11:37 AM   #19
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Victoria, B.C., Canada
Posts: 865
Default Unix, Peppermimt 4 etc.

Pantharen -

I had a go at getting Unix, but I found the process too baffling for my very limited skills.

I can only assess a computer programme in the light of one question - "Does it work easily and well (for the things I want to do?)".

In the case of the Peppermint the answer is - "Yes".
Herb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jul 2, 2013, 12:20 AM   #20
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Comox, Vancouver Island, BC Canada.
Posts: 102
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Herb View Post
Pantharen -

I had a go at getting Unix, but I found the process too baffling for my very limited skills.

I can only assess a computer programme in the light of one question - "Does it work easily and well (for the things I want to do?)".

In the case of the Peppermint the answer is - "Yes".

Herb ~

Peppermint is Ubuntu with very few new things thrown into it.. Ubuntu is hit & miss on its installs, and I'm pretty sure as more & more "updates" come out for Peppermint, that they will start running into the same problems as ubuntu.

The only thing I like about Ubuntu is that I can run it from a Flash Drive. I can't run Unix from a flash drive.
__________________
Weapons of choice:

FujiHS20 (used all the time)
Nikon Coolpix L24 (used all the time)
Nikon D60 DSLR (rarely used anymore)
Olympus 8000 (never used anymore, as I lost my data cable).
Pantharen is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:29 AM.