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Old Nov 10, 2003, 5:09 PM   #1
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Default Image Size change vs. Default

Hi,
Back for basic 101 photoshop question (using Elements).......

Using a D100, and shooting raw, I bring in an image (NEF) into photoshop with the following dimensions:
Pixel Width: 3008, Pixel Height: 2000
Doc Width: 10.027, Doc Height: 6.667
Resolution: 300 dpi

Objective: I want to turn the above into a quality 8x10.

If I go into resize and 'unclick' constrain proportions, and then set the Doc Height to 8 and leave the Doc width at 10.027 (I am forced to resample) --- I get an image that is the right size, but the width has been stretched - hence my image is stretched.

There MUST be a way to resize an image to the proportions that I want without the image becoming abnormal.....

What am I doing wrong??

Thanks
ERIC
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Old Nov 10, 2003, 6:32 PM   #2
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You absolutely MUST keep the proportions constrained in order to keep the same relative proportions. Thus, if you have a 4 x 5 and you keep the constraint on, when you change the 5 to 10, the 4 is increased by exactly the same amount--in this case, it's doubled. Without the constraint on, you are changing only one dimension and leaving the other dimension untouched, thus getting the stretched effect.

In your particular case with a 10.027 x 6.667 print size, you will never be able to get an 8 x 10, not unless you crop down to a size with the same ratio as 8 x 10. Specifically, you'd have to crop the long side down to 8.33 before upsizing to get a nearly perfect 8 x 10.

Something to consider when resizing is that Adobe recommends increasing image size in steps, using no more than 5% increments. Doing it all in one shot tends to degrade the image a lot more than if it's done by smaller amounts.

I hope I was clear in my answer, though I'm not sure. When I first hit this question, it took me the longest time to get a grip on what was happening with all those pixels and how to tame them.
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Old Nov 10, 2003, 10:23 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bcoultry
In your particular case with a 10.027 x 6.667 print size, you will never be able to get an 8 x 10, not unless you crop down to a size with the same ratio as 8 x 10. Specifically, you'd have to crop the long side down to 8.33 before upsizing to get a nearly perfect 8 x 10.
Probably a great job of describing it if I wasn't such a rook (unfortunately I have yet to find a photoshop class in my area)....

When I set the crop tool to a width of 8.33, what should I set the height to? (or should I leave it blank?)
Doesn't setting the width to 8.33 (from 10.027) cut out a piece of the image (in this case I lose a kid!)?

When I size up, I do that after the crop and this is done in image->resize->image size (set to 8x10) -- yes?

Sorry to have you 'spell' it out for me - but adobe help stinks, and none of this is intuitive......

Many thanks for your patience.....
Eric
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Old Nov 11, 2003, 8:51 AM   #4
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when you open your image in PS turn on the rulers you will see that you have roughly a 26+inch image to work with. now if you overshot the area leaving some room to work with you would use the crop tool and creat a 8 in the height and 10 in the width and start in the upper left corner and diagonally down to the right opening the mask over your image until it covers the area you need print in that 8x10 size/ratio. this assumes you did not go edge to edge with all the people. do not put anything in the resolution as it will default to current resolution and will print excellently.

the basic rule is give yourself room to work by overshooting the image you know you want.

if your focus screen is interchangeable there are screens with print ratio lines scribed into them to help frame you image better.

look im no real fan of PS but your issue is knowing the ratio of the imager vs what you need to shoot/print. the cropping tool is self explanitory. its your shooting methodology that needs to adapt.

for the photographer afraid of PS i suggest this book:
Adobe Photoshop for Photographers by Martin Evening. depending on what version your using he has it versioned out v6 v7 and i expect soon v8 or CS.
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Old Nov 11, 2003, 10:01 AM   #5
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Default Re: Image Size change vs. Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by eriseman
If I go into resize and 'unclick' constrain proportions, and then set the Doc Height to 8 and leave the Doc width at 10.027 (I am forced to resample) --- I get an image that is the right size, but the width has been stretched - hence my image is stretched.
Shortest answer: Print at current size... cut print to 6.6667 x 10 and mount on an 8x10 mount board. Put in frame. This leaves a 1.333 inch space at the bottom, so choose a mount board in a color that compliments the image.

The problem is that the height and width ratio of your film (CCD) is different than your selected photo size. Unless you use a multiple of your CCD's ratio, you'll either have to crop or stretch the image to get the size you want. Cropping is OK, stretching is usually bad.

A D100 uses a 3:2 ratio, the same as film cameras. Notice how the 3:2 ratio fits nicely in a 4x6 photo? That's why 4x5 prints went away and 4x6 became the standard.

-jb
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Old Nov 11, 2003, 5:23 PM   #6
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This is one of those subjects where trying to describe a process in words alone probably works only for those who already understand the process. Worse, an explanation that turns on the lights for one person, leaves the next person still in the dark. I've read a lot of books about Photoshop (mostly borrowed from the library) and learned something from each but not everything from any single one.

Martin Evening's book is definitely good. Another that I go back to again and again is Restoration & Retouching by Katrin Eismann. Hers is not a book for a brand-new user of PS, but it's filled with information and technique for anyone who's gotten past that very first part of the steep learning curve.
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Old Nov 11, 2003, 5:36 PM   #7
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With the crop tool selected put 10 inches in the width and 8 inches in the height in the boxes at the top. Leave the pixels/inch box BLANK. Start the crop in the far upper left and drag all toward the lower right corner. You can adjust the center position by moving the crop lines. This way it will give you the best 8 X 10 crop you can get and use all of your remaining pixels without a resample There is no reason to resample a 6Mp image for an 8 X 10 print.
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Old Nov 12, 2003, 12:30 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eriseman
Doesn't setting the width to 8.33 (from 10.027) cut out a piece of the image (in this case I lose a kid!)?
Apparently this picture is of several children that fill the picture length wise. Any lengthwise cropping will cut off one of the children. That is unacceptable.

There are two choices: print the picture out at 6.6x10 (6.667x10.027) , or transform it to be a perfect 8x10. Printing it as a 6.6x10 will leave a small gap at the bottom of the print, but the image will be proportioned correctly. Stretching the image to a perfect 8x10 image will distort the image, but fit the frame perfectly.

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