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Old Nov 7, 2005, 4:48 PM   #1
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Greetings,

I own a Canon iP4200 printer with the CLI-8 chipped ink tanks. I am just now replacing my first tank (magenta) after doing much printing. However, in the ink monitor, I have noticed that the pigment (text) black tank is half empty while the dye (photo) black is completely full. I have printed almost nothing but photos and DVD's since thepurchase of the printer, but it hasn't used ameasureable amount of the photo black ink. Could this be because I've done all the printing on plain paper, not photo paper? Is it using the pigment black to get higher contrast on the plain paper, or is there something wrong with the unit. I have no problems with the unit and the print quality is outstanding.

TIA, MC


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Old Nov 7, 2005, 5:14 PM   #2
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wow, your using "plain paper"!? for photo's.

I think thats definitly why your not consuming any of the photo black.
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Old Nov 7, 2005, 6:08 PM   #3
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Ra Power wrote:
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Greetings,

I own a Canon iP4200 printer with the CLI-8 chipped ink tanks. I am just now replacing my first tank (magenta) after doing much printing. However, in the ink monitor, I have noticed that the pigment (text) black tank is half empty while the dye (photo) black is completely full. I have printed almost nothing but photos and DVD's since thepurchase of the printer, but it hasn't used ameasureable amount of the photo black ink. Could this be because I've done all the printing on plain paper, not photo paper? Is it using the pigment black to get higher contrast on the plain paper, or is there something wrong with the unit. I have no problems with the unit and the print quality is outstanding.

TIA, MC

I'm no expert in canon printer logic... I got this from another source to take with a grain of salt. And someone else pointed out in plain paper mode it uses the pigment black. Also from what i'm told even in photo paper mode the dye black only kicks in when the intensity of the black is 80% or higher, otherwise it uses a composite black from cyan magenta and yellow. I noticed on my mp760 that the dye black is the least used.

It gets confusing when canon publishes it's numbers. for example they will tell you that the estimated yields using the ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 test are

PIXMA iP4000:
BCI-3eBK1,500 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)
BCI-6C: 550 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)
BCI-6M: 430 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)
BCI-6Y: 360 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)
BCI-6BK: 2,000 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)

The 3ebk is 25ml where the others are 13ishml each... yet the dyeblack is getting 25% higher yield. Either the dye black is being used a little, ends up getting cleaned and empted after the 4th cartridge change and running these tests, or it's not used and they gave up after 2000 pages. I have no idea... but this should give you "some" idea as to the ratio the dye black is used in contrast to the pigment black.


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Old Nov 7, 2005, 6:42 PM   #4
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eric93se wrote:
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wow, your using "plain paper"!? for photo's.

I think thats definitly why your not consuming any of the photo black.
Thanks guys, this is what I thought.

BTW Eric, the "photos" I'm referring to were all DVD jackets and using photo paper for those could getexpensive at the rate I use them. Besides, they're somewhat"protected" behind the glossy outer jacket on the black DVD cases. :-)
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Old Nov 7, 2005, 6:59 PM   #5
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Quote:
zakezuke wrote:

I'm no expert in canon printer logic... I got this from another source to take with a grain of salt. And someone else pointed out in plain paper mode it uses the pigment black. Also from what i'm told even in photo paper mode the dye black only kicks in when the intensity of the black is 80% or higher, otherwise it uses a composite black from cyan magenta and yellow. I noticed on my mp760 that the dye black is the least used.

It gets confusing when canon publishes it's numbers. for example they will tell you that the estimated yields using the ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 test are

PIXMA iP4000:
BCI-3eBK1,500 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)
BCI-6C: 550 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)
BCI-6M: 430 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)
BCI-6Y: 360 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)
BCI-6BK: 2,000 pages (ISO JIS-SCID No. 5 / plain paper / standard mode)

The 3ebk is 25ml where the others are 13ishml each... yet the dyeblack is getting 25% higher yield. Either the dye black is being used a little, ends up getting cleaned and empted after the 4th cartridge change and running these tests, or it's not used and they gave up after 2000 pages. I have no idea... but this should give you "some" idea as to the ratio the dye black is used in contrast to the pigment black.




The bci-3eBK is 27 ml and the bci-6 are 13 mlaccording to the Canonpackage.

ThePGi-5 is 26ml and the CLi-8 is 13mlaccording to the Canon package.

cl-41 = 4ml x 3
cl-51 = 7ml x 3

I wasat a store and itpopped into my head to check them.






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Old Nov 11, 2005, 9:53 AM   #6
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Hey,
Been reading this forum for sometime, however this thread has come up which has interested me to reply,
About 3 weeks again I brought a Canon iP5200 printer for mainly doing direct DVD printing. Now I mainly use text with very little (if any) pictures.
A few nights ago I noticed that both magenta and cyan colours are being read (Canons software) as being used, while both the text black and photo black cartridges still full, having taken all cartridges out physically I have seen this to be true.
I have been mainly printing in "grey" mode, thinking this would force the use of the text black cartridge.

So does anyone else think this is strange? Why have a text black cartridge when it never gets used, and has anyone else had this happen?

Many thanks,

Ar3z

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Old Nov 11, 2005, 10:46 AM   #7
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Ar3z wrote:
Quote:
Hey,
Been reading this forum for sometime, however this thread has come up which has interested me to reply,
About 3 weeks again I brought a Canon iP5200 printer for mainly doing direct DVD printing. Now I mainly use text with very little (if any) pictures.
A few nights ago I noticed that both magenta and cyan colours are being read (Canons software) as being used, while both the text black and photo black cartridges still full, having taken all cartridges out physically I have seen this to be true.
I have been mainly printing in "grey" mode, thinking this would force the use of the text black cartridge.

So does anyone else think this is strange? Why have a text black cartridge when it never gets used, and has anyone else had this happen?
I'd be lying if I could say I fully understood canon logic... and most of my observations are on the ip3000 which has no dye black. From my understanding the logic is document oriented... not object oriented. I.e. it prints things like either a picture or like a text, not this is a batch of text and this is a picture. If you for example throw in a picture or colored text... it's a picture... at least from my limited understanding of how it works.

Now add to that it only black when the intensity is like 80%.. again a number quoted from someone else I can't personaly verify. Under 80% it uses all three primary colors to make black... or rather grey.

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Old Nov 13, 2005, 10:51 PM   #8
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I was printing some text labels on some photo matt paper the other day and i decided to select plain paper to get the printer using the pigment black and the outcome was not good with a lot of bleeding and a lack of sharpness.

I dont think that the pigment ink these printers use works well with instant dry coating on photo papers and thats why it isnt used.

With regards to the photo black i do also find that it is used very little in comparison to the colour inks which is stange as a lot of the dvd labels i print are predominantly black.

I am currently using the ink from bci 6 tanks to refill my chipped carts on my ip4200 and so far the quality is unaffected to me.
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Old Nov 14, 2005, 12:04 PM   #9
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Has anybody tried to use the print advisor and choose all black text ?
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Old Nov 14, 2005, 4:29 PM   #10
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Year the advisor just sets the printer settings to gray scale (what I set it up for anyway). Since my last post the PGI black as also gone down a bit (which is good). Still not sure why so much magenta and cyan has been used, when I have been doing mainly black text.
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