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Old Dec 14, 2005, 5:24 AM   #1
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I have some another questions:

R220 had 6 coclours, ip has 4 , but 4200 has 1 pl, 4000 2 pl, and r220 3 pl:

What is better photo quality: 3 pl and 6 inks or 2(1 pl) and 4 inks ??

I dont like to SEE DOTS that is photo consisted of ...

Which printer has LESS visible dots: cannon ip or epson r220

And where on the net I can see scans of printed photos by variable of printers on the market?

Thanks
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Old Dec 14, 2005, 6:54 AM   #2
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Edit:

Ah ok... sorry, the english was a bit tricky to understand...

You're asking if the differences between the picoliter (pl) dots and the number of colours and what sort of combination can work best..

I can't really comment as I don't have enough experience or need to look at such details... Hopefully Zakezukes comments below help..

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Old Dec 14, 2005, 7:58 AM   #3
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velikigrizli wrote:
Quote:
I have some another questions:

R220 had 6 coclours, ip has 4 , but 4200 has 1 pl, 4000 2 pl, and r220 3 pl:

What is better photo quality: 3 pl and 6 inks or 2(1 pl) and 4 inks ??

I dont like to SEE DOTS that is photo consisted of ...

Which printer has LESS visible dots: cannon ip or epson r220

And where on the net I can see scans of printed photos by variable of printers on the market?

Thanks

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/12/...et/page13.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/2004/10/...lor/page9.html

You can at least see the r300 and the ip4200/ip5200 though the big images of the ip4200 are not on the site presently.

But you are asking a good question... is it better to have a bigger drop and light inks, or better to have smaller drops. I personaly am on the fence on the subject. I am one who in many ways prefered the r200 to my ip3000/mp760 even though the resolution was color... the colors IMHO were very true to the image and fab... where the ip3000/ip760 while also being pretty good tended to be a tad vivid. But there are those who think i'm nuts on this issue. There are merits to both techniques and you your self should take the time to test both printers, or at least the canon and epson r300 in the store with the reccomended paper or your favorite paper and see for your self. Often times it boils down to what works best for you, what type of images you like to take.

One major difference I noticed was my r200 did white text on a black background better than the my ip3000 or mp760... not sure on the ip4200 though.



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Old Dec 14, 2005, 5:06 PM   #4
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I Have an Epson Photo 900 for a couple of years now and have a ip4200 for a couple of months.

I find myself coming to a similar conclusion to zakezuke as I find the Epson with its 6 inks creates a more realistic print whereas the ip4200 seems to use way too much colour.

What I find when I compare prints is that the Epson with its 6 colours seems to have much more greyscale in its prints which I think may be due to Epson using the black ink more than canon do when printing photos.
What I am getting at is that in areas where they should appear dark the canon seems uses more intense colour as opposed to using some black ink.

I really do think that this is all down to the canon ip4200 not using the black ink unless it's 80% or more black.

I also noticed that the appearance of the printouts from the canon seemed more dependant on the lighting than the Epson printout and for a while had me confused.

I now have a theory that this is caused by the canon making greyscale tones by using colour dots of each of the threecolours.

However this method is surely flawed as when a image is viewed in different lighting conditions the different colours making up the greyscale will no longer be balanced and thus will likely appear shifted toward the dominant colour in the lighting conditions.
For example when viewing in candesant lighting (normal bulbs non fluorescent) the images will appear to have more yellow and magenta than it should.

I also did a greyscale Prints to see how each performed at printing B&W photos well the Epson did print black and white using the black ink only but on the canon it seemed to try to make the grey using colour and in my opinion did not look grey at all.

I would just like to add that i dont think this is just a problem with the number of colours but rather a difference in how epson and canon go about printing there images.
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Old Dec 14, 2005, 7:24 PM   #5
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websnail wrote:
Quote:
Edit:

Ah ok... sorry, the english was a bit tricky to understand...

You're asking if the differences between the picoliter (pl) dots and the number of colours and what sort of combination can work best..

I can't really comment as I don't have enough experience or need to look at such details... Hopefully Zakezukes comments below help..

From my understanding... it's the light inks the light cyan and light magenta that are used massivly that help to hide the stark dots filling in the white spaces. It's a trick, but a trick that seems to work pretty dang well. Where the alternative technique is to go with smaller dots so small you can see them. Again this is a trick but one which works pretty well too.

I have not had a chance to evaluate the epson r1800 vs the r2400. The cheaper printer in this case has the 1.5pl sized drops and the more expensive printer has the huge 3.5pl drops. While I can not comment... it should help you to understand that one should not trust the numbers on the box but rather your eyes. In the end you are creating something based on what you see... or perhaps you are wanting things to look pretty good without hitting tons of buttons.

Do keep in mind that while the epson base photo models offer 6 tanks, there are 6 tank solutions in canon as well... and HP.

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Old Dec 20, 2005, 7:41 PM   #6
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websnail wrote:
Quote:
Edit:

Ah ok... sorry, the english was a bit tricky to understand...

You're asking if the differences between the picoliter (pl) dots and the number of colours and what sort of combination can work best..

I can't really comment as I don't have enough experience or need to look at such details... Hopefully Zakezukes comments below help..
Yes, english is not may homelanguage.. I hope you ll understand:-):?
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Old Dec 20, 2005, 7:45 PM   #7
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zakezuke wrote:
Quote:
velikigrizli wrote:
Quote:
I have some another questions:

R220 had 6 coclours, ip has 4 , but 4200 has 1 pl, 4000 2 pl, and r220 3 pl:

What is better photo quality: 3 pl and 6 inks or 2(1 pl) and 4 inks ??

I dont like to SEE DOTS that is photo consisted of ...

Which printer has LESS visible dots: cannon ip or epson r220

And where on the net I can see scans of printed photos by variable of printers on the market?

Thanks

http://www.tomshardware.com/2005/12/...et/page13.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/2004/10/...lor/page9.html

You can at least see the r300 and the ip4200/ip5200 though the big images of the ip4200 are not on the site presently.

But you are asking a good question... is it better to have a bigger drop and light inks, or better to have smaller drops. I personaly am on the fence on the subject. I am one who in many ways prefered the r200 to my ip3000/mp760 even though the resolution was color... the colors IMHO were very true to the image and fab... where the ip3000/ip760 while also being pretty good tended to be a tad vivid. But there are those who think i'm nuts on this issue. There are merits to both techniques and you your self should take the time to test both printers, or at least the canon and epson r300 in the store with the reccomended paper or your favorite paper and see for your self. Often times it boils down to what works best for you, what type of images you like to take.

One major difference I noticed was my r200 did white text on a black background better than the my ip3000 or mp760... not sure on the ip4200 though.



But what about pixelisation?
I dont want to see these small dots: Is canon better for that: it has smaller dots: (1-2pl) epson 3 pl


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Old Dec 20, 2005, 7:53 PM   #8
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is there ANY difference between r200 and r220 and r300 and r320: I think THEY ALL uses the SAME print head, and had the same print speeds????
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Old Dec 20, 2005, 8:19 PM   #9
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velikigrizli wrote:
Quote:
is there ANY difference between r200 and r220 and r300 and r320: I think THEY ALL uses the SAME print head, and had the same print speeds????
http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/c...egory=Products
http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/c...egory=Products
4" x 6" Photo
  • R200 - 37 seconds r220 - 57 seconds[/*]
8" x 10" Photo
  • R200 - 77 seconds r-220 - not listed
    [/*]
Pages per minute based on black text and color in Draft Mode on plain paper.
Note I can't verify this, these are just numbers from epson.
Photos of the r220
http://www.pcmag.com/slideshow_viewe...mp;po=6,00.asp

When the offical site lists the offical specs as being slower in draft mode... it leads one to suspect that the new model is slower than the old one. Other than the color it looks virtualy identical. I would suspect the r220 would, rather than have new features or improved printing would have features to resolve issues with the r200, most noteable the CD feeder. That could... and I think i'm being fair here, use some serious improvement. There are those who claim a quality improvement... which might be true as well, or perhaps they got one that was assembled on the jig correctly vs one that was well... was not. But I'd look at the quality of the case... does the top cave in when you press the buttons... does the diaper require breaking of plastic to replace.





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Old Dec 21, 2005, 4:59 AM   #10
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zakezuke wrote:
Quote:
velikigrizli wrote:
Quote:
is there ANY difference between r200 and r220 and r300 and r320: I think THEY ALL uses the SAME print head, and had the same print speeds????
http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/c...egory=Products
http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/c...egory=Products
4" x 6" Photo
  • R200 - 37 seconds r220 - 57 seconds[/*]
8" x 10" Photo
  • R200 - 77 seconds r-220 - not listed
    [/*]
Pages per minute based on black text and color in Draft Mode on plain paper.
Note I can't verify this, these are just numbers from epson.
Photos of the r220
http://www.pcmag.com/slideshow_viewe...mp;po=6,00.asp

When the offical site lists the offical specs as being slower in draft mode... it leads one to suspect that the new model is slower than the old one. Other than the color it looks virtualy identical. I would suspect the r220 would, rather than have new features or improved printing would have features to resolve issues with the r200, most noteable the CD feeder. That could... and I think i'm being fair here, use some serious improvement. There are those who claim a quality improvement... which might be true as well, or perhaps they got one that was assembled on the jig correctly vs one that was well... was not. But I'd look at the quality of the case... does the top cave in when you press the buttons... does the diaper require breaking of plastic to replace.






But what should I buy r200 or r220 if I decide to buy epson???

Do they both use THE SAME cartridges?
Can r200 cartridge go in r220 ?

thanks

Just one question more: Is this true? : When replacing all cartridges r200(220) I mean epson USES VERY much ink for CLEANING print head...
Ink when you place the last cartridge the first has much lower ink level: it is spent for cleaning..
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