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Old Mar 17, 2012, 9:08 PM   #1
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Default Volleyball done wrong

Hi folks,
First attempt at indoor VB with the A77/70-200mmG combo.

I am very dissapointed to say the least.
Seems I was always to close or to far to get the shot I wanted, had trouble with getting good focus, just not a good outing.

Samples have exif embedded or should have.
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Old Mar 17, 2012, 9:18 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Fossil View Post
Samples have exif embedded or should have.
Nope. Those exceeded the max sizes allowed here (either the dimensions or the file sizes were too large). So, the forums software stripped out the EXIF information and recompressed them.

The file size must not exceed 253.9KB, and the longest dimension must not exceed 1024 pixels. Otherwise, the forums software is going to strip out the EXIF data, and resize and/or recompress images.

If unsure if it's within the allowed sizes, just right click on a file while your browsing for it and look at it's properties from within Windows Explorer to see it's file size and dimensions. If it's too large, it's going to be modified by the forums software, as those images were. ;-)

So, either downsize them to smaller dimensions or use a lower JPEG Quality Setting to keep the sizes within the allowed limits for file size and dimensions.

See this post I made earlier on this subject for more info:

Surf Oceanside

What are you using to resize them with? Usually, a JPEG Quality setting of around 80% (or 8 on a 1 to 10 scale) will keep the file size within limits if the dimensions are not too large (and both the dimensions and file size must be within the set limits if you don't want the forums software modifying your images).
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Old Mar 17, 2012, 9:57 PM   #3
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Couldn't find a way to edit out the orig pics so here is a re-done smaller version.
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Old Mar 18, 2012, 6:30 AM   #4
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No EXIF in those either. Set a lower JPEG quality with the editor you're using the resize them. As mentioned earlier, around 80% usually works to keep the file size within limits if the dimensions are not too large.
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Old Mar 18, 2012, 11:24 AM   #5
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Hmmmm. jpeg size is 800x600 dropped quality from 90% to 70% and file size is still 306 kb.

Any worse than this, I'll use my cell phone.
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Old Mar 18, 2012, 12:09 PM   #6
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That shouldn't be the case. What software are you resize them with?

Now, an image with higher noise levels won't compress as well, because the noise is treated as detail.

But, I just tested resizing a full size image from an A77 from some ISO 6400 samples that are quite grainy, saving them at 1024x682 and 85% JPEG Quality end up with a 214KB sample. At 80%, it's at 188KB.

If I resize it to 800x533 at 80% Quality, I'm down to 143KB.

If you're still seeing one at 306KB using 70%, something sounds wrong with the way the software you're using is resizing them (chroma subsampling settings, etc.), as you shouldn't need to drop quality that low to keep an 800x600 pixel image within the allowed limit of 253.9KB here.

Now, if an image is full of detail (and noise is treated as detail), then it may not compress as well. But, in my experience, you should not have to go down to 70% with any image that you'd see in normal use to get file sizes below 253.9KB.

You may also want to consider just using a host elsewhere so that the file size limits don't apply (although we'd still prefer that images are not too large, as not everyone has a broadband connection with unlimited bandwidth). For example, a very easy way to do that is a free dropbox.com account. Just go here and download their software and install it:

http://www.dropbox.com

It will create new dropbox folders on your PC. Then, if you want someone else to see an image, just copy it to your dropbox/public folder and it will sync it to the same folders on their servers. You get 2GB of storage for free and can put any kind of files, including images in your dropbox folders. Then, just "right click" on the image using your file manager (windows explorer, etc.) and select the Dropbox>Get Public URL choice that you'll see after you install it to get a link the image.

Then, you can embed the image in a forum post by using the embed image icon you'll see in the forums editor toolbar for that purpose, pasting the dropbox link in it.

Or, you can do that manually by placing [img] in front to the link in a post, and [/img] after the link in a post (which is the same thing that embed image icon does for you). For example, just do this in a post, pasting the public link to an image where I've got the words public link to your image.

[img]public link to your image[/img]
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Old Mar 18, 2012, 12:30 PM   #7
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Of course, having EXIF in an image isn't necessary. But, it can help others understand what may be improved upon (looking at things like White Balance, Autofocus Mode, ISO speed settings, shutter speeds being used, etc.).

For example, you'll usually get better results if you set a custom white balance (using a target setup under the lights on the floor before the games start, and even a white sheet of matte photo paper makes a pretty good target), and you'll usually want your Autofocus Mode set to AF-C with the Center AF point often working better; and you'll want to use ISO speeds that give you acceptable shutter speeds to freeze most of the action with Manual Exposure working best for indoor gyms so that exposure doesn't vary a lot; and with Sony models turning off DRO is a good idea to reduce noise levels.
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Old Mar 18, 2012, 4:09 PM   #8
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G'day FF

How about just posting us some idea of the overall EXIF data and we'll go from there ... ?

Looking at the images they seem to me to be 'pretty typical' of many sporting pix shot under artificial light ~ a most difficult & unforgiving photo environment

As a 1st guess for future shooting I would offer
- ISO 1600 [certainly]
- manual focus on the net
- Aperture to f4 for a small amount of DoF
- EV to -2/3EV to overcome lighting mis-match from metering

Regards, Phil
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