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Old Apr 11, 2005, 12:32 PM   #11
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Oh, I fully agree with you. The only way to get any where near the print life they say (and we all know you never get that) is to use the same brand of papers and inks. This is one thing that is in Epson's advantage. They have a large set of (slightly overpriced) papers in a variety of styles. Heck, they even have a canvas that works really well.

If Epson offered a paper of a style that I liked, I would just use theirs with my printer. On the flip side, I certainly wouldn't use a paper that didn't have a profile made for the 4000.

Eric
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Old Apr 11, 2005, 3:58 PM   #12
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I used to think the same thing (sorta still do), but, Ilford is one paper manufacturer that has impressed me enough to do at least some basic testing of this theory. For example, they provide icc profiles for the 4000 for about 5 of their papers, including their Smooth Fine Art and their Smooth Pearl. These profiles are based not only on the 4000, but on using the Ultrachrome inks specifically. Knowing the quality of Ilford and the fact that they only provide a few such printer profiles would leave me to believe they may offer a very worthwhile alternative to "OEM" papers only. Their pearl is a wonderful paper and if they provide a profile for the HP 8750 then I will try it at the very least. Were I a 4000 owner, I would try one of those two just to see. It broadens your choices (not nearly as much as the more limited HP papers), but may be worth a few bucks to find out.

Ray
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Old Apr 12, 2005, 10:54 AM   #13
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I know that company as well and they do make very good papers.

What I wrote was really a bit stronger than what I meant.
I will never use a paper without a profile. Epson's profiles for the 4000 are even better than the 2200's profiles (and those were quite good.) So on the surface, if epson makes a paper I like I will use it unless there is a lower cost paper, with a good profile for the 4000, that is the same or better in other ways (higher dmax, similar thickness and texture,....)

Sure, if I find that someone makes a good paper and there is a good profile available for the 4000 then I'll give it a try. But it will have to be a profile made for the 4000 or I won't touch it. I've learned the hard way that I waste too much time trying to make a good print when I don't have a good profile (that ignores the cost in paper and ink for the waste prints. Some times I give the close ones to my niece, so at least those get some good use.)

Eric
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Old Apr 12, 2005, 6:45 PM   #14
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Eric,

I understand your point and mostly agree, but have a look at this link (hope it works) http://www.ilford.com/html/us_englis...26&Submit.y=17
and see what you think. The Ilford folks only make a selective group of profiles for their higher end papers for a selective group of printers able to use them. It's not "harry's profiles for all" type stuff where a company tries to be all things for all printers. They are selective in their choices (implying some diligent research) and only publish those they suspect will yield excellent results. The link is for the profiles for their Epson 4000 using Utlrachrome Inks for a select few of their papers.

Ray
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Old Apr 13, 2005, 12:15 PM   #15
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Thanks for that link. I'm going to be reproducing some water color paintings with my 4000, and to that end I'm going to be experimenting with some non-photo papers. Ilford makes some that I bet will fit the bill.

We actually are saying the same thing. If the company makes a good profile and a good paper, I have no trouble using it. But I won't just grab a paper that is cheap and try it (i.e. no profile = no use) and I won't use a paper with a profile that isn't specifically made for the 4000 (i.e. the 4000 is such a good printer, why would I use a profile that didn't get the best out of it? I purchased a $1600 printer 'cause I care about quality.)

Ilford fits the bill on both accounts. Ilford cares about their products, so I have no problem assuming they make a good profile. And I already know they make a good paper.

So Ilford is an example of a company who's paper I'd try with my 4000.

Eric

ps. I made a mental mistake in my previous post. I said "printer" where I meant "paper". I've corrected it in that post.
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