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Old Apr 27, 2005, 5:07 PM   #11
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I just realized my analogywas faulty. Correct me if I'm wrong but the Epson cartridges contain 13ml of ink per individual color cart. If you break down the HP per color ML count it's somewhere between 3.51 to 3.78 PER COLOR, in a tri-color cartridge that starts out with 13-14ml.

So even if the ink waste % is correct for both printers. It works out like this:

Epson: 13ml less 59% waste= approx. 5.3 to 5.8 ml to print with.

HP: 13ml tri-color cart divide by 3 isapprox 4.6ml

4.6minus 19% waste= approx 3.51 to 3.78 left to print with.

Bottom line (if these numbers are anywhere near correct)

Epson= 5.8mlper color toprint with.

HP= 3.78mlper color to print with

If you start out with more ink in the cart to begin with you can waste most of it and still come out withmore ink to the paper.

I think I may be left with only ONE real drawback on the Epson and that's the clogging issue which some people seem to dispute. Now my head is spinning AGAIN.

tony


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Old Apr 27, 2005, 6:47 PM   #12
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Well, I think the ink costs are close enough given the other issues and I am happy with my choice. Selling prints reduces the ink cost to near insignificant differnces for me.

Of course, I have now already "wasted" my two 13 X 19 Satin papers on two prints. I upsized my 6.3MPixel images to print at that size and all I can say is -- stunning! The quality of the prints using the out-of-the-box HP profiles is simply nothing less than stunning. I haven't taken them swimming yet, but the images are glorious, colorful, vibrant and clear. They are slightly tacky to the touch initially, but not so as to smear/damage them if handled gingerly. After a couple of hours of drying, they can be handled. But, did I mention, the quality is simply stunning?

Ray
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Old Apr 27, 2005, 11:01 PM   #13
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Ray

I'm very pleased to hear your getting "stunning" results from your 8750. I hope the ink usage equation works out to be somewhatcomparableor better thanEpson. I'd be interested in hearing howthe ink consumption works out after some use. I'd really like to know if you experience one color running outsooner than others,making it necessary to discard a cartbeforeother colors are exhausted. This has beenTHE main argument against tri-color carts.

Keep the info coming. Since this is a new product there are many of us who will be monitering your experience. I'm ready to pull the trigger as soon as it's available at fry's.

tony
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Old Apr 28, 2005, 10:34 AM   #14
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I share your interest/concern about the usage rate of colors per cart. It would indeed be a bad thing if one color consistently runs out well before the other two. I'm sure some research was done on what combo of colors to put together to lessen this problem, but only reality will give the answer. Of course, it also depends on individual usage. I'm not secure enough in color mixing to guess, though I've read that the cyan/magenta gets most use.

I tried to use two highly diff. images with diff. color/tonal ranges. Just for example, here are the two images in small form. Both came out with excellent colors and smooth transitions, especially in the depth of black in the portrait and the bokeh background behind the bird in varying shades of creams, browns and tans. Different images with different palettes, upsized to 13 X 19 from 6.3Mp originals. Great results.





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Old Apr 28, 2005, 2:27 PM   #15
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Your right, from what I can see the results are quite impressive. btw I assume those are shots you took. The shot of the girl is really nice. Although I'm an art photographer, I do family photography for a living and Iused to do a lot ofactors. It's a great shot.

tony
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Old Apr 29, 2005, 5:24 PM   #16
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Well Ray, I finally pulled the trigger. I ordered my HP 8750 from Amazon but I didn't get the price you did. It cost $499.99 Should ship on or about May 2nd.

All the indecision and waffling is now over. I hope I made the right decision.

tony
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Old Apr 29, 2005, 5:57 PM   #17
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tony,

I seriously doubt you'll be disappointed (except the price - I didn't know they raised it back up). You've done your homework and know what you want and this printer, from what I've seen so far, will deliver. I couldn't find the HP 101 and 102 carts anywhere local or online, so I ordered a set of 2 each from HP and they throw in free Fedex overnite shipping.
I also ordered some of the larger (11 X 17 and 13 X 19) papers from an online discounter.

I even tried the spit-test after some drying time and my prints didn't want to smear. I like the satin paper over the glossy. The only thing left is the fewer paper choices (which should change I imagine) and the 3 inks/cart potential for waste. BUT, the output is dead on with my calibrated monitor using the included HP profiles. I think you'll be very happy. Good luck.

Ray
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Old May 1, 2005, 2:54 PM   #18
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Ray

I'm thinking my preferance on paper will be the satin finish you mentioned. Do you know what otherarchival finishes are available? I read that HP doesn't have an archivalmatte finish yet using Vivera ink which if true is unfortunate since I would really liketo do some of my art work on matte. It seems to be the preferred finish forthat.I'm not afan of the glossy look. Also ,do you use a monitor calibrater and if so which one.

Any thoughts or suggestionsare appreciated. This has been a long education and evaluation process, now I'm getting ready torock and roll.

Thanks

tony
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Old May 2, 2005, 11:08 AM   #19
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Tony,
I'm not sure due to the way HP advertises on their site and elsewhere, but, it appears there are 4 papers available:
Premium Plus Hi-gloss, soft-gloss, matte and satin. However, in the installed printer profiles they only differentiate between papers, not finishes. In other words, there are 4 profiles for the Prem. Plus papers but they are based on 4 combos of ink carts, not on the specific paper type. Sounds odd to me. However, I printed both the hi-gloss 13 X 19 and the satin 13 X 19 using the profile based on my ink setup and the results were excellent and dried reasonably quickly with spit-test resistance to smearing. It's a little different that what I expected (i.e. paper type and ink being the determining factor, not just ink combo and general paper type). But, I guess if it works, it works. So far, it works, but very small sample. I do notice the gray cart. contents are disappearing at an alarmingly fast rate with just 4 13X19 and about 4 4X6 prints. I'll keep an eye on ink consumption as well.

Ray
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Old May 2, 2005, 11:53 AM   #20
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Which Epson printer are you basing this on?

The Epson 2100/2200 has 20ml cartridges, and its larger brothers (4000/7600/9600) use 110ml or 220ml cartridges. If you use the printers all the time and do not constantly power them on and off, they do not perform the ink wasting power-on cleaning cycle all the time. The only time I shut mine off is when my UPS is needs service or I will be off-sitefor more that a week or two.

With the HP you do get a nice new print head with each new cartridge.:-)

Peter.


Quote:
Originally Posted by tmumolo
Epson: 13ml less 59% waste= approx. 5.3 to 5.8 ml to print with.

HP: 13ml tri-color cart divide by 3 isapprox 4.6ml

4.6minus 19% waste= approx 3.51 to 3.78 left to print with.

Bottom line (if these numbers are anywhere near correct)

Epson= 5.8mlper color toprint with.

HP= 3.78mlper color to print with
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