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Old Jan 31, 2008, 2:23 PM   #1
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Ranchers & Elk Damage

One of our local ranchers called me yesterday and told me he had a call telling him elk had jumped a couple of fences and were eating his cow hay. He asked me to check it out and if it was true to try and get him a few photos so he can file a game damage report with New Mexico Fish & Game. The rules are very involved but basically if a rancher can show damage when he puts in for his private land elk tags next year he should get a couple of extra ones to make up for the damage. If he doesn't want extra tags he can request elk fencing materials from Fish and game. Elk fence is about 10 ft. high. Since the ranchers sell there elk tags to outfitters most are more interested in extra elk tags than they are in fence material. I am making him 3 copies of these photos. 1. for his records, 2. game and fish game warden & 3. to send in with his tag application and the end of next summer.

Here is the pasture with the cows and the hay pen. With a close up of a young bull having some hay.



Looks like he is caught with the goods still in his mouth.



The innocent look - "I didn't take any of the hay".



One of the cow elk after she jumped the fence and was in a hurry to get to the timber. Look and you can see she still has a lot of frost on her.



The reason for the frost is still on her.





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Old Jan 31, 2008, 3:51 PM   #2
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I got to admire you -18F!!!
(and here I'm still reminescing the Carribean)
BTW nice shots like always...
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Old Jan 31, 2008, 5:32 PM   #3
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NHL wrote:
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I got to admire you -18F!!!
(and here I'm still reminescing the Carribean)
BTW nice shots like always...
Not bad at all if you wear lots of layers. Thanks for the nice comment.
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Old Jan 31, 2008, 9:08 PM   #4
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i must say roger i would camp in my truck first check all the heavy trails ( most used ) park as to get the best images as possible for fish & game to prove that they need depradation tags to be isued . i would photo all the game trail as to the game in ??? get lots of images with game in feed lot eating . tell him not to sell to out fiters sell private he will get more $$$ inhis hand . most out fiters dont care about the land owners !!! why do you need an out fitter to shoot game off a feed lot ??? realy no sport in that ??? give it to a youth hunt or better someone in a wheel chair . not big bankers that dont realy hunt at all . if they dont need the meat that will good the homeless to feed the people !!! yes i hunt but i eat what i hunt . wish you the best on this one roger i would love to see a big smile on a kids face on his or her first hunt . or someone in a wheel chair that thought they would never have the day to enjoy it . and i hope you get the image of a life time that smile on there face . rick
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Old Feb 1, 2008, 1:02 AM   #5
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Great shots Roger. Looks like that buck is having quite a "Hay Day" :G. I still can't get over how blue your skies are..wonderful!....cheers..Don
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Old Feb 1, 2008, 10:03 AM   #6
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oakey wrote:
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i must say roger i would camp in my truck first check all the heavy trails ( most used ) park as to get the best images as possible for fish & game to prove that they need depradation tags to be isued . i would photo all the game trail as to the game in ??? get lots of images with game in feed lot eating . tell him not to sell to out fiters sell private he will get more $$$ inhis hand . most out fiters dont care about the land owners !!! why do you need an out fitter to shoot game off a feed lot ??? realy no sport in that ??? give it to a youth hunt or better someone in a wheel chair . not big bankers that dont realy hunt at all . if they dont need the meat that will good the homeless to feed the people !!! yes i hunt but i eat what i hunt . wish you the best on this one roger i would love to see a big smile on a kids face on his or her first hunt . or someone in a wheel chair that thought they would never have the day to enjoy it . and i hope you get the image of a life time that smile on there face . rick
You have really confused me. NO BODY is going to shoot anything around the hay pen. Elk season starts in September and at that time the Elk and the cattle will be a long ways from the winter feeding area. The extra tags will be for wild free ranging elk.

Most ranchers would rather sell their tags to outfitters cuz they are ranch experts not hunting experts. As a example one of the outfitters here ends up buying around 50 tags and he better have the expertise on how to sell them since he had to put up about $100,000.00 up front.


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Old Feb 1, 2008, 10:04 AM   #7
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Sorry I hit the wrong button.

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Old Feb 1, 2008, 10:06 AM   #8
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thekman620 wrote:
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Great shots Roger. Looks like that buck is having quite a "Hay Day" :G. I still can't get over how blue your skies are..wonderful!....cheers..Don
Not a bad deal, jump a couple of fences and then all you can eat.


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Old Feb 1, 2008, 5:35 PM   #9
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Greetings Roger!! Great shots as usual..

oakey--I'm not real sure where you are coming from in your post towards Roger..

Before one is going to post a criticism about outfitters & hunting big game, that person should at least be conversant with hunting seasons for the big game in question, in this case elk..

By the end of January there is little hunting allowed in any state, none of it big game hunting..This time of year is reserved to allow the animals a decent chance of surviving the winter without the pressures of hunting from humans..

Regardless of where you stand on hunting, you should know that selling the elk hunting tags can be another source of income for a rancher..None of the ranchers & farmers that I met while living in the West could be considered wealthy in terms of ready cash..To a person they were middle class to upper middle class Americans..

They may have been wealthy in terms of the amount of land owned compared to the rest of us..However, the range out west does not support the same abundance of wildlife per acre that the forests & farmland east of the Mississippi does..Nor will it allow a rancher to have huge herds of cattle as over grazing will occur..

On another note, no responsible outfitter would ever allow a client hunter to shoot at an elk when the rancher's cattle on whose land he was guiding on were in the direct line of fire..To do so would result in losing the priveledge to hunt on the ranchers property, & possibly the license to outfit or guide..

To do so as you suggested in your post would not only be irresponsible, but if I'm not mistaken would also be illegal..To shoot at animals at a hay depository would probably be considered a form of baiting, thus not legally allowed..

Roger--Is it me or has it been colder then usual in your neck of the woods this winter??..Do you favor natural or synthetic clothing as you dress in layers to combat those sub-zero temps??..

Congrats again on your recent photos!!..You don't seem to be having any trouble getting used to the new Canon rig with the BushHawk..Is the nylon BushHawk any better then the older one??..

Bruce


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Old Feb 1, 2008, 5:52 PM   #10
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baltochef920 wrote:
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Greetings Roger!! Great shots as usual..

oakey--I'm not real sure where you are coming from in your post towards Roger..

Before one is going to post a criticism about outfitters & hunting big game, that person should at least be conversant with hunting seasons for the big game in question, in this case elk..

By the end of January there is little hunting allowed in any state, none of it big game hunting..This time of year is reserved to allow the animals a decent chance of surviving the winter without the pressures of hunting from humans..

Regardless of where you stand on hunting, you should know that selling the elk hunting tags can be another source of income for a rancher..None of the ranchers & farmers that I met while living in the West could be considered wealthy in terms of ready cash..To a person they were middle class to upper middle class Americans..

They may have been wealthy in terms of the amount of land owned compared to the rest of us..However, the range out west does not support the same abundance of wildlife per acre that the forests & farmland east of the Mississippi does..Nor will it allow a rancher to have huge herds of cattle as over grazing will occur..

On another note, no responsible outfitter would ever allow a client hunter to shoot at an elk when the rancher's cattle on whose land he was guiding on were in the direct line of fire..To do so would result in losing the priveledge to hunt on the ranchers property, & possibly the license to outfit or guide..

To do so as you suggested in your post would not only be irresponsible, but if I'm not mistaken would also be illegal..To shoot at animals at a hay depository would probably be considered a form of baiting, thus not legally allowed..

Roger--Is it me or has it been colder then usual in your neck of the woods this winter??..Do you favor natural or synthetic clothing as you dress in layers to combat those sub-zero temps??..

Congrats again on your recent photos!!..You don't seem to be having any trouble getting used to the new Canon rig with the BushHawk..Is the nylon BushHawk any better then the older one??..

Bruce

Thanks Bruce for telling it like it is.

So far I am happy with my new BushHawk and I can't tell any difference.


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