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Old Oct 25, 2007, 4:25 PM   #1
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I have a set of close up lenses that I used with my Canon A80 and now want to try out on my new Canon S5. Previously I shot flowers and insects, and didn't really mess with manual settings, just took a bunch of pics and managed to get a few decent ones.

Any suggestions on how to get the best depth of field, focus, etc.? Also, since the camera has a macro and a super macro setting, which would be best for using in conjunction with the close up lenses?
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Old Oct 29, 2007, 2:41 AM   #2
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First, the closer you are the shallower the DOF. Therefore the aperture must be stopped right down. If using flash and the front lens is close to the subject, a front flash is a must.
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Old Oct 29, 2007, 10:18 AM   #3
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What size objects are you trying to photograph? Have you really checked out the macro and super-macro cababilities of the S5? It really has pretty good close-up capabilities without any add-ons. I'd try that first as that will produce better IQ than the close-up lenses.
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Old Oct 30, 2007, 5:32 PM   #4
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Thanks for the replies. I have tried shooting with and without the lenses using the supermacro option. The supermacro is great on the S5, but does not provide enought magnification for the kind of pics I'm looking for. I found another forum with a macro tutorial which has been helpful: http://www.s3users.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3566

Now I really want to get a Raynox DCR-250 add on lens as it has angreatmagnifiying ability. The interesting thing about it is that it works with the zoom fully extended to magnify. Some of the pics I saw on that forum using the lens are amazing.

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Old Oct 31, 2007, 4:14 PM   #5
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ac.smith wrote:
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Have you really checked out the macro and super-macro cababilities of the S5? It really has pretty good close-up capabilities without any add-ons. I'd try that first as that will produce better IQ than the close-up lenses.
Eh, I dont think you really know what you're talking about here.
The macro/supermacro on the S3/S5 totally sucks compared to a decent closeup-lens.
I'm not kidding, it totally blows....big time.


slmulkey, you will be stunned by the quality the DCR-250 will deliver on the S5.
Its so much better to shoot macro with a closeup-lens since you're shooting with longer focallength, and that means much better looking backgrounds and less distortions.

I would though recommend a DCR-150. I have the 250 myself, but I really feel I would need less magnification a lot of times. Its not very often I really need that extra full magnification, but rather the other way around, like when shooting a butterfly or a flower that is more than 2-3 cm across. The 150 has magnification enough, really really powerful, but at the same time you can back off a bit with it capturing larger things.


As geriatric says the DOF gets shorter the higher the magnification gets, so you'll need to step down quite a bit when shooting bugs and stuff with much tele. On the other hand, short DOF often is really nice and can give a nice effect.
Just look at this extreme closeup of mine, of a pine needle. The DOF is way less than 1mm. Uncropped and hardly edited at all.
http://sebastianfoto.se/bilder/barr_large.jpg

My advice when shooting with a closeup-lens is, when using low magnification (more wide) you almost need to use AF and let the camera lock, since you cant judge the perfect focus on the screen.
When using really high magnification though (long tele) you need to use MF since the camera has a very hard time to lock (DOF is extremely short) and also its really important to get focus in the exact right spot so better do it manually.

Keep the camera totally steady, like supporting it on the ground, on your foot, on your knee or similar. You wont make many great shots totally freehand, its too hard.

You can check the macros on my page if you wish. Just press the menus at top for cathegories. All of them are taken with my S3 and the DCR-250. None of them are hard manipulated or much cropped.

http://sebastianfoto.se/
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Old Oct 31, 2007, 4:20 PM   #6
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If someone still, for some reason, believes the supermacro of the S3/S5/similar is really great and closeup-lenses aren't needed, check this small comparison.
The top one is of course with a closeup-lens, at around 110mm focallength, from 12cm distance.
The bottom one is at supermacro, 35mm wide, and taken from like 1 cm distance, blocking the light from the sun. Both pics are wide open aperture.



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Old Oct 31, 2007, 5:20 PM   #7
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Wow, those are some great shots. I especially love the one on of the ant drinking water. Appreciate the advice, I will think about getting the 150 instead. I may also get a monopod as I tried shooting with a tripod and it was really not working for me.
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Old Oct 31, 2007, 11:02 PM   #8
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sebastianr wrote:
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If someone still, for some reason, believes the supermacro of the S3/S5/similar is really great and closeup-lenses aren't needed,
Are we by chance talking apples and oranges here. A close-up lens is a simple magnifying lens rated in diopters, +1, +2, +3 and +10 are commonly available. There are also two variable spaced element lenses that offer +1 through +10 diopters (and maybe additional movement to provide wide-angle capabilities as well.

Adding an additional lens is unlikely to increase sharpness if that image magnification is within the focus range of the unaided lens. On the other hand with smaller output image/print sizes a close-up lens MAY result in a more practical working distance and thus improve the resulting photograph.

Maximum magnification in the standard macro range may occur at an intermediate focal length which also happens to increase working distance. It does on my z612.

The following URL show a macro comparison between a Kodak Z712 and a Canon S5 which illustrates the magnification available with the S3/S5 without any add-ons.

http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.p...2118&ph=16

The attached photo of a relatively small rose bloom was taken without any add-on or even in macro range.


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Old Nov 1, 2007, 1:54 AM   #9
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ac.smith wrote:
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sebastianr wrote:
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If someone still, for some reason, believes the supermacro of the S3/S5/similar is really great and closeup-lenses aren't needed,
Are we by chance talking apples and oranges here. A close-up lens is a simple magnifying lens rated in diopters, +1, +2, +3 and +10 are commonly available. There are also two variable spaced element lenses that offer +1 through +10 diopters (and maybe additional movement to provide wide-angle capabilities as well.

Adding an additional lens is unlikely to increase sharpness if that image magnification is within the focus range of the unaided lens. On the other hand with smaller output image/print sizes a close-up lens MAY result in a more practical working distance and thus improve the resulting photograph.

Maximum magnification in the standard macro range may occur at an intermediate focal length which also happens to increase working distance. It does on my z612.

The following URL show a macro comparison between a Kodak Z712 and a Canon S5 which illustrates the magnification available with the S3/S5 without any add-ons.

http://www.digitalversus.com/duels.p...2118&ph=16

The attached photo of a relatively small rose bloom was taken without any add-on or even in macro range.

Oh please, did you check my photos on my page?
There ought to ring a bell somewhere if you did, and compared to maybe your own supermacros from 1cm or 1mm or even straight on the front-lens as the S3/S5 is capable of.

I promise you, adding a achromatic closeup-lens does so many good things to the quality of the pictures. I dont know how you could even believe something else.
The S3/S5 delivers horrible macros at supermacro, really horrible.
Blurry corners cause the extreme wideangle, extreme distortions due to wideangle, extreme chromatic abberation, and all your shots get very messy backgrounds cause of the wideangle and long DOF. To top that you also block all light when you get close, yet again the wideangle supermacro is to blame since you need to be so close to get something you would call a macroshot.

Guess what?
A achromatic closeup-lens solves ALL these things.
Blurry corners are almost eliminated due to more tele and double correcting lenses.
Distortions are almost completely eliminated, due to shooting with more tele.
Chromatic abberation are really limited due to the double correcting lenses.
The backgrounds all of a sudden look like DSLR-shots, cause the longer tele.
And, you no longer shadow your subjects, since you shoot from a distance.

I dont know which of these things you dont get?

EDIT: Here are two full frames (no cropping) showing the barreldistortions being eliminated by the closeup-lens. Also the bottom one has extreme corner softness, while the Raynox-shot at top are sharp almost all the way out.
Going even closer with the S3 alone, if it were possible without blocking even more of the light, would show even more distortions of course, but I think you get the point by this example anyway.
If the top Raynox-shot looks less sharp, its just cause its taken with maximum magnification and showing all the paper fibers, and viewing paper this close the lines aren't that sharp anymore

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Old Nov 1, 2007, 2:36 AM   #10
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slmulkey wrote:
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Wow, those are some great shots. I especially love the one on of the ant drinking water. Appreciate the advice, I will think about getting the 150 instead. I may also get a monopod as I tried shooting with a tripod and it was really not working for me.
Its not water, he/she is drinking juice
Glad you like my pics, and glad I could help you.
A monopod might be good as you say. I dont have any, I lean onto what I can find for macros, like my foot or knee or on the ground and so on, but a monopod is probably the best.
Have a tripod though of course, but thats no good for macros this close.
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