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Old Apr 21, 2007, 1:59 PM   #11
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Wow . . for a moment there I thought you were Peter from Olympic S/S, trying to make me look like a dill.
Your comments do however highlight a liitle know fact which has perpetuated a lie since Multimeters were invented . . at least those that can read DCmA. That lie is, that they can not read battery condition. This meaning that Battery Testers have a life all of their own. Guess again.
Your assertion that by using the meter in DCmA mode across a battery will apply a dead short, is simply untrue.
This can be proven simply by putting the meter between a battery and a suitable globe. The globe will not light. Now connect the globe to the battery and try 'shorting' the battery with the meter. Sure you can see a very slight dimming of the globe, since obviously some power must be consumed in the process.
NO SHORT OCCURS.
I have used the following method for years on all my button batteries, rechargeables, through to my 9v batteries.
I use a Micronta Digital Multimeter. Set the 2 switches to: 2000 K Ohm and DCmA.
The reading from the batteries will vary according to type, but if you read a new battery or fully charged battery and note the reading, you can pretty soon get to know what the condition is of each one you test. This is a much better method than most battery testers, as you have an actual number to work on.
Anyway, in an effort to keep peace and harmony, I bear no ill will and trust you have a happy life using my method for testing YOUR batteries from now on.
(If you happen to destroy your cells or blow your meter, I'll be in Kakadu for the next 18 months).

By the way, in regard to the ENELOOP batteries. So far they have proven to be magic.
The big difference is that they hold the voltage longer so that the device does not shut down when it senses a low voltage, thus allowing you to more fully deplete the cell. I have given them a pretty solid workout on a couple of sessions, and where the Sanyo HR6 2500, even when they were OK, would have 'karked it' these 'little beauties' have kept going - and they have less capacity! 'CRIKEY!'
(with fond memories of Steve Irwin)
Cheers
Esra - South Australia
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Old Apr 21, 2007, 2:43 PM   #12
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I've had excellent service from a lot of Sanyo cells, including 2500s, but I fail to see any value in the high current storage cells anymore.

The only way a 2850 mAh cell will out perfrom a 2000 mAh Eneloop is if the 2850 is entirely used in the first few days after charging. To make matters worse, it seems like the higher the current hour rating, the more quickly the cells self-discharge.

Picking up a device that hasn't been used in a month to find that it will only operate a very short time before running out of power is a frustration that is no longer necessary.
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Old Apr 22, 2007, 9:05 AM   #13
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Hello Tom,

Just ran some tests comparing Sanyo 2700 mAh cells with Eneloop 2000 mAh cells. The capacity difference equalized after 53 days.

This means that if you are using 2700 mAh cells, you will get the same number of shots as using Eneloop 2000 mAh cells after the camera has been 53 days in room temperature storage. If you use your camera before then, the 2700 mAh cells will give you more shots.

The Eneloop cells are great for the casual user, but the high capacity cells are the way to go for power users.

Tom
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Old Apr 22, 2007, 12:52 PM   #14
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SilverFoxCPF wrote:
Quote:
Hello Tom,

Just ran some tests comparing Sanyo 2700 mAh cells with Eneloop 2000 mAh cells. The capacity difference equalized after 53 days.

[snip]


Tom
Thanks, Tom. Very interesting.

My Energizer 2500s would be flat after 53 days. I'm pretty sure my Sanyo 2500s would be too. Has Sanyo improved the storage longevity of their non-Eneloop cells?

I replaced the Sanyo 2500s in my Mag85 with Eneloops because of the inconvenience of topping it up before use. It seems to be OK, perhaps even for a week, but after that it is noticeably dim.

If the new Sanyo 2700s have better shelf life than previous generations, I will look at gettig a set.

I see you've updated the NiMH Battery Shootout thread since I've last seen it. Thank you very much for the outstanding work you do.

I use Eneloops in a Pentax K100D. A new but broken in set of Energizer 2500s will allow me to shoot about 750~800 shots if taken in the first two days. Eneloops will power my camera to 500~550 shots (taken in the first two days).

Please note that I leave my camera on all the time when I'm shooting. It will auto power-off after a couple of minutes of idle time but I do not touch the on/off button when I'm out walking around on a photography junket. The actual amount of camera on time would be difficult to compare.

In the time I've had it, I've never let my camera sit for long periods. The least number of shots I've gotten out of a charge on the Energizer 2500s is 350 shots over a period of 2 weeks. I'm only on the third charge cycle of the Eneloops. I know they came out of the charger 15 days ago, they have 400 shots on them, and they are still shooting fine.

The low cutoff voltage threshold of the Pentax K100D is well above 3.6 volts. In fact, it's well above 4 volts. I would suggest this will cause the cells to compare differently than testing to a 1 volt cutoff per cell and that this difference will be in favor of the Eneloops.


For what it's worth, the Energizer 2500s test at 2.50 Ah and the Eneloops test at 2.08 Ah on my La Crosse BC-900.
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Old Apr 22, 2007, 5:58 PM   #15
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Hello Tom,

The information I gave is for healthy cells. "Crap" cells will not perform nearly as well.

I just tested some healthy Sanyo 2500 cells that had been in storage for a month. They came out at 82% of their initial charge.

The problem with the higher capacity cells is that they are more fragile. You have to take better care of them. If you have a bad charger, or bad charging or use habits, it is easy to damage them.

I still haven't been able to figure out why some of the 2500 mAh cells work fine, and others self discharge in as little as 10 days. It seems like there is always something to try to figure out... :-)

Tom
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Old May 2, 2007, 3:16 PM   #16
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Eneloops vs the world:

Info Thread:

http://forums.groundspeak.com/GC/index.php?showtopic=160997&hl=ENELOOP

Reviews:

http://www.epinions.com/content_309637189252

Comparison charts:

http://www.users.on.net/%7Emhains/Reviews.html

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Old Mar 4, 2010, 8:34 PM   #17
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Default re eneloop AAs on ebay

Hello All .Thanks to esra for posting his experiences !
I'm familiar with Olympics and travel across Adelaide to buy hard to get batteries from them .I have had no bad experience to date (just purchased replacement house alarm battery DS $95 ,Olympic's Chinese equivalent :$27.)
I was impressed with their info on Eneloop but decided to buy on the net .I ordered 4 AAAs from seller POSEHIN . for $12 USD (about $15 aud altogether inc shipping) they are stamped made in Japan and appear totally genuine.
The guy went and sent AAs instead .I emailed him and he told me to keep them and was sending the 4 AAA's I'd originally ordered (very impressed).The 2000mah AA'S I'm using in my Olympus now straight out of the packet and are working fine .
I guess with Paypal there is always an opportunity to try a charge back if they fail within 45 days so I'm reasonably comfortable.I know Paypal and Ebay always favours buyers (I have the seller battle scars to prove it)
I will advise of any events
Dave
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Old Mar 12, 2010, 10:44 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dnas View Post
So what you did is you tested them on the mA scale on your multimeter??

Do you know that this puts an almost DEAD SHORT CIRCUIT on the battery?? That means you can actually DAMAGE the battery, if that is what you did.
Just ran across this post. The mA scales have calibrated resistance for each scale, with the resistance smaller for higher scales. If the meter has a 10A or 20A scale, the resistance is just a piece of wire, so, in that case you would be correct. For the lower scales, the resistance is higher.

The difficulty with measureing current this way, is that what you are actually measuring is the voltage drop across the resistance. If the voltage of the source is less than the votage drop at full current, the reading will not be accurate, and this is the major reason you can't test batteries with M/M.

brian
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