Go Back   Steve's Digicams Forums > Digicam Help > Batteries or Power Packs

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old Jan 7, 2009, 12:19 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
Alan T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chester, UK
Posts: 2,980
Default

I had my first disappointment with low self-discharge cells this Christmas.

Daughter got an excellent new Rollei 'XS-10 inTouch' camera (with Li-ion) freeing her to return her old one (a 2003 Jenoptik) to my wife, with whom she had been supposed to share it. (In fact it went to university and on several globe-trotting backpacking trips, and my wife hardly saw it.)

I reviewed the state of Ni-MH play in (a) the Jenoptik, (b)my son's Sanyo S4, and my own last-but-two digicam (Casio QV-5700). All had been issued with Uniross 'Hybrio' low self-discharge 2100mAh AA cells, two each in son's & daughter's, and four in my Casio, as presents last Christmas (2007, a year ago). All these cameras were used only occasionally, at holiday times, or in the case of my Casio when I wanted to sync an external flashgun, or use 5-step bracketing for some reason (both missing from successor cameras of mine).

'Hybrid' batteries therefore seemed a good choice, to be ready for instant action , but maintain date & time and anypreferred settings, after months.

Maybe so, but not, I discovered, after a year. My Casio was stone dead. I can't remember how often I'd switched it on in the intervening year; probably only once or twice. One of the Hybrios wouldn't accept a recharge. I had great trouble resurrecting the camera at all, and it still wouldn'tstart with a fully-charged set of standard Ni-MH cells. It did come back to life with aset of brand new alkaline AAs, which I'll now leave in, I think.

Son's Sanyo's Hybrio batteries were flat, but accepted recharge. Daughter's had been used & recharged more frequently.

So the moral to the tale is that low-self-discharge cells are good & useful, but don't don't expect miracles, as I unwittingly did through forgetfulness. I should have stored these cameras without batteries at all, and put up with any necessary reprogramming.

Good luck to all!
Alan T is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Old Jan 7, 2009, 8:47 PM   #2
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 203
Default

1. I don't know that the Hybrio cells are in the same league of eneloop cells. If they're like the Rayovac Hybrids, they have a higher self-discharge rate than the eneloop cells.

2. I had a similar experience a few weeks ago. I have an old 3 MP Sony CyberShot digicam. Pulled it out of the drawer and after about 30 sec. the low batter indicator flashed. This cam had 2 eneloops that had been fully charged and had been sitting for about a year without being used. I was able to charge up the cells without incident, but they were fully drained.

The best conclusion that I could come to was these cells were drained keeping the internal battery in the camera charged. The one that maintains the date/time without batteries being present. Again, its the only possibility I can think of.

I did purchase a couple sets of Hybrid cells a couple years back but quickly retired them in favor of eneloop cells.

So, if you had the same case as mine, with an internal backup battery, coupled with the fact that the Hybrio batteries are in the same league as, or are the same cells as, the Rayovac hybrids, I could understand that.

I would be curious to see if a charger such as the MH-C204W could put life back into the cell that wouldn't take a charge. Hard to tell, but it could have dropped below 1V for quite a bit of time, thus damaging the cell.

A couple sets of Maha Imedion cells arrived today, I'll be curious how they perform in comparison to the eneloop cells.
coppertrail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 7, 2009, 9:03 PM   #3
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 1,870
Default

I think all of the low self-discharge battery claims are based on storage without a load on them. Put a parasitic load on them, and they are probably only marginally better than regular NiMH cells. I remember reading an article some time ago, that discussed the failure of digicam internal batteries, and the load it puts on external batteries. Some cameras are worse than others, but the bottom line was, if you're going to store a camera for a period of time, you're better off keeping alkaline or lithium cells in it...especially older cameras

Reading this thread made me pull out my old camera, which has been sitting for around 6 months with Eneloops in it. The batteries were still operational.

the Hun

rinniethehun is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 7, 2009, 9:08 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 203
Default

Very well put. If the internal battery continues to exert a load on the AA cells while in the camera, that can be very bad news for the cells.
coppertrail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 8, 2009, 3:32 AM   #5
Senior Member
 
Alan T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chester, UK
Posts: 2,980
Default

coppertrail wrote:
Quote:
...If the internal battery continues to exert a load on the AA cells...
Yes, but I wrongly expected it to be a trivial load, relative to the self-discharge rate.

Clearly, primary Li AAsare a much better bet for 6+months' storage, but at a horribly high cost! I think I'll just leave these cameras empty.
Alan T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 8, 2009, 8:22 AM   #6
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 203
Default

I agree, it's not a strong load, but the problem occurs if the cells hit 1V and the load from the internal battery continues. I saw a similar situation where someone put LSD cells in a weather radio and it drained them down pretty bad. Agreed, primaries are the way to go for long term storage for digicams with internal batteries.
coppertrail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 8, 2009, 12:08 PM   #7
Senior Member
 
Alan T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chester, UK
Posts: 2,980
Default

coppertrail wrote:
Quote:
... Agreed, primaries are the way to go for long term storage for digicams with internal batteries.
Thanks for the confirmation that I'm not making another mistake (provided I don't forget about them altogether, yet again)!
Alan T is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Jan 8, 2009, 12:28 PM   #8
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 203
Default

I put the eneloops back in my old sony cam, but I plan to check them with a ZTS tester every 3 mo or so. Actually, it might be good for them, a steady drain that keeps them healthy. The trick is to remember to test/charge them every 3 mo.
coppertrail is offline   Reply With Quote
 
Reply


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 9:24 PM.