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Old May 23, 2006, 11:56 PM   #1
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Hello all, this is my first post and I like to say I find this site very informative, thanks.

Here's my rant. I have about 3 dozen Energizers NiMH mostly AA and some AAA. I have used them in my Canon A95 for the past 2 years and have taken about 7000 shots. I started with the Canon kit Panasonic charger a BQ-390 Quick Charger which came with 4 2300 mAh Panasonic NiMH's. I have 2 sets of batteries at any one time set aside for use in the Canon A95 camera – the Energizers and the Panasonics.

I also use other sets of Energizers in various flashlights, 2-way radios, a radio and electric toothbrushes. I find the Energizers are fine with these devices, likely due to low current draw.

In my Canon A95 my first 2 sets of energizers – 2300 mAh and 2500 mAh respectively gradually declined from around 250 shots to about 50! Whereas over the same time the Panasonics went from about 240 shots to about 160 shots.

Recently I've purchased a BC-900 charger and I first ran a capacity "TEST" and was surprised to find the 2500 Energizers that were showing good health at about 2.20 Ah capacity which did not make sense since this was the set that had declined from 250 shots to about 50. I then tried to test the self-discharge rate by first running "REFRESH" and let the Energizers sit for 7 days. I checked the remaining capacity using "REFRESH/DISCHARGE" at a current draw of 350 mAh and found that the Energizers had quickly self-discharged with 2 cells having just 25% the capacity – the others 29% and 60% - compared to using the capacity "TEST" on the BC-900 which measures capacity immediately after recharge. This seems to be the common way people have quoted capacities of NiMH batteries however it is not the common way most people actually use their batteries in the real world. I have gleaned from "The Great Battery Shoot out" and I don't believe he bares this out either. Self-discharge rates over time and cycles.


Now on the other hand I had successfully refreshed the Panasonics to about where they were when new! And a recent self-discharge test indicates excellent results ranging from 89% to 95% decline over 5 days. Normal self-discharge rate of typical NiMH's after over 2 years of use and close to 4000 shots.

I don't think I'll buy NiMH Energizers again.
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Old May 24, 2006, 12:14 AM   #2
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You might have caused premature failure by using them in devices not designed for NiMH batteries. As I understand it you can damage them if you discharge them below a certain point. Devices designed for NiMH batteries stop draining the battery and quit at that point. But things like flashlights, radios, electric toothbrushs etc will drain them to where they suffer some degradation of their capacity.


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Old May 24, 2006, 12:31 AM   #3
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It was the sets used in my Canon A95 that gave the poor results. The others are still going strong. I had known not to discharge nickel based rechargeables in flashlights or beyond 1.0 V from the early days of Ni-cad's way back. I have also in my brief time surfing this forum had read others who have complained of a short useful life of the Energizers. Perhaps if others say otherwise I might try another set again since they are so ubiquitous. However I'm leaning towards the Sanyo's I've read so much praise about here.

Thanks anyways.
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Old May 24, 2006, 3:06 PM   #4
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note; I'll add quotes as I come across them.

Ok folks I'll post some quotes from other disappointed users of Energizer NiMH's as I surf.

From this forum;

Quote:
My experience with Energizer is really sucks and it really can't last me long and I have to charge them again. Link
Quote:
I was a fan of Energizer batteries until a couple of months back. The 2500 Energizers I had were only about 6 months old and were already losing their capacity (and that after much TLC). Then I purchased the newest Maha 2500's and they have exceeded any others to date, they last much longer than the Energizers and Sanyos did when they were newer.Sample Link - see 2nd post


From other sources;

Quote:
My Energizer 2300 cells have not done as well. They only have about 80 cycles on them and are showing signs of higher internal resistance. It is interesting to observe that all 8 of my Energizer cells are behaving the same. post #100
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Old May 24, 2006, 7:10 PM   #5
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yawglenn wrote:
Quote:
Hello all, this is my first post and I like to say I find this site very informative, thanks.

Here's my rant. I have about 3 dozen Energizers NiMH mostly AA and some AAA. I have used them in my Canon A95 for the past 2 years and have taken about 7000 shots. I started with the Canon kit Panasonic charger a BQ-390 Quick Charger which came with 4 2300 mAh Panasonic NiMH's. I have 2 sets of batteries at any one time set aside for use in the Canon A95 camera – the Energizers and the Panasonics.

I also use other sets of Energizers in various flashlights, 2-way radios, a radio and electric toothbrushes. I find the Energizers are fine with these devices, likely due to low current draw.

In my Canon A95 my first 2 sets of energizers – 2300 mAh and 2500 mAh respectively gradually declined from around 250 shots to about 50! Whereas over the same time the Panasonics went from about 240 shots to about 160 shots.

Recently I've purchased a BC-900 charger and I first ran a capacity "TEST" and was surprised to find the 2500 Energizers that were showing good health at about 2.20 Ah capacity which did not make sense since this was the set that had declined from 250 shots to about 50. I then tried to test the self-discharge rate by first running "REFRESH" and let the Energizers sit for 7 days. I checked the remaining capacity using "REFRESH/DISCHARGE" at a current draw of 350 mAh and found that the Energizers had quickly self-discharged with 2 cells having just 25% the capacity – the others 29% and 60% - compared to using the capacity "TEST" on the BC-900 which measures capacity immediately after recharge. This seems to be the common way people have quoted capacities of NiMH batteries however it is not the common way most people actually use their batteries in the real world. I have gleaned from "The Great Battery Shoot out" and I don't believe he bares this out either. Self-discharge rates over time and cycles.


Now on the other hand I had successfully refreshed the Panasonics to about where they were when new! And a recent self-discharge test indicates excellent results ranging from 89% to 95% decline over 5 days. Normal self-discharge rate of typical NiMH's after over 2 years of use and close to 4000 shots.

I don't think I'll buy NiMH Energizers again.
My Energizer 2500s give the rated capacity after a charge and they all consistently hold about 2,000mAh after ten days or so of sitting around at 500mA test current., also using the BC-900
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Old May 25, 2006, 12:48 AM   #6
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Quote:
My Energizer 2500s give the rated capacity after a charge and they all consistently hold about 2,000mAh after ten days or so of sitting around at 500mA test current., also using the BC-900

How did you determine you had 2,000mAh remaining?

What do you use your Energizers for and how long and how many cycles?
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Old May 25, 2006, 11:16 AM   #7
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Currently I'm still pairing my 2 ½ year old Panasonic 2300's with my current and 3[sup]rd[/sup] set of Energizer 2500 which I bought a few months ago and had ran 4 cycles until I got the BC-900 and initially ran "TEST" and got



2.42, 2.35, 2.41 and 2.41 Ah at 700/350 mAh.

After 20 days sitting I got

977, 1801, 1850 and 1825 capacity remaining

so I "REFRESH" the first cell and after 3 cycles it stopped at 2.32 mAh. I'm currently using them in my Canon A95 and will report on them when the camera indicates batteries low. I normally take between a week and a month before I switch sets.
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Old May 25, 2006, 11:41 PM   #8
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yawglenn wrote:
Quote:
Currently I'm still pairing my 2 ½ year old Panasonic 2300's with my current and 3[sup]rd[/sup] set of Energizer 2500 which I bought a few months ago and had ran 4 cycles until I got the BC-900 and initially ran "TEST" and got



2.42, 2.35, 2.41 and 2.41 Ah at 700/350 mAh.

After 20 days sitting I got

977, 1801, 1850 and 1825 capacity remaining

so I "REFRESH" the first cell and after 3 cycles it stopped at 2.32 mAh. I'm currently using them in my Canon A95 and will report on them when the camera indicates batteries low. I normally take between a week and a month before I switch sets.
For your usage, I would recommend the eneloop, which isn't out yet.
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Old May 26, 2006, 2:12 AM   #9
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Hello Itsme,

It depends on where you are and who you know...

I have been enjoying the Eneloop AA and AAA cells for a couple of months now...

Tom
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Old May 26, 2006, 6:46 AM   #10
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Yes I've heard about them and they sound great for my typical usage despite reduce rated capacity their low self-discharge rates would likely yield me more shots than regular NiMH's with far higher capacity. However since I always carry 2 sets of NiMH's for my Canon A95 and a set of Energizer Lithiums I really won't reap the benefit's of the Eneloop's. The price and availability may further be prohibitive however as I may just buy another brand of NiMH's besides Energizers for now and perhaps try them in the future.

The problem I had with the Energizer NiMH's was a shortened practical life which was glaringly obvious in the self-discharge test I ran on them. Whereas the Panasonics were pretty much like new after being refreshed despite being used 2 1/2 years. BTW I bought them from WalMart, could that have anything to do with it?


I was wondering if the Eneloop's batteries can be charged in any standard charger. Anybody?
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