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Old Jul 15, 2004, 10:37 AM   #11
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Do as dad wants. Go to the DSLR section and read about different lens options. I have the DR and really love it. My favorite lens is the Canon 28-135 USM IS. I added at Tamron 1.4X teleconvert to boost the effective range of the lens to 300mm. This combination has worked well for me. Make dad happy and let him buy the 10D
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Old Jul 15, 2004, 10:41 AM   #12
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gibsonpd3620 wrote:
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Make dad happy and let him buy the 10D
Haha! If that works...?
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Old Jul 15, 2004, 12:33 PM   #13
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I wondered if that was you in your avatar. f5.6 should be able to handle light like that. Faster lenses are always nicer, but it's also more expensive... so I don't blame you if you don't get it.

Chako

First off, the 10D isn't a professional camera. Its more advanced than the DRebel in some ways, but we're not treating her like a pro. I view her as a person who likes to get the shot she wants. Not just something to reinforce her memories, but that great shot that she saw. Maybe I'm wrong?

I would be VERY surprised if you can take 4 pictures with either the 10D or the DRebel and wait "a second" and then be able to take 4 more pictures. In fact, from the year of experience I have with the 10D, you can't do it in the highest level JPG mode (and certainly not RAW mode, but that is expected.) with a 32x card. I just went and did it and it took a bit over 2 seconds to flush the buffers (the write light was still on, but the number of pictures available was 9.) I believe the DRebel has the same data writing sub-system as the 10D. There are faster cards, but they aren't twice as fast. So I could be wrong, but I'd be surprised.

There are many ways that the 10D and DRebel are basically the same. The quality of the picture is the same, that is for sure (same sensor, same metering system, same AF system.)

But I am not a pro and I wouldn't want to take action pictures with out the 9 frames per second. I get better action shots because of it... the shot that I want, damn it!

And finally, I agree with gibsonpd3620, do as dad wants. I wouldn't be surprised if HE wants the 10D, and letting her use it is just helping justify it. :-)

Eric
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Old Jul 15, 2004, 7:17 PM   #14
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Yes, I can take 4 shots, wait a second, take 4 more, till I fill my flash card...I use Sandisk Ultra2s at 256Megs. This is with the DRebel.

I knew I was going to catch flak. I have noted that whenever people ask opinions in these photography forums, you will always get the majority pushing supper expensive equipment left right and center.

I know the 10D is not a professional camera, although you can easily use it for such purposes. Heck, you can even use the DRebel as a pro camera. I know of a few localProsthat love the low cost, and superb quality of their pictures from the lowly DRebel. It isn't what you use, it your output that counts folks. The end result is everything with photography. They do use L lenses though, but then it is an investment for them.

Sorry discodudette for the guy comment. I just find that people are always more then willing to brag about their gear, and push expensive equipment which you probably do not need.My point is this. If you find the10D to be a bit pricey, you can go with a DRebel, and probably won't miss the differences, and feel a lot better about the lower price point. L lenses are great, butyou have to ask yourself...do you need lenses that cost more then yourcamera body?

Ultimately, its your money, or your fathers...and whatever you get, I am sure you will like. Ifigure I may as well post a more down to earth opinion on equipment purchase just to be fair and all.
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Old Jul 16, 2004, 12:23 AM   #15
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You must be using some interesting JPG settings with some really compressible scenes. You are using a faster card than me, but it isn't twice as fast (in fact, its only about 130K per second faster.) So I'm sorry, but I have a hard time believing you. Maybe we're testing in a different way?

The Ultra 2 get about 1336K per second with that camera (the 2G version, which is the second fastest card based on Rob Galbraith's tests, the older Ultra 256 is much slower but lets you the bigger number for fun.) My jpg images at the highest setting are around 2MB. So you are claiming that the card is taking 8MB in one second? Now that is a neat trick. Please tell me how you do it! Now, just to be clear, my test was that I took 4 shots in burst mode, released the shutter and then started counting. I stopped counting when the count went back up to 9. Note that that doesn't mean that all 4 pictures were written to the CF card, just that there was enough buffer memory to hold 9 shots. Maybe we are testing in a different way?

But let me get to my real point. I think that you are badly misrepresenting what has been said in this thread.

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...you will always get the majority pushing supper expensive equipment left right and center.
I'm sorry, but the 75-300 certainly does not quality for that statement to me. The 10D certainly isn't cheap, but for some things it is better. "Super expensive equipment" is if we suggested she buy a used 1D. It would be perfect for what she does (not what her father does, though) but you didn't see anyone suggest it. But people's definition of "super expensive" differs. For you it might be $415 (which is what that lens sells for new.) And, in fact, the 28-135 that was listed is cheaper by about 30 bucks.

You'll also notice that we didn't suggest a better lens, like say the 100-400L (now that is an expensive lens at almost $1400.) It would fit her needs very nicely, but we didn't suggest it. The benefits of better lenses were mentioned, but no one said "No, you should buy this L lens!" And when L lenses were mentioned it was said "if you can afford it" That doesn't sound like "pushing" that sounds like "mentioning" to me... but we're different people with different definitions. And the person who talked about the more expensive f2.8 lenses brought up non Cannon lenses, which would save her money over the Canon ones if she chose to get a faster lens!

And let's get to that statement about us recommending "L" lenses. Not only did no one recommend one specifically, the one that she suggested and that we agreed would do the job isn't an L lens. See for yourself:
http://consumer.usa.canon.com/ir/con...0&modelid=7342

The other lens that was recommended was the 28-135, which isn't an L either:
http://consumer.usa.canon.com/ir/con...9&modelid=7337

As to your statement about "Pro" equipment I guess I just have to disagree. The 10D is a good camera, but it isn't a "Pro" camera. It isn't sold or marketed that way by Canon and while it can be used by a Pro, that doesn't make it a "Pro" camera. It makes it a device used by a Pro. Just as an artist can paint a master piece with a kids watercolor set, that doesn't mean Pearl is going to start selling kid's water color paint as "Pro" paints. We could digress into my definition of a "Pro" camera, but that seems to be way off topic.

Maybe we have a different view on things, but I think your characterization of this portion of the web and us posters in this thread was waaayyy incorrect.

Where we do agree is that the kit lens on the DRebel is fairly good, and a cheap way to get wide angle (which doesn't seem to matter to much to her, based on her listed uses.) And the lack of flexibility with the focusing modes; personally, that would drive me nuts. Some get used to it, I don't believe I would.

I don't think she would be very unhappy with the DRebel but I also think that the differences with the 10D are worth the extra money.

Eric
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Old Jul 16, 2004, 1:56 AM   #16
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Chako wrote:
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Yes, I can take 4 shots, wait a second, take 4 more, till I fill my flash card...I use Sandisk Ultra2s at 256Megs. This is with the DRebel.

The thing is... A good barrel race will last 16 seconds tops. That doen't really give me much time to get as many pics as a 9 seconds burst would. And some other events a 9 second burst will take up the whole event.



Kex- thanks for the correction about me being a female!

Thanks for your help everyone! I think I will get the 10D because I relaly think the 9 burst will outdo the 4. About the lens... when you guys speak about it lol it's basically a foreign language!!
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Old Jul 16, 2004, 2:13 AM   #17
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Whatever you get will be the right camera because you have an agenda and a goal. And you "want" to reach it. I look forward to seeing you future great photos discodudette. Action faction!
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Old Jul 16, 2004, 2:31 AM   #18
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hah WOOOO HOOO action!! lol! They will all just be fun pictures and I will really enjoy taking every single one of them... I promise!
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Old Jul 16, 2004, 4:15 AM   #19
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What everything really boils down to is the green stuff. what are you or your dad willing to spend and and what are you looking to get out of it. When I decided to get the Rebel or the D10 it was the cost that changed things due to my budget and need.

Before selecting the camera how many shots per race are you going to take? 5,10,15,20? Next how many races are you going to take photos of? 10,20 or more? Are you going to take pictures of the horses before/after the races? What size do you want them at? all this is far more important than the camera the best cameras are limited by memory and its lenses. If your going to be taking more than 100 shot a 1GB card is a must, and if your going to be taking more than 250 a 2 GB card then is a must. I took almost 100 shots in a park in 3 hours relaxing and learning and 6 miles of hiking, I cant imagine a sporting event where there is tons of fast pased action using a burst mode of 9 shots every few minutes. :? thats a lot of photos. so you are going to need a good ammount of memory.

Next is the lens if you going to be doing horse photos I am going to assume you are going to take pictures of horses in stables at some time, and there flashes are a no no. so you will need a few really good lenses. I noticed you said you were lost with lenses and I was until recently So I will try to explain.

The F things that the guys refer to with the lens is basicly the rating for how much light the lens can let in. Think of it like a hose water flows thru the bigger the hose the more water that flow thru it. So a F5.6 would be like a straw, where the F2.0 would be a garden hose. So what does it matter? well with the higher number after the F like a 5.6 the shutter speed has to be slower to get all the light the camera needs and in a jump on a dark cloudly day that can lead to a blured picture and that would ruin the whole point of taking the picture in the first place.

So to get shots in dark spots like barns, bad weather without a flash your going to need a lens with a nice F stop rating, the thing is with very open lenses like the F2 lenses may lose depth, but you can can always stop down a lens making it take more time to gather light.

Now the mm is pretty simple basicly its the zoom the higher the number the closer you can get to the subject the thing is some lens lose F stops(the ammount of light it can let travel thru it) when zooming, others dont. Also some lenses are fixed and they give you better quality, but then you cant adjust how close or how far away the object is that your taking a picture. Meaning you may miss something around the target or what your trying to get is much smaller than you wanted and you will lose detail on what you were trying to get. For prices you can spend $100's to $1000's for lenses so that another thing to think about.

I know its a bit overwhelming at first I was there but keep asking questions and you will get it all down and be ready to make a good buy that will be the best for you
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Old Jul 16, 2004, 5:15 AM   #20
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Okay I just was playing Halo, using a sniper rifel and thought of something if she is going to be using a lens that isnt fixed she is going to have to move the camera, adjust the zoom, let it focus, and take the shotss all perfectly tracking a horse running like mad that may take a wide turn, or anything around 3 barrels in 16 second. I dont think that a 4 or 8 shot buffer is an issue but rather being able to get 4-6 good shots in that are focused, and well composed is. What do you guys think? Just by the math you can get at least 10 shots with the rebel and 16 with the D10 but how many of you guy can perfectly compose 10 shots in a row(much less 16) less that 1 second apart with the object moving to you and away from you. It would be like using the D10 in an uzzi style rather that a camera.

I would bet that you would get more joy and much better images using it in a more focused composed way find the points you can get to quicly compose the shot, let the camera focus and get it rather than praying that you get one good shot trying to follow a horse in a triangle path.
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