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Old Feb 15, 2005, 2:00 AM   #1
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Please help.... If I set my Canon 10D to P mode and up the ISO to 1600
and shoot with a speedlite flash, would this work? When I set the camera in sports mode I get photos that are alittle fuzzy. (ISO is 400 in this mode)

Thanks for your input.

lisa
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 8:40 AM   #2
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I'm assuming you're talking indoor (gymnasium) shots. I don't have a 10D, but have the 20D. I shoot ISO1600, Av mode (apeture priority) and open the apeture as far as I can (I have a 50/f1.4 and a 70-200/f2.8 lens), and no flash. Then I usually get around 1/250th shutter speeds, good enough to freeze action (mostly). Problem is, big apetures like f2.8 and larger have such a narrow depth of field that players even just behind the one in focus will not be in focus.

I've chosen to do my sports photography w/o flash. That which I've done with flash (on camera Speedlite 580EX) still resulted in redeye, harsh shadows (undoubtedly because the room itself is so poorly lit) and does not permit me to shoot full speed (5fps on the 20D), not to mention the distraction to the players.

This example was taken with my 50mm/f1.4 lens, at f1.4 and ISO1600. With that combination, I was able to get 1/250th for this shot. The full picture is pretty grainy, but I've not done any post processing (and I've heard there are some really good grain-removal programs out there). Yeah, I shoulda used a custom white balance, too, but I'm still learning to remember those things! :idea:

-- Mitch

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Old Feb 15, 2005, 9:14 AM   #3
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Mitch offers some sound advice. I shoot indoors sports, mainly gymnastics where it is a very strict NO FLASH policy. As such my only option was to buy a couple of fast lenses. My main work horse lens is a Sigma 70-200 f2.8 EX HSM. I love this lens! :G With my Digital Rebel I would shoot in Av mode at f2.8 and ISO1600.

Mitch, that's a good shot. Ok, i know you didn't ask for advices but here's a couple of pointers.

1) Don't be afraid of ISO3200. They will clean up nicely with a program like Neat Image. I'm getting stunning results on prints as large as 13 X 19.

2) Don't shoot JPG... Shoot RAW. I recently decided to shoot strictly RAW. I will never shoot JPG again! LOL! Of course I had to go out and buy a another couple GB of CF cards...

3) I don't know what photo editor you're using but I was using the include PhotoShop Elements 2.0 and upgrade to 3.0. 3.0 has a RAW convertor that is really great to use. This is one of the main reasons from my switch to RAW. I'm getting much better colors and exposures.

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Old Feb 15, 2005, 9:26 AM   #4
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lisa_suzuki wrote:
Quote:
Please help.... If I set my Canon 10D to P mode and up the ISO to 1600
and shoot with a speedlite flash, would this work? When I set the camera in sports mode I get photos that are alittle fuzzy. (ISO is 400 in this mode)

Thanks for your input.
If you are allowed to use an external flash -> you can then close the aperture down and get more DOF for multiple players

The color balance is not so much a problem anymore if the illumination is predominently coming from the flash (balanced for daylight) the off-color is coming from the 'gym' light fill and can be tuned out with combination of faster shutter speed and smaller aperture...
Also the flash pulse by itself can 'freeze' all motion -> the blurring is caused by slower shutter speed resulting from the 'Gym' ambient light!

This is how the pro's do it: :-) http://www.daveblackphotography.com/...a-lighting.htm
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 9:38 AM   #5
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Mr_Saginaw wrote:
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Mitch, that's a good shot. Ok, i know you didn't ask for advices but here's a couple of pointers.
I'm glad you gave anyway! I always appreciate other users experiences, particularly when they're as helpful and supportive as your posts are.

Quote:
1) Don't be afraid of ISO3200. They will clean up nicely with a program like Neat Image. I'm getting stunning results on prints as large as 13 X 19.
I'm just gonna have to get that ... the full size of this picture is very grainy.

Quote:
2) Don't shoot JPG... Shoot RAW. I recently decided to shoot strictly RAW. I will never shoot JPG again! LOL! Of course I had to go out and buy a another couple GB of CF cards...
Guess I'm gonna have to try that one too. I already have the 2nd 1Gb Flash card, so I'm reasonably set for space. I don't think I've even loaded Canon's software yet.

Quote:
3) I don't know what photo editor you're using but I was using the include PhotoShop Elements 2.0 and upgrade to 3.0. 3.0 has a RAW convertor that is really great to use. This is one of the main reasons from my switch to RAW. I'm getting much better colors and exposures.
I've been trying to learn Paintshop Pro (since it's much less expensive than Photoshop CS). Installed Elements 2.0 (came with the camera) on a PC at work, but haven't used it at home yet.

Again, thanks for all the comments.

-- Mitch
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 11:04 AM   #6
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Just tried Neat Image! That is truly amazing! Will probably end up buying this one.

Thanks!

-- Mitch
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 1:23 PM   #7
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MitchInOmaha wrote:
Quote:
Just tried Neat Image! That is truly amazing! Will probably end up buying this one.

Thanks!

-- Mitch
Yeah, Neat Image is great... I bought the Pro version so I can batch process my files.... usually 100+ at a time. Here is the latest samples of ISO3200. Not a good action pictures but shows you what a cleaned up ISO3200 can look like. :-)





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Old Feb 15, 2005, 6:48 PM   #8
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It will be years before my advice is worth stating that's even 2 cents worth. However, I will share a a comment or two and a photo. I recently purchased a 20D, and I was very disappointed with the results - ok, here's where I begin to show just how much of a novice I am. I thought the 18-55 kit would be all that I needed (still laughing at myself over that one - and I have only had my camera for a month). For what it's worth, my previous digital was a Sony point and shoot - S85 (I think); ok, everyone laughout loud, but I will say that I took some awesome photos (mostly stills) with that camera. Most these were of my kids; so, yes I am biased about the appearance of these photos. However, I enlarged some to 16x20 and I was very impressed with the results. Now, back to the 20D Kit - I really thought that I had made a big mistake (the camera purchase); I mean I really felt sick about it - one of the reasons that I had purchased the 20D was for the 5 fps for gymnastics and basketball (indoors, fast action, poor lighting and no flash). I read several articles and decided that I should try the Canon 85/1.8 - WOW! Finally, I began to use my camera and enjoy it. I still don't know enough to use it properly, but I at least I get a good picture every now and then. I would like to have the Canon 70-200/2.8 L with IS, but I can't spend that kind of money for my hobby. I liked the 85/1.8 so much that I decided I need something else with zoom capabilities, but again, I didn't feel that I could justify the Canon 24-70/2.8 L. So, I decided to try a Tamron 28-75/2.8 - it should arrive tomorrow. All of that to say this, after I purchased the 85/1.8 (~$400) and began shooting 1600 ISO and Tv 1/400 - 1/500 (~f/2), I am very pleased. The attached photo was taken as a JPEG with NO ENHANCEMENTS - one day, I will probably shoot RAW and take another step. So, for this beginner, it was all about the lens, ISO and shutter speed - now, if I could get that 1.8 to focus where I want it...
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 6:51 PM   #9
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Here's one other photo from the girls game.
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Old Feb 15, 2005, 7:20 PM   #10
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Those are nice shots, crab. You're well on your way.

I've got both the Tamron 28-75 f2.8 and the Sigma 70-200 f.28. Both are great lens!

Next thing on your list... Get the Battery Grip. 99.9% of my gymnastics and Basketball shot are vertical.

Then start saving for the 70-200! :lol:
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