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Old Mar 12, 2005, 6:41 AM   #11
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sjms wrote:
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... the above image is with IS on
Yeap - but the flash is also ON !!!

Full EXIF Info
Date/Time 29-Jan-2005 19:59:38
Make Canon
Model Canon EOS-1D Mark II
Flash Used Yes
Focal Length 70 mm
Exposure Time 1/125 sec
Aperture f/5.6
ISO Equivalent 1000


The flash 'freezes' the action here and not the IS. Check the rest of the picture with the same 'ambient' light - underexposed because they are out of the flash range... You could 'freeze' the same shot with 1/60s and even had more DOF with smaller aperture still since the light came principally from the flash (see the brighter foreground effect from the flash between the camera and the wrestlers?)!!!
http://www.acdsystems.com/English/Co...2003-09-13.htm

-> There no need for IS when a flash is used - turn it off and you won't see a difference :idea:
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Old Mar 12, 2005, 3:47 PM   #12
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Keep in mind the type of sports photography you're going to shoot.

If two wrestlers arelocked together on a mat, thenthere isn't much movement going on. You can shoot that at a slow shutter speed and IS will help you there. However, that scenario is very similar to a portrait shot.

If you're shooting an athlete running at 10 mile an hour, or a hockey player skating at 20 mile and hour, or a basketball player making a jump shot, then there's a lot of movement.

In order to freeze the action you would need 1/250th shutter speedor use a "panning technique" that blurs the background but keeps the subject sharp by tracking along with the subject.

I can't see how IS is going to help the situationwhere there's a lot of movement. The problem isn't hand shake, it's how fast the subject is moving.

However, I'm open to comments regarding how IS could help shoot a rapidly moving subject.
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Old Mar 12, 2005, 6:08 PM   #13
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keep in mind that these boys move around like 2 alligators in battle . theres lots of movement there. i shoot for 2 counties newspapers in NJ. football soccer basketball baseball i think i've got an idea how to shoot it. if you shoot wide open with a high speed lens your DOF is very limited. yout chances og blowing the shot are increased considerably.

the idea of the IS is to increase the abulity to creat a usable stable image while you and or yorur subject is in motion. the flash will help but it is just for fill. i can show you the failed shots with the strobe firing too using my 24-70 2.8. still lots of movement.
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Old Mar 12, 2005, 6:20 PM   #14
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SJMS,

I like your alliteration to alligators!

I'm very interested in the 28-135 IS lens, as I'm deciding if I should get that lens or the Tamron 28-75 XR DI which is F2.8 throughout the zoom range.

Do you have examples of shots taken with the image stabilization on/off for comparison purposes with an action shot.?

Maybe I'm a little clueless, but I don't know how the image stabilization will benefit other than minimizing the effect of camera shake.

How does IS help to freeze the action if the subject is moving?



- Terry
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Old Mar 12, 2005, 6:44 PM   #15
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when you choose a subject the is also locks in to it as you track the subject with IS the internal elements move and correct for the minor movememtsand shake from you

style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #000000"a good example is this shot:



style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #000000"or even better go her and look at it larger

http://www.pbase.com/crusader/image/23291403/original

note the girls are in perfect focus. they are running across thr field and i am tracking them handheld a 70-200 f2.8 L IS with a 1.4x extender for a total of 280mm. look at the backround foliage and the funny blur or bokah (i hate that word) as the i move there across sweepiing and yes at my age there is that little tremor too up/down they is due to the IS making up for my lack of smooth pan. distance about 75 yds and its a cropped. this is 30% of the original image. if the IS was off the blur would be smoother

the internal optical elements actually move in unison with my movement on what i have focused on doing its best to stablize that item visually. just as it you and i were to start jumping up and down and just looked straight foward things would blur even in bright daylight. jump up and down with your eyes focused on a point that point wwould remain sharp but you will be aware of movement.

another example is stare at the computer screen from about 12-15 inches and choose a word centered in the images while moving your head up/down the word and those around it are great but peripherial vision shows movement.

lots going on inside that white lens i got. i pretty much have it on all the time except for tripod shots where it can actually detrimental to the image if its running

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Old Mar 12, 2005, 8:50 PM   #16
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sjms,

that's pretty awesome!

I better start pricing that lens!

Terry
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Old Mar 13, 2005, 7:02 AM   #17
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sjms wrote:
Quote:
the internal optical elements actually move in unison with my movement on what i have focused on doing its best to stablize that item visually. just as it you and i were to start jumping up and down and just looked straight foward things would blur even in bright daylight. jump up and down with your eyes focused on a point that point wwould remain sharp but you will be aware of movement.

another example is stare at the computer screen from about 12-15 inches and choose a word centered in the images while moving your head up/down the word and those around it are great but peripherial vision shows movement.
All this is 'awesome' allright but irrelevant - The shutter is closed the whole time :idea:
... imagine doing the above test with your head that sjms suggested with your eyes closed!


This not a video camera:
1. All it does is eat up your battery sooner when you 'shake' the camera
2. The only time IS matter is between when the shutter open and before it closed
3. 1/64s is 'awesome', but at 1/640s which the above image was snapped @ does not prove IS in anyway...

FYI - http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/v...33&forum_id=37


... and this was shot @ 1/250s on a much faster subject - with no IS (the Sigma 120-300 f/2.8 doesn't have any)!
http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/v...c.php?id=30682
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Old Mar 13, 2005, 10:54 AM   #18
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"All this is 'awesome' allright but irrelevant - The shutter is closed the whole time :idea:
... imagine doing the above test with your head that sjms suggested with your eyes closed"

"1. All it does is eat up your battery sooner when you 'shake' the camera
2. The only time IS matter is between when the shutter open and before it closed
3. 1/64s is 'awesome', but at 1/640s which the above image was snapped @ does not prove IS in anyway"

it also matter in the fact that i am running while shooting. i am not a stationary fixed object on the field.

IS is engaged while you are focusing and stops after the shutter is released. you can actually see the engagement while looking through the eyepiece unlike the minolta system in their Dslr.

the IS is operational while the shutter is open. thus maintaining your objective anfd yes it does knock about 20% off the battery. everything has a price. but consider the price of not getting the shot and not getting paid when you are paid by thr image. or getting the shot and getting a little mor then expected.

actually they're real popular for air races (which are held in the desert in broad daylight and are generally shot at high speed. also about 95% of nascar and other races are also shot using IS and VR at high speed. i guess we're just all wrong.

your looking for a something to impress i'm looking for something that works and delivers the shot. you don't like the idea of high speeds. i do. i like a greater DOF when i want it to give a reference of presence. its all a matter of preference. IS in certain situations give you an edge. just another tool. you bandy the word irrelevent around. i don't really think thats wise choice of words. try using it for awhile you might like it.


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Old Mar 13, 2005, 11:08 AM   #19
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Wow, this discussion is getting really hot!

I really think we need to get Mr. Saginaw in this discussion, as he's got his own opinions of IS as well.

Initially my understanding of IS was that it was for people with shaky hands (essentially wussies) however now I'm seeing it has a more technical application as well.

I've heard of people taking great low light pictures (think the foggy streets of Paris at night) using IS.

I wonder if there's any heavy duty technical writeups out on the web about IS?
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Old Mar 13, 2005, 11:13 AM   #20
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also while looking at those nice iso 3200 images i am shooting at considerably lower iso like 1000 indoors and 200 outdoors. i really don't like popcorn with my pictures.

IS on a tripod is not good due to it does like movement and tends to shudder when 0 movement is present . thus causing a less accurate image.
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