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Old Mar 21, 2005, 8:25 PM   #1
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I have the Canon 20d and plan on keeping it. I have although read that the canon 20d gives off "soft" photos and i myself agree totally with that. I have sent my camera back twice to the canon repair shop for adjustments that they call "calibrating the lenses to the body crap" yeah it came back better but i'm sure it was something else. The canon 10d intrigues me because that has the (DIGIC) processor where the canon 20d has the (DIGIC II) processor and ive heard theres less problems with it. The canon 10d is suppose to havecleaner shots opposed to soft shots. I have owned the digital rebel and have much sharper shots than the 20d. I can get a refurbushed 10d with a warranty for $999 and the question i ask all of you is should i????? looking for help. jcarboski
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Old Mar 21, 2005, 9:31 PM   #2
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I owned the 10D for over a year, and the 20D for about 4 months or so. So I know some of what I speak.

What I have found is that while the 20D's images are softer you can sharpen them more than the 10D (which is necessary, 'cause they are softer.) I have found that I can take images that I though were too soft (my 10D experience talking) but after sharpening I'm very happy with the results. And I am a very picky person.

I believe the softness is due to the anti-aliasing filter and not the Digic II processor. Could it be that processor? Yes, I guess. People complained about softness on the 1D MkII (which also has that processor) but that camera can also produce stunning images. Even shooting RAW the images are softer, and the DIGIC II processor has little to do with RAW images.

To me, the question is much more around features. Do you need the faster AF? The faster startup? The higher resoultion? If you saved the money (what, about $500 or so?) what would you use it for? If you spent it on a better lens, that might not be a bad idea. Good glass will last you a really long time.

Personaly, I wouldn't trade down and I'm having problems with the AF in my 20D. I still like it enough to not want to go back.

Eric
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Old Mar 21, 2005, 11:24 PM   #3
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Eric:

Thank you for your advice. Is there any way of managing the anti alising? any adjustments possible?? i'm not to saavy in this department. Thanks jcarboski
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Old Mar 22, 2005, 2:10 AM   #4
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Are you shooting RAW or JPG?

For in-camera JPG shots to give them a boost which will make them look more like a P&S change Parameter 1 and dial in +2 sharpness, +2 contrast, +1 saturation.

It depends a lot on what kind of shooting you do whether RAW or JPG makes more sense. For high-volume shooting where you are very experienced at getting your exposures exactly right and will be doing very little PS manipulation then JPG makes good sense.

For many of us however we take lots of shots but only end up using a small number and are happy to spend some time on them in the "digital darkroom". For that kind of photography RAW is probably a better bet.

http://www.luminous-landscape.com/es...awtruth1.shtml

The 20D is "soft" because of the aggressive anti-moire filter which is a feature of many high-end cameras. The reason for this filter is that once moire is introduced into an image it is essentially impossible to remove. For any kind of fashion or architectural work you may well end up with a significant number of shots with a moire problem.
Imagine doing a photoshoot and every shot of a particular outfit is unusable because of moire. That would really annoy all concerned.

Similarly extra sharpening can easily be dialled in after the shot, but over-sharpened images can be very difficult to fix.

The softness you see from the 20D is a back-handed compliment from Canon. It assumes that if you're buying a semi-pro camera you'll want more control at the expense of less convenience.
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Old Mar 23, 2005, 5:43 PM   #5
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Save yourself $100 - I just bought a refurb 10D from B&HVideo for $849.
and a 2 yr Mack warranty for $60. On B&H's website it says that it is condition "10" but is really a refurb. Got it in the mail yesterday in a Canon box with a refurb sticker...
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Old Mar 30, 2005, 1:22 PM   #6
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Hey Eric,

What kind of focus issues do you have with your 20D? Overall, does it focus better than the 10D?

Barthold
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Old Mar 30, 2005, 8:58 PM   #7
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barthold,
I'm having trouble with focus tracking. The Single Shot is working great, but when I'm tracking a bird in flight it some times shifts to the background. I wondered if it was me (the 20D's AF points are smaller than the 10D, so maybe I'm not as good at focus tracking as I thought?) but then I took this series of shots:
http://esmith.marx7.org/web_posts/20D-tracking1.jpg
http://esmith.marx7.org/web_posts/20D-tracking2.jpg
http://esmith.marx7.org/web_posts/20D-tracking3.jpg
http://esmith.marx7.org/web_posts/20D-tracking4.jpg

See how 1 & 2 & 4 are properly focused on the Great Blue Heron? See how Picture 3 is focused on the background... all the way across the river!!!! This isn't just a little jitter in the AF, it clearly shifted 100+ feet to something else! And the subject is still under the center AF point, which is the only one active.

Drove me nuts, so the 20D is back to Canon for recalibration.

Eric

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Old Mar 31, 2005, 12:43 PM   #8
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Hey Eric,

I see what you mean. I'm sure you checked that the focus point isn't crossing over into any of the background. It is a nice effect you get in picture 3, but I guess that is not what you intended :-)

Is your problem unique, or do others have it too?

Barthold
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