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tim55 Feb 15, 2004 7:08 PM

to dye sub or not to dye sub .......
So my head's spinning,, I've wanted to upgrade my BJC8200 and was all set on the new i960 but then started reading about the Canon CP200. And then the HiTi's. Now I not so sure. Most of my printing is 4x6 or smaller. Although I wanted the option of bigger prints and not to be stuck with just glossy paper. Looks like the new HiTi 730PS might be my answer at least about print size if it's not priced out of sight. But then, I could just get both. The wife had quite a laugh when I suggested it a bit ago.

Any comments would be welcome.


steveJfrank Feb 15, 2004 9:39 PM

If you are looking for the best prints in a 4x6 size the Hi Ti 630 or 640 series is the one. They will beat any ink jets pictures as the Dye Subs are made just for Color Prints. If you are looking for a bigger Dye Sub format look at the Olympus 440 or the Hi Ti 730.
I believe there is a review on this site from Steve for the Olympus. Hope this helps.

dudlew Feb 16, 2004 6:36 PM

steve, have you owned the canon? I have been trying to reach users of this camera for some time but no one responds. Buying the HiTi would have worked out more expensive for me because of my special circumstance in location. (I can only shop through Amazon).

NO ONE TALKS ABOUT THE CANON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I keep hearing HiTi and its driving me crazy!!!!!!!!!!!


And yes I do want to shout... not because I am angry, but just to spark a response about the Canon CP200, which I have seen a few people on this site own but just dont talk about.


tim55 Feb 16, 2004 7:18 PM

dudlew, i saw a cp200 on saturday at a photo shop here. My first impression was it's a toy. And the salesman didn't have much to say about it either. They don't have HitI there or Epson. He thought a P440 Olympus or a i960 Canon would be best for me. Price is a factor. $400+ for a printer is too much for me.

From looking at reviews, specs and here it sure seems the HiTi has it all over the cp200. Although it would be cool to take to it on holidays.


dudlew Feb 17, 2004 4:22 AM

But did you see any prints?

Thats what I want to know.

PRINT QUALITY is very important.

From the reviews I have read between the 630 and the CP200 the quality difference is not big at all, with the 630 having the slight edge. It would be unfair and foolish in my opinion to compare the Canon to the 640 as there is a big price and spec difference. The review on this site actually praises the printer. But there is not much more info on it than the 2 or 3 reviews that I have found.

That is why I would like to hear what the owners say. reviews are not always the best things to go by as I saw with the Canon S50. Some reviewers love it and some, while not hating it, dont recommend it. Yet from user reviews, the general concession is that its a decent camera, some flaws, but that is to be expected.

Anyway enough of my rant. If you have used it and seen the prints from it, let me know your thoughts on it.

In the end, I may buy an R300, but I can make do with what I have now and the Cp200 which I ordered already until that point in time.


steveJfrank Feb 17, 2004 8:25 PM

I would say the canon printer is most likley a good one but have not seen prints from it. The Hi Ti model 630LS cost about 130.00 and produces great pictures seen them.

Greybird Feb 17, 2004 9:52 PM

Hi dudlew
To try and answer you about the Hiti Vs the canon, I have had my 630ps for more than a year, and have had nothing but fine pictures from it. I own A Canon i950 and it prints out grea 8x 10 pics. I have demo'd the Canon dye sub, and the pictures were very good.
But the canon is more expensive, the paper is more expensive. 75 sheets vs 100 for the hiti . I went for Quality and price.
Herb :D

dudlew Feb 18, 2004 10:16 AM

Thank you Greybird.
This is the kind of response I am looking for. At least I know the camera produces good prints, and this is from a user, which I value a bit more than reviews. This is all i have to go by as i cant demo anything where I live.

For me, the HiTi paper would probably work out about the same price or a little more expensive because most sites that will accept my international credit card will charge a shipping fee that nullifies the price advantage. so I could only shop @ Amazon which gives free shipping to the US address I use.


jbruceb Mar 5, 2004 9:03 PM

If most of your printing is 4X6, I would recommend the HiTi PhotoShuttle, which is the fastest HiTi printer at 45 seconds. For larger occasional prints, there are many on-line print services like Ofoto that will do a fine job at reasonable cost.

As far as the supplies, I order the direct from the HiTi store; they often offer 5% off, or free domestic shipping. You would be surprised how small a box holds supplies for 400 prints.

Nicho1as Mar 6, 2004 2:32 AM

Get an Inkjet
I have a feeling this might be a dissenting opinion but here goes:

Get an inkjet. You'll likely be happier. Reasons (in no particular order of importance):

1) Cheaper prints. You can easily beat 40 per 4x6 with an IJ
2) Faster prints. A Canon i960 is faster than the HiTi. I believe the Epson R300 is about the same speed.
3) More detail. In my experience, a modern inkjet can resolve more detail than a dye-sub. This is especially true in high contrast areas.
4) MUCH wider gamut. IJ are capable of producing colors that a dye-sub simply can't. Dye subs tend to have more muted, earthy warm tones that warm tone that work great for some photos. But they don't have the range that an IJ has. An IJ can produce the same colors that a dye-sub can then a whole lot more.
5) Wider range of papers. You have a slew of options with an IJ. Don't like the sheen or thickness on one paper? No problem, you have a dozen others to choose from. Prints fading on a certain paper? No problem, Ilford and Epson have you covered.
6) Profiles. If you don't like the accuracy of your HiTi, or perhaps you are happy most of the time but simply want better, how are you going to profile it? As far as I know you can't. An InkJet will provide you with all the covenience of the HiTi with the ability to really take charge of your colors if you need to.

The ONLY advantage that dye-subs offer IMHO is long print life. I think this is largely negated by choosing the right papers for printing. If you're truly worried you can get an IJ that uses pigment inks and you'll have print life that rivals dye-subs. I often read that dye-sub prints "feel" more like lab prints. I don't believe this to be true. You get the right paper for an IJ and it "feels" every bit as good as a dye-sub. Of course it looks better because of detail and color fidelity.

This is based on my experience with a Olympus P400, an i960 and R300. I've never used a Hi Ti, but I read that they're good devices. I expect them to perform about as well as the Olympus. MacWorld has a review online right now of the Epson R300, Canon i960, Oly P440, Canon i950 and some Lexmark printer. The P440 and the Lexmark do the worst. It's an interesting read.

Hope I helped w/o being too inflamamtory.

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