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Old Aug 2, 2003, 9:13 AM   #1
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Default Minolta 5600 HS (D)

Hi,
I have a Minolta 7i and just purchased a Minolta 5600HS (D) flash unit. The both work fine together except I cannot get the flash unit to operate in the automatic mode. Can anyone shed any light on this. Thanks
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Old Aug 3, 2003, 5:54 AM   #2
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The both work fine together except I cannot get the flash unit to operate in the automatic mode.
They work fine together... that means they are in automatic mode, ie it's in ADI/TTL modes already... :?

Double check the 7i camera setting:
Menu > Basic > Flash Mode > Fill-Flash
Menu > Basic > Flash Control > ADI (or pre-flash TTL)

Do you mean you want to put the camera on manual and set the flash to automatic with the Mode button?
There's no photo sensor on the 5600HS (D)...
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Old Aug 3, 2003, 6:09 PM   #3
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Thank you for the info. I will go to the menu and change the settings and see what happens.
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Old Aug 6, 2003, 10:37 PM   #4
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a) I just got this unit, and I'm not sure that is what he means by "automatic". The flash itself can go into "auto on", or just "on" modes.

The Auto On mode fires if needed. The On always fires (ie - fill flash). My assumptions since the camera flash always fires when up, the 5600 does also, and so can't do Auto On mode. Would love to hear if I have this wrong.

b) The 5600 manual says the AF illuminator on the front of the flash lights in low light/poor contrast. I never see this happen when hooked up to Dimage 7Hi ???? I know the illuminator itself works, as it lights when in wirelees mode (as expected). Should the AF light come on, or is this not to be expected with the 7Hi ???? (neither manual does a good job of describing the two of them together)

c) Can I use the flash (5600) at all shutter speeds, and will it be synch'ed with a 7Hi ???

d) I got the flash for an upcoming wedding. I am hopelessly confused (always hated flash, and just usually never use it). What would my best settings for getting good shots ??? If I set it to f8, will it want to use really long exposures, or does it "know" there is a flash ??? does it end the exposure when the ADI is happy ??? The manual says ADi uses the distance information (to throw the correct amount of light for a certain caera to subject distance, I assume), so it doesn't get fooled but bright spots, etc , like TTL. But then it says it also use pre-flash information. So, confused ???


Can I set the camera to M, f8, 1/500 and let the flash provide enough light (I realize this will reduce the range), but is that my best best chance of getting in focus shots, given the low light AF is not great ???
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Old Aug 7, 2003, 6:03 AM   #5
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The AF illuminator on the 5600HS is not required by the D7's at all. The D7's focus just fine in the dark... and it bothers people, I turn it off even on my 10D dSLR! It is only used during wireless operation to confirm that the remote flash has fired or when the unit is ready to flash as a remote unit (the AF illuminator works just fine when mounted on my 9xi film SLR for example)

1. On the 5600HS (D) unit the On/Off switch does just that. OFF is always off, ie the unit will never turn on. ON means the unit is on, ie it will automatically detect when it will be needed by the camera either mounted on the camera or removed from the bag and inserted in the camera hot-shoes (ie the unit automatically turn off to conserve battery, and back on when required!).

2. The 5600HS (D) has three modes of operation controlled by the MODE switch. Each time you press the MODE, it switches from TTL, M, to Multi. TTL is the flash automatic mode and where you want to keep if you want the camera to control the 5600HS. M is the manual mode where you can select the different ratio of power, and Mullti is the strobocospic effect where you can select both intensity, duration, and the strobe rate.

3. HS on the 5600HS (D) mean High Speed sync and should work at all speeds (at least on their film camera), but I believe with the D7/i/Hi the max is limited to 1/400, but I may be wrong here... D is for DISTANCE integration and not digital BTW, this unit came out before digital cameras. :lol:

4. If you're in Av mode and set the camera to f/8 the camera 'knows' that the flash is ON (ie in step #1) or OFF. If it's ON the camera will go to 1/60 [u]and[/u you should see a flash icon in the EVF (and it flashes when the flash has fired properly). If it's OFF (ie in step #1) the camera will then go to really long exposure and the flash will not fired! BTW Tv mode will let you select the sync speed up to 1/400 max (I believe)

5. "The manual says ADi uses the distance information (to throw the correct amount of light for a certain area to subject distance, I assume), so it doesn't get fooled but bright spots, etc , like TTL." You are correct, and the pre-flash is fired in both ADI or TTL modes since that's how most digital cameras determine their flash exposure.

6. You can set the camera to M, f8, 1/500 and puthe 5600HS to M as in step #2 and use the fractional power in which case you shoul increase the level to 1/1 for max power.

There's a caveat though since this is a WYSIWYG camera the EVF is totally dark @ M, f8, 1/500 (That's what it is, severely underexposed without flash)!
-> You'll need to press both the 'select' and 'i+' to turn the EVF on 'autobrightness' to be able to see... what you're shooting.
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Old Aug 7, 2003, 8:20 AM   #6
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Thanks for the excellent reply, a couple of things:

1) I still think the original poster is questioning the difference between the flash's "Auto On" and "On" modes. The former being a mode (with some cameras I assume) that the flash will fire only when NEEDED for exposure, the later being it ALWAYS fires when on and the shutter is depressed. In one case the display on the 5600 says "Auto On", in the other it only says "On". Neither he, or I, have been able to get the "Auto" icon to light on the 5600 display. I don't think you can with the 7Hi, I think the flash is only able to do the "On" (no "Auto On") mode with the 7Hi. If that is wrong, we don't get it.

3) Still confused. In 5600 TTL mode, S on the 7Hi, I can dial in anything up to 1/2000. Is it not using that shutter speed ? How would I know ? How does HSS effect this ??? Is it necessary to have HSS turned on ??? The camera manual seems to imply (in one wimpy sentence) it isn't with the 7Hi.

5) Still confused. Does it use the distance info from having focus to determine the amount of light to throw, or use the pre-flash? If it is based on distance, why fire the pre-flash ???

6) Is it necessary to put the falsh in M, when the camera is in M ??? Can I put the camera in M, f8, 1/500 and leave the flash in TTL, and let it modulate the light for those camera settings ???

Like I said, I'm confused about this control loop, who's doing what (the flash, tha camera, God) in flash photography ............
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Old Aug 7, 2003, 8:20 AM   #7
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Thanks for the excellent reply, a couple of things:

1) I still think the original poster is questioning the difference between the flash's "Auto On" and "On" modes. The former being a mode (with some cameras I assume) that the flash will fire only when NEEDED for exposure, the later being it ALWAYS fires when on and the shutter is depressed. In one case the display on the 5600 says "Auto On", in the other it only says "On". Neither he, or I, have been able to get the "Auto" icon to light on the 5600 display. I don't think you can with the 7Hi, I think the flash is only able to do the "On" (no "Auto On") mode with the 7Hi. If that is wrong, we don't get it.

3) Still confused. In 5600 TTL mode, S on the 7Hi, I can dial in anything up to 1/2000. Is it not using that shutter speed ? How would I know ? How does HSS effect this ??? Is it necessary to have HSS turned on ??? The camera manual seems to imply (in one wimpy sentence) it isn't with the 7Hi.

5) Still confused. Does it use the distance info from having focus to determine the amount of light to throw, or use the pre-flash? If it is based on distance, why fire the pre-flash ???

6) Is it necessary to put the flash in M, when the camera is in M ??? Can I put the camera in M, f8, 1/500 and leave the flash in TTL, and let it modulate the light for those camera settings ???

Like I said, I'm confused about this control loop, who's doing what (the flash, tha camera, God) in flash photography ............
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Old Aug 7, 2003, 8:43 AM   #8
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1) There's no "Auto On" mode, ie in that you mean it fires only when required. The 5600HS will always fire when you put it on the camera. The only icon you get on the 5600HS to indicate its on auto is TTL, ie the flash is on when the LCD panel lit up, and off otherwise. When off the 5600HS will not fire on the camera.

3) HSS I believe is only applicable to their film camera, their D7's are shutterless (there's a shutter but used for noise reduction in long exposure). I'm unsure on how fast you can go with the shutter on the D7's (I thought there's a max). Can you try?

5) All Through-The-Lens function is done via the pre-flash. The camera also uses this info to set the white balance. ADI modulates the distance info on top of the TTL function... The CCD will be too busy capturing the real exposure in the final shot to control the flash output!

6) When the camera is in M, it's in total manual overide and is uncoupled from the flash just like on any SLR. This is used for studio environment where you want total manual control of your strobes as well... The flash wouldn't know what to do otherwise, it will always go for max, but you'll be under/over exposed depending on the shutter/aperture combination :?
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Old Aug 7, 2003, 9:10 AM   #9
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1) I'm not being difficult (LOL !), but there is an "Auto" icon on the flash itself. I think he just wondered why he couldn't get it to go on. (I wish they had a 5600 AND 7Hi manual .........)

The 5600 manual says:

"AUTO and ON" will appear with automatic flash. Only "ON" will appear with fill-flash.

I assume "automatic flash" is an attribute of some cameras, but not the 7Hi.

I don't mean "auto" in the magic TTL sense.
I don't mean "auto" in that it wakes up from sleep mode when needed.

If you know how to make the AUTO icon go on, I think that is what he was after.

5) White balance - hadn't thought of that, makes sense.

Like I said, I just got the thing last night, still figuring it out.
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Old Aug 7, 2003, 11:03 PM   #10
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This is an EXCELLENT thread - thanks for the questions AND the answers. I'm a Dimage 7 owner contemplating the purchase of a Minolta 3600 HS (D). Do the same features apply to that combo? Thanks!
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