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Old Jun 7, 2002, 12:55 PM   #1
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Default S2 or D100 for less money

Looking at both cameras and the prices it seems like the Nikon D100 will be the better offer.

both use the same body
both use the same glass
both use the same cam focus system

the S2 using the supper ccd offers nothing over up sizing the same file from a D100 in photo shop.

the Nikon has much better support for problems.

the Nikon has a better battery system

the S2 has a firewire but i don't want to use my camera when downloading to my PC i can get a firewire reader for very little money.

the S2 has the PC flash setup that's nice but i can get a flash mod for the top of the D100 for around $50 bucks to do the same thing.

from sample photos some people are saying the S2 photos look better ..but not all that much better and both camera samples are from betas not the real thing.

when printing a 8x10 or 16x20 the difference will be so small no one will be able to see the difference on real photo paper.

The D100 is to be $2000
the S2 either $2500 some say others say still $3500.

either price the S2 is not worth an extra 500 to 1500 more then the D100.

D100 $2000 flash mod $50 firewire reader foe my PC $100 tops
total $2150 all the lens will be the same price for both.

what do you think?????
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Old Jun 7, 2002, 1:12 PM   #2
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I think your ASSUMPTIONS are too soon. Things I really disagree with is your statement about standard batteries for the S2 vs Nikon priority batteries for the D100, Fuji survice?, and you didn't even mention the ISO difference's.
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Old Jun 7, 2002, 9:57 PM   #3
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I do like the D100 but yes, it is way too soon to form even an opinion as we have yet to have even used an S2 prototype.

Hopefully we will have one soon as well as a final production D100 although my current D100 has yet to have exhibited anything but perfect operation and image quality. Stay tuned ...

-Steve
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Old Jun 14, 2002, 4:59 PM   #4
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"the S2 using the supper ccd offers nothing over up sizing the same file from a D100 in photo shop."

Arguable, but maybe true

"the Nikon has much better support for problems. "

They both suck.


"the Nikon has a better battery system"

Maybe, less clumsy, but maybe not better.

"the S2 has a firewire but i don't want to use my camera when downloading to my PC i can get a firewire reader for very little money."

Sure, but another purchase.

"the S2 has the PC flash setup that's nice but i can get a flash mod for the top of the D100 for around $50 bucks to do the same thing. "

One more thing to buy and carry.

"from sample photos some people are saying the S2 photos look better ..but not all that much better and both camera samples are from betas not the real thing."

True, but S1 quality was definitely had great color rendition.

"when printing a 8x10 or 16x20 the difference will be so small no one will be able to see the difference on real photo paper. "

What difference? If you see a difference, then there is a difference. If there is a difference, I'm going for the one I think is superior.

"The D100 is to be $2000
the S2 either $2500 some say others say still $3500. "

The supposed price of the D100 is $2000 + software for ? maybe another $100 or $200. The S2 package is $2400

"either price the S2 is not worth an extra 500 to 1500 more then the D100. "

It's not even $500 by the time you get through.

"D100 $2000 flash mod $50 firewire reader foe my PC $100 tops
total $2150 all the lens will be the same price for both."

Yes, $2150 plus Nikon software vs. $2400, the difference will be less than $100.

what do you think?????

I think that for less than a couple of hundred bucks I will choose the one that I think produces a better image. I want the quality. I don't buy $150 lenses either.

I've seen the D100 beta images. I was disappointed. We are all clueless about the S2, but it could possibly outshine the D100 by a wide margin.

This from a guy who has a D100 on order.
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Old Jul 9, 2002, 7:29 PM   #5
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Default Tokina AT-X 242 AF 24-200mm f/3.5 - 5.6

Hi Steve and all,
Have you seen and used the above zoom len before?
What do you think about it other than the weight? as i am in tight budget of getting a good zoom lens for my fuji s2 pro digicam and i am pretty new to SLRs.

Hope you guys could help me here.

yowsiang
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Old Jul 19, 2002, 4:28 PM   #6
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Default D100 or S2

Here in the UK the D100 has had it's first review. Nikon have pushed the boat out on it's hype machine. AP has 2 reviews (I've never seen that before) of this camera. Thing is, it not done very well. I respect the view of this mag and suspect they may well be right.

The issues they have is picture quality, well lack of. They were not too happy with the focusing system, as it's slow. I have an F80 and agree it's slower than say F100 and some Pro lens donít focus correctly. This is good in the F80, but for a camera nearly five times as much? I hope Nikon get it right next time round. They review the Canon D60 and it did very well.

I hear that the early F80 quality and bugs were real problems. Don't expect too much from Nikon as outside the Pro market there only average for service and support.

The other issue regarding support for Sigma lens. Will they ALL work? I had issues with a Sigma lens and the F80. Sigmas sorted it out and were very helpful. I will be testing my entire lens first this time.

Regarding bugs. I noticed the Canon have a BIOS update for the D60 to fix a number of issues; I hope this true of the S2 & D100

I am waiting for the S2 and hope it's better.
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Old Jul 23, 2002, 6:44 AM   #7
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I had an email from AP regarding the above bad review. I understand Nikon is not happy and AP are talking about a retest.

Watch this space, i guess and see what happens.




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Old Aug 9, 2002, 6:33 PM   #8
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Default A late addition...

Quote:
Originally posted by photojoe
Looking at both cameras and the prices it seems like the Nikon D100 will be the better offer.

both use the same body
both use the same glass
both use the same cam focus system
Maybe. Although obviously 'better' is subjective.

Quote:
the S2 using the supper ccd offers nothing over up sizing the same file from a D100 in photo shop.
This is simply not true. You can resize using Photoshop to the same pixel dimensions, but you cannot interpolate the SuperCCD's layout using Photoshop at all.

Moving on, the difference between the SuperCCD and the regular designs has been compared to the difference between the Velvia and E100 slide films. If you like Velvia, the SuperCCD is for you (using the thing in its native mode, i.e. 3.3MP for the S1, 6MP for the S2).

Quote:
the Nikon has much better support for problems.
Maybe. Although Nikon is perfectly capable of announcing that your camera will be ready in 6 weeks (as they did with a N90s of mine).

Quote:
the Nikon has a better battery system
No, it has an expensive dedicated pack. You can run the S2 on rechargeable NiMH batteries that will provide a dramatically higher power-per-dollar ratio. Against that, the D100 will work better in cold weather.

What you missed, totally, is the existance of the Nikon vertical grip. That is significant. If you do a lot of portrait-oriented shooting, you'll want this.

Quote:
the S2 has a firewire but i don't want to use my camera when downloading to my PC i can get a firewire reader for very little money.
Ah. And how, exactly, do you suggest you use that reader for shooting?

I use my S1's shooting software in the studio to eliminate the upload part of the shoot-upload-process-print cycle -- you can operate with no memory in the camera. If you don't want it, great, but don't run it down until you've tried it!

Quote:
the S2 has the PC flash setup that's nice but i can get a flash mod for the top of the D100 for around $50 bucks to do the same thing.
If you pay $50, you're being ripped off. I paid $24 for my Nikon AS-thing (AS-11?) for the S1.

Quote:
from sample photos some people are saying the S2 photos look better ..but not all that much better and both camera samples are from betas not the real thing.
Not any more...

Quote:
when printing a 8x10 or 16x20 the difference will be so small no one will be able to see the difference on real photo paper.
Mmmm... nonsense. Particularly when it comes to color issues.

This reminds me of the "comparisons" of slide scanners: products from Polaroid and others were being compared with the Nikon Super Coolscans... and they all fixated on the resolution and color depth. Yet the reason why the Nikon won every objective analysis was its improved Dmax...

Now, the difference between the two cameras will probably be less than the the difference between the scanners... but the 'contest' will be won by personal preference, not analytical specmanship.

Quote:
The D100 is to be $2000
the S2 either $2500 some say others say still $3500.
$2400.

Close enough to $2000 for the matter to be entirely subjective.

Quote:
either price the S2 is not worth an extra 500 to 1500 more then the D100.
TO YOU. If you want to use the camera direct from your PC, you need the S2. If you prefer the SuperCCD's saturation, you need the S2. If you need battery flexibility (e.g. the opportunity to carry lots of charged batteries), you need the S2. If you think having two media slots is valuable (and I do) you'll value that in the S2. If you need a vertical grip... darn, you need the D100!

Quote:
D100 $2000 flash mod $50 firewire reader foe my PC $100 tops
total $2150 all the lens will be the same price for both.

what do you think?????
I think that you're comparing a visual product using only loosely related criteria: the specs.

I spent a lot of time comparing the D1's 2.7MP with the S1's 3.3MP feature, and concluded that I didn't care about the extra resolution, but I fell in love with the SuperCCD's color rendition.

So now its time for a new camera (because I want the AF-S compatibility), Nikon is going to have to beat the S1... and it won't do it on resolution alone!

Malc.
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