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Old Mar 13, 2004, 12:46 AM   #11
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pookiepookie

I am well aware of the definition of a forum. All I wanted was to solocit opinions of those who felt as I do. With a bit of work listneng to what the people want from the camera (namely JPEG variable compression routines) With a firmware update this camera could compete with the CANNON EOS Models costing much more pulling in a market share never enjoyed by fuji
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Old Mar 13, 2004, 1:07 AM   #12
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A fixed lens Fuji S7000 is never going to be competition for a Canon EOS-300D, no matter how much you may want the magic flash to do it.

Fuji already produces the FinePix S2 Pro, a more expensive camera than the 300D, but one that does what you seem to want.


Perhaps you purchased the wrong camera?

A little research prior to your purchase may have helped you to avoid such a distracting "problem".


Post some of your examples, that have you so concerned.
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Old Mar 13, 2004, 5:42 AM   #13
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Hang on - lets not get sidetracked here.

The 7000 does have a compression problem - it does it too much. Fuji have not acknowledged that there is a problem (I also contacted them about this, but before I bought it) and it may well be worth while to collectively petition them to see if they can or will provide an update.

Note that the new S20 has much less compression for its 6Mp Jpeg - so maybe they did realise their error. But whether they will allow an update to the 7000 (and 5000) is another issue.

As to previous ones, my old 6900 had a firmware update when it was sent back for repair - so I know it is possible.

Moving on - how do we practically do this petition ? What would get their attention ? What we really need is a friend on the inside - so does anyone know the Fuji chairman ?
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Old Mar 13, 2004, 9:47 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pookiepookie
A fixed lens Fuji S7000 is never going to be competition for a Canon EOS-300D, no matter how much you may want the magic flash to do it.

Fuji already produces the FinePix S2 Pro, a more expensive camera than the 300D, but one that does what you seem to want.


Perhaps you purchased the wrong camera?

A little research prior to your purchase may have helped you to avoid such a distracting "problem".


Post some of your examples, that have you so concerned.
If you read my previous posts you would see I did research the camera extensively. I have played with my S7000 a bit and found the default settings do not produce consistent good results.

The overall result with 12MP fine JPEG mode and "soft" focus is outstanding. RAW is the best overall and I highly suggest if you want archival quality or HQ prints larger than 8.5 x 11.0 you go with this mode.

I have tried all modes on the S7000 and have compared with RAW and JPEG from the Canon EOS 300D. At ISO 800 the 7000 uses pixel doubling and gives good results which aren't much worse than at ISO 400. On the other hand, at ISO 800 the 300D is starting to show considerable noise too and although it goes up to ISO 1600, on viewing the images I think you would agree they need significant PC based post-processing in "top end" image editing software to give a good result.

So in real life the EOS has a larger CCD and different lens possibilities but there are other "rate limiting" factors:

When you shoot a landscape with the 300D and you have a fantastic professional "L series" lens on the camera. You expect to get excellent results however, you have to set the "F stop" down to get enough depth of field to make the shot look good. You go down to say F16 to capture the scene with acceptable depth of field and crispness but at that setting the quality of that professional "L series" lens is now gone because you're out of the "sweet spot" of the lens. Another thing, the CCD sensor is starting to show diffraction at F11 so the image is showing some distortion. What do you do? You have to crank the dial to ISO 1600 to get the shot and suddenly, the result is grainy, noisy and not what you expected.

Canon 300D JPEGS are "soft focus" by default with less compression than the S7000. That is why they look better in the native state. Shoot RAW with the S7000 and use Photoshop CS to post process the image and it is superior to the Canon in many respects especially depth of field. Gone too are the overpowering reds which are probably a result of the overly aggressive JPEG compression done in the camera. Another thing to consider, I paid $335 after rebate for the S7000 new. The best price on a 300D is about $900. Add that "L Series" 315mm lens and tack on another $1200. Considering the output of both cameras I made a very prudent cost effective decision.

I think all in all the Canon EOS is a great camera. The Fuji is also a great camera. The bottom line is they both offer a versatility and depth of field which is unique. Neither of these cameras offers a true 35mm film SLR experience.

All I am asking for is that Fuji consider allowing a firmware update which would enable variable or less JPEG compression on the S7000.

pookiepookie, why do you insist I bought the wrong camera or did not do my research, it's not very polite. I am not looking for an arguement, I can call my parents for one of those and niether one of them knows what a digital camera is. I am aware this is a forum, I am aware of the contemporary definition of the word and it's historical significance.

I am trying to help everyone who owns this camera get more out of it by being proactive. It is very easy to stand on the sidelines and throw stones. It is very hard to get corporate minds to consider something that does not turn a profit immediately but it can be done, that's what I'm proposing.
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Old Mar 14, 2004, 4:10 PM   #15
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IMHO you should forget the petition idea and take the best out of your camera, we tried that for the S5000 and got nowhere.
I sent Fuji about 200 or more names (don't remember exactly) in a petition mainly about that same issue on the S5000 without results, you can read about it here:
http://www.s5000.net/forums/yaBB/cgi...num=1073317577
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Old Mar 14, 2004, 10:32 PM   #16
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Thanks for the advice Fernando. Looks like you got Fuji's attention. I have written a preliminary letter to Fuji. If nobody here on the forum wants to sign on and send it collectively then so be it, I'll send it myself.

My approach is a little different maybe it will meet with a different result, maybe not. I have found in dealing with corporate entities such as Fujifilm volume and persistence eventually pay off. If you want to join forces I'm up for it, the bigger the group the louder the noise we make. Eventually they will listen!
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Old Mar 15, 2004, 10:54 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by divedr
Thanks for the advice Fernando. Looks like you got Fuji's attention. I have written a preliminary letter to Fuji. If nobody here on the forum wants to sign on and send it collectively then so be it, I'll send it myself.

My approach is a little different maybe it will meet with a different result, maybe not. I have found in dealing with corporate entities such as Fujifilm volume and persistence eventually pay off. If you want to join forces I'm up for it, the bigger the group the louder the noise we make. Eventually they will listen!
Don't take it personally but I'm out this time, honnestly those issues never bothered me that much I just wanted to give it a shot. Anyway I don't even have a S7000 (yet, we never know).

But if you're really up for it do it, the way I see it will not be a waste of time (some will disagree), probably Fuji will never give us an upgrade but reading real users comments about a given product will give at least ideas on what to improve the next time, at least if they have an open mind.
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Old Mar 17, 2004, 9:16 AM   #18
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You can always count me in, I've been asking for Firmware updates for ages. I was very interested in the S20, until I found they removed 5fps in RAW and the BIN function. Such a waste in my case (motorcross). www.pbase.com/digsys/
ALL Fuji cameras have upgradeable Flash !! Refer my site at www.digsys.com.au/s602/s602.html (recently updated) if anyone doubts my statements :-)
To those who DON'T want to get involved, FINE, DON'T :-), This "if you don't like it, don't buy it" line is pathetic and old. Lets go for it.
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Old Mar 17, 2004, 12:38 PM   #19
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The question still remains unanswered.

Why would you knowingly buy a camera that has, in your opinion a significant flaw?

You all say you knew Fuji doesn't supply flash upgrades prior to your buying, so why all the complaining?

There are numerous other brands for a similar price and features available, so why would you choose Fuji, and then demand a "fix"?

Sorry boys, you shouldn't have bought yourselves a "flawed" camera, should you?
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Old Mar 17, 2004, 2:58 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pookiepookie
f-o-r-u-m...forum.

This is a forum, perhaps you need to refresh your understanding of the word.


Why exactly did you purchase from Fuji, if you were concerned about this "problem", apparently from past experience?

Why not post some of your best examples of this "problem", so we can see how this is effecting your shots?
What's wrong with you, I myself don't agree fully with his complaints but is this a way to talk to your fellow camera owners, I don't think so. He just asked a question and that what a forum is about, I think I reather hang out in the S5000 forum where people are just more polite and communicate in a much better way, but of cause that's just my opinion.

Regards
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