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Old May 26, 2004, 4:52 PM   #11
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slipe wrote:
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You would probably get a fairer comparison if you upsampled the Minolta raw images to 12Mp. Don't use a simple upsample but a good filter like bicubic in Photoshop or Lanczos in Irfanview. There are better filters, but those are pretty good. Qimage evidently has a new filter that is good. A lot of people swear by Genuine Fractals. I often use stair interpolation for upsample.

There is no point of upsampling the Minolta because upsampling allwaysneeds more complicated algorhytm than downsampling. Downsampling algorhytm is very simple (can be done with almost every photo editing tool). Isn't the whole idea to find out which camera hassharper image, with minumumsoftware manipulation?

My bet is in s7000, definately. With all respect to D7x


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Old May 26, 2004, 11:01 PM   #12
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Well, I have to say the others comments about me not taking the time to learn the dimage 7HI are incorrect. I owned a 7I and then because of various issues Minolta upgraded it to a 7HI. The 7HI was much faster due to the larger buffer and was way ahead of the 7I however the image quality was poor. I will however agree that anything but the 12MP setting is not very good unless your going to print small prints only. The 6MP image is much too noisy and the compression ratio is too high.

I took two shots. Both taken sideways with the entire head filling the frame. Both indoors and both with the attached flash.

7HI


S7000


Both of these are 100% crops. No downsampleing or changes accept the crop. The first one is at the best setting 5MP Dimage and the second is at 12MP Fine and that is why the second one is much bigger. Both of these are from the same individual. Granted they are very close up shots so the noise should be very low. 100% crop of a small item from a distance will have more noise with both cameras.

As for action shots and continuos autofocus. I found the S7000 to rate much higher in that catagory. The focus was almost always right on. The dimage in the continuous focus action setting yielded many blurry images. I also tried manually setting the shutter speeds on both. The dimage still had a rough time focusing on the correct moving object. One nice feature on the S7000 in continuous focus is the square block that comes on the screen to show you exactly what is being focused on. If your within the box, you image is in focus.

The D7 was a breakthrough in Digital Photography and in its time, it was one of the best out there. The problem is that the D7i and the D7hi didn't improve things much except for the buffer size. About the only function I really liked with the 7HI was the macro mode. It almost always took great macro shots outdoors.

I have 8x10s on my walls of the above images. Both look good and you will rarely do 100% crops anyway. However after last Christmas of getting a bunch of blurry pictures of my toddlers Christmas time and the time the first walked in to see their presents, the 7HI was too unreliable.

I shot about 1200 photos with the Dimage 7i and then the Dimage 7HI. I shot RAW and then converted them and I shot most of them in 5MP at the highest quality.

I have shot about 1700 shot with the Fuji S7000. Both RAW and all the other modes. I really like the camera if you can't tell. Well there is my two cents worth.

I do have one recommendation. Go out and try both camera for yourself. Purchase one of them from a reliable manufacture that has a moneyback if not satisfied time period. That way if you get one you don't like, get it back and pick another.
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Old May 27, 2004, 10:35 PM   #13
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Unfortunately, Swipe, this is a flawed method of comparision. You need controlled test shots(exact framing/FOV and lighting) in order to make useful comparisions. Steve's shots do not meet the requirement.

-Chris
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Old May 28, 2004, 1:16 PM   #14
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WmAx wrote:
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Unfortunately, Swipe, this is a flawed method of comparision. You need controlled test shots(exact framing/FOV and lighting) in order to make useful comparisions. Steve's shots do not meet the requirement.

-Chris
WmAx your right its hard to tell exactly the difference. Unfortunately I don't have both cameras since I sold the HI before getting the S7000. However; the images above do give you a general idea. I had consistantly the same problems with the 7HI. I would think a hot shoe flash would make a huge difference. You also have to look at the ISO. For instance the ISO on the Dimage was 100 I think and the Fuji is 200 and the images from the fuji still look better. Then theres the distance from the subject and what the zoom is set at etc. I took a lot of shots with the 7I and 7HI. In my personnal analysis, the lense was excellent but the camera was not. It seems to kept up the tradition with the A1 and A2. Still poor flash. However I have heard the focusing issues have been resolved with the new focus system and then there is the antishake. It sure would be nice if Camera Companies listened to what consumers wanted. Minolta, put in a better flash,Fuji change your compressions selections, Canon resolve your Purple Fringe issues. Companies, stop worrying about offering 8MP sensors to competewhen the sensor is too small and has a lot of noise issues, and put out some outstanding 5MP cameras with improved image quality!!!
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Old May 28, 2004, 3:42 PM   #15
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host wrote:
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It sure would be nice if Camera Companies listened to what consumers wanted...
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Companies, stop worrying about offering 8MP sensors to competewhen the sensor is too small and has a lot of noise issues, and put out some outstanding 5MP cameras with improved image quality!!!...

Yes, too bad their is no perfect camera. LOL. I am taking careful notice of the new A2 from Minolta. My primary interest in the device is (1) the lens quality (2) the best EVF on the market.

Now for some purely subjective banter, on my part....

I was extermely disappoionted when the FUJI S7000 was announced. I was hoping this camera would offer substantial imporovements over the S602. Alas, IMO, the only improvements are (1) more comfortabel rubber hand grip (2)shutter release thread (3) imporoved high ISO capabilities (4) improved resolution(though no use too me).(5) Improved EVF over theS602.I really hoped for better lens quality, TTL flash system and a manual zooming lens. Most suprising, too me, was the removal of the 5FPS function. Huh?

-Chris
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Old May 28, 2004, 9:49 PM   #16
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S7000 still shoots at 5FPS, not sure what your refering to. Also you can use the front lense ring like a manual zoom. It does control the motor, however its feel is somewhat the same as a manual zoom ring.

If I were going with a 8MP I think the Oly 8080 is probably the best. It seems to have great reviews at almost every site and the owners seem to really like the camera.


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Old May 28, 2004, 10:34 PM   #17
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THe specs pulbished by fuji certainly do not have 5FPS listed. The timing at imaging-resrouce also confirms this is not the case. Are you confusing 'last 5', etc. with '5FPS'? They not one in the same. As far as the zoom ring, uhm, it does not seem very useful too me on the S7000. Not really a good comparison to a mechanically linked unit. The S7000's ring zoom feature is stepped coarsely(same increment as the zoom buttons) and is not very responsive/fast.

As far as the Oly, not my cup of tea. ALso, I pretty much don't care about user reviews, never have. I value collected objective data/files that I can analyse. But, the Minolta has a very important feature(too me): the best EVF available. I will definately wait until the AF issues are sorted out before I even think about purchasing one of these units. Their is no local distributor, therefor the seemingly high probability of recieving a defect unit is daunting.

-Chris
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Old May 28, 2004, 11:15 PM   #18
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Old May 31, 2004, 4:35 PM   #19
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Hi Greg,

My understanding from those that know far more about Fuji sensors/cameras than I do is that the native format of the S7000 is 12 MP, all files begin as a 12MP RAW file and are converted and/or downsampled to 12, 6, 3, 1 MP files. So a6 MP RAW file would NOT be the native format.

Clyde
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