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Old Sep 17, 2005, 7:34 PM   #21
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Ira and Bob-

I truly believe that the difference between the characteristics of the CCD and the CMOS imager will still create a divide between the two camps, unless it can be proven that an improved and viable CCD can approach the characteristics and qualities of the CMOS imager.

It is my hope that the S-9000 will accomplish that task. If the S-9000 imager or another refined CCD imager can not do that task, then we must look to the Sony Solution of using a CMOS imager with a fixed lens.

Many things will change in the next 6 to 12 months. I believe that the February 2006 Photo Show, for example,will bring upon us many rather significant changes. All any of us in the trenches can do is to wait patiently. It could be a real surprise!

Sarah Joyce
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Old Sep 17, 2005, 8:41 PM   #22
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From what is written, the S9000, while not perfect (and, from the million posts I have read, there isn't yet the perfect dSLR either, or at least not under $1500 USD, the price at which 95%-plus of the American buyers probably lie), is certainly a major step forward...Sony has altered the size of the sensor, so I am sure other makers will follow in the next year, so 2006 may be a watershed year in the major leap forward for digicams...from 1995 until now, it seems that they would add a megapixel here or another feature there, kinda like computers in the 90s...

Now when you buy a computer, it is cheap compared to 5 years ago, and it has everything, 80 gig HD, CD/DVD recorder, photo card reader, 512MB ram, all for $500-700...5 years ago this same computer would be $10-15,000 USD...now you buy one for your child's sixth grade science class...

Unless I totally misinterpret what I see, the quantum jump in digicams is about to happen in the next 3-18 months, with the current new releases giving us a preview of what is to come in terms of technology...

Do not be surprised if, in the next few years, digicams become a commodity similar to computers, and, what used to cost $750 will soon cost $200...like when a one gigabyte HD was a grand, now 80 GB is $100...

I think a cam like the S9000 may be a good cam to buy now, and when it "needs" replacment in 3 years, the choices will astound you...

While I justified waiting until 2005 to buy my first digicam, C-770-UZ (for $260), because the 1, 2 and 3 MP cameras cost too much at the time they were new, I could see buying a S9000 (or R1 or Samsung 815, but definitely buy something this fall), and then use it for 3 years and replace it with the camera equivalent of the 80GB decked out computer at a cheap price...

Class dismissed...:-):-):G...there will be an essay test in the morning...
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Old Sep 18, 2005, 12:13 AM   #23
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I think the S9000 represents the best performance/value out there right now but I see the Sony R-1 as the tip of a whole new iceberg. Large sensor digicams would mean true Depth of Field control, real wide angle lenses and excellent high ISO performance. There are features that push me away from the Sony such as proprietary batteries, some mediocre performance numbers for the priceand the somewhat limited telephoto range. This is however a new type of camera which I hope will mark a new direction in digicams. I look forward to the future some of you are predicting. The S9000 to me is the replacement for 35mm, the Sony is more like a digital answer to medium format.

When I feel the need for a second camera (such as an increase in wedding bookings) it will probably be an S9000, complementing my S7000, but until then I will be watching very closely to see if things get as interesting as they appear to be headed.

Ira
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Old Sep 18, 2005, 1:19 AM   #24
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Hi Ira--Evf a weakness in digicams. No! No! No! Ask yourself if you can, as I did, make money from the 7000 the EVF was/is no problem. The only weakness in the 9500 is Photoshop haven't come with the RAW plug in it.

I tell you what SARAH let's visit IRA and chop down this fence on which he is perched.

At the moment I use s7RAW for the odd Raw shot, I take, but I'm not keen on it. I shoot with the 9500 as I did with the 7000. If I use jpeg, on brilliant sunny days, I underexpose by half a stop. This keeps the highlights under my control. It's much easier, and faster, in PSCS raw. I tend not to use auto WB. The 9500 has two custom WBs One Is an off white the other a light grey. There is a difference. I find with inbuilt flash auto WB is okay. Saturation I never use the high setting I jiggle between low & std. One thing I have noticed I can control the highlighs (JPEG)better with the 9500 than I could with the 300d. Half a dozen chaps in our Foto club have the Canon pro1, and all use PSCS raw. As the Pro1 is notorious for high contrast. I guess this is my last post for awhile. I'm dying to hear of your decision. BYE for now
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Old Sep 18, 2005, 9:33 AM   #25
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Carlton

Enjoy your warmer climes, I will be reinforcing my fence just in case (not planning on buying for about 6 months). Hope you get to read this before you leave. Bon Voyage.

Sarah

What about depth of field control, the dSLR lenses have much longer focal lengths than the equivalent EVF lenses. With my S7000 it is very difficult to achieve a soft out-of-focus background unless my subject is very close and the background very far away. Blur can be added in post processing but it is sometimes difficult to make it look realistic, and it can be a lot of work. Do you have any particular opinions or advice on this point?

One more comment on the Sony R-1, Sony strikes again (and I do not mean that in a positive way). The proprietary battery is one negative (I don't care if they last longer, which they often don't, I like having one battery type for all of my photographic devices) and I am still not clear on this point but I read that the camera does not support (will not fire) generic flash units (please correct this if I have the wrong info). This camera, like the F-828 before it, is so close to perfect, but again they have serious flaws that could have been avoided. Also, Sony introduces lots of new technology but they certainly make you pay for it, their prices are typically higher than competeing products (paying for that SONY tag). The Fuji is still at the top of mt EVF list even with the DOF issue.

Ira
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Old Sep 18, 2005, 11:56 AM   #26
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which issue? look at this portrait photo I found, taken with an S9000,
as you can see, the background is blurred. So DOF is small. My 3mp compact can't do that!


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Old Sep 18, 2005, 12:06 PM   #27
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Ira-

The very design or layoutof anSLR, that isthe space between the back of the lens and the film/imager, which normally houses the mirror assembly,creates a space that allows for more flexibility in lens design for the lens makers. That is why IMHO that you have more DOF control in an SLR.

Sony is not dumb. If they designed the perfect camera body for the Sony R-1 camera, they would measurably curtail the market they want to create for their CMOS imagers which will be sold to other camera makers. Last year Sony invested $485,000,000 (US) in a new CMOS manufacturing facility. That facility is designed to make more CMOS imagers than Sony can ever hope to build into their own Sony brand cameras. They have to sell CMOS imagers big time to justify their almost half a billion dollar investment. So they are out there creating the market for that type of imager right now. Perhaps Fuji's S-9000/S-5200 announcement forced them to move up their plan a bit, but that plan has been sitting there in the wings for months.

Yes, I personally believe that we are going to see a total revolution in digital camera design and manufacturing in the next 18 to 24 months. Get a good seat. It will be quite a show.

Sarah Joyce
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Old Sep 18, 2005, 2:33 PM   #28
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monza76,

just a reminder (from a s7000 and a KM 7D owner):



SHUTTER LAG !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old Sep 18, 2005, 2:47 PM   #29
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bernabeu wrote:
Quote:
SHUTTER LAG !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
YES!.. Shutter lag..

The S7000 has a lag of 0.7 to 0.9sec, and goodness knows how many shots I've lost due to that.But if the 9000 lag really is 0.01s then hopefully this issue has been put to bed.Does anyone know if this is due to a faster CPU in the 9000?




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Old Sep 18, 2005, 3:30 PM   #30
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bernabeu and Andy T, I don't believe that the S7000 has that much lag if prefocused but it is noticable at times, probably about 0.1 seconds. Even a dSLR has a focus time lag (although most focus faster than the S7000), it is the release afterward that counts.
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