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Old Aug 13, 2008, 2:47 AM   #21
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Please feel free to view my site at www.shadowboxreflectionsweddingphotos.com
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Old Aug 13, 2008, 4:54 AM   #22
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I'm leaving this thread open for now as things are civil and this is the way I would like it to stay but I see a potential for things to blow up and will close it if this happens. I would personally suggest a direct dialog to get this resolved rather than doing dirty laundry in public, but if there are things you feel you want to share please do so but consider what you have typed before you post.

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Old Aug 13, 2008, 5:54 AM   #23
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Because of the two radically different and irreconcilable viewpoints of the warring parties, it would be instructive to all of us to see an 800x600, 1:1,pixel for pixel clip from one of the originalISO1600 or pop-up flash images, if Mark the Modwould allow it.
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Old Aug 13, 2008, 6:21 AM   #24
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I'd be curious to see some sample images as well. Although I understand the thought of why the photo says he/she used iso 1600, I don't think it was the right choice. I've shot weddings, and I rarely shoot over 400, and never above 800. I've done enlargements as large as 30x40, and there is no way you could print that large with a file shot at 1600. Any group/posed shot does not need fast shutter speeds that 1600 would allow...nobody is moving. You may have to stretch the iso a bit for candids from the reception, but even then, 400 and flash should be enough to freeze motion.

I understand that there are two sides to every story, but there are still too many unanswered questions. Why a low end, amateur DSLR? Why were no sample prints shown to the potential customer? Why were only 2mp images delivered? The customer may have been a pain as well, but as a pro photographer why leave yourself open to these types of questions?
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Old Aug 13, 2008, 7:16 AM   #25
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Alan T wrote:
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Because of the two radically different and irreconcilable viewpoints of the warring parties, it would be instructive to all of us to see an 800x600, 1:1,pixel for pixel clip from one of the originalISO1600 or pop-up flash images, if Mark the Modwould allow it.
I've no issue with samples being show as long as copyright is not infringed by doing so.
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Old Aug 13, 2008, 7:18 AM   #26
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rjseeney wrote:
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I'd be curious to see some sample images as well. Although I understand the thought of why the photo says he/she used iso 1600, I don't think it was the right choice. I've shot weddings, and I rarely shoot over 400, and never above 800. I've done enlargements as large as 30x40, and there is no way you could print that large with a file shot at 1600. Any group/posed shot does not need fast shutter speeds that 1600 would allow...nobody is moving. You may have to stretch the iso a bit for candids from the reception, but even then, 400 and flash should be enough to freeze motion.
I'm often working at high ISO when shooting weddings so I can get a balance of ambient and flash, also in a lot of weddings here I can't use flash so working at 1600 is expected. Obviously when conditions allow then reducing the ISO is very beneficial.
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Old Aug 13, 2008, 7:45 AM   #27
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Mark1616 wrote:
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rjseeney wrote:
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I'd be curious to see some sample images as well. Although I understand the thought of why the photo says he/she used iso 1600, I don't think it was the right choice. I've shot weddings, and I rarely shoot over 400, and never above 800. I've done enlargements as large as 30x40, and there is no way you could print that large with a file shot at 1600. Any group/posed shot does not need fast shutter speeds that 1600 would allow...nobody is moving. You may have to stretch the iso a bit for candids from the reception, but even then, 400 and flash should be enough to freeze motion.
I'm often working at high ISO when shooting weddings so I can get a balance of ambient and flash, also in a lot of weddings here I can't use flash so working at 1600 is expected. Obviously when conditions allow then reducing the ISO is very beneficial.
I can understand where some condtions where require higher iso's, especially where flash isn't allowed (especially during the ceremony). However, the OP said the photographer used the pop up flash throughout the evening, so in this case flash was allowed. But would you ever just simply set Iso at 1600 and just forget it for the entire event?? Especially with an entry level, consumer DSLR that likely doesn't handle high iso's as well as say a 5d, or D3.
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Old Aug 13, 2008, 11:47 AM   #28
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OK,

Here's my take as a photographer (including wedding work):

1. To any potential client - it is your obligation to view sampling of photographer's work and seek references before entering into a contract. Caveat Emptor is in full affect here. Just because someone is charging you money doesn't mean what they produce will meet your requirements.

2. This entire issue is why there exist contracts. As photographers it is in our best interests to have a very good contract in place explicitly stating what will be delivered, when and what the terms of payment will be. Also including under what conditions payment can be withheld or the contract can be cancelled.

3. As a client - the contract is there to protect your needs too. As previously stated, there is NO governing body for wedding photographers. And while joe public might not have a clue everyone involved in this discussion is a photographer. So, as a photographer spending $2000 on a photography product you should do your due dilligence to ensure you are covered. If you're buying image files with the INTENT OF PRINTING FROM THEM then you should make sure the contract states image files deliverd should support printing of (insert size) prints to an agreed-upon-level of quality - usually reflective of samples (OF THE SAME SIZE) you've seen of the photographer's work.

4. Any contract I've ever seen has verbiage about how disputes are to be handled - for instance my contracts indicate the court of jurisdiction upon which descrepencies will be handled. To anyone signing a contract you should make sure that language is there. To the photographer - you also want the language there.

The reality here is this is a contract dispute now. It really doesn't matter, IMO, if I or another photog on this board think the photographer's photos are good enough. It really doesn't. The fact of the matter is - the OP doesn't like the product. But the real question is WHAT WAS IN THE CONTRACT? If the photographer fulfilled the terms of the contract the only discussion that makes sense is: what should people as potential clients look for in a contract to protect themselves. If there is an aspect of the contract not satisfied and the contract has no stipulation for settling disputes than small claims court is the only remedy. But be careful - there is a written contract in place here.
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Old Aug 13, 2008, 12:27 PM   #29
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I will not debate why I used the cameras I did and I will not debate megapixles . These are my personal favorite ..I had 5 other cameras with me including film cameras, 24 rolls of film...reflecters...external flash..ect.Had my client stated that my cameras were not exceptable this issue would havebeen solved before the ceremony.You can take pictures with 110 and get good results. I'm not here to argue...I just want to say that your camera doesn't define who you are as a photographer...we were there for 8 hrs...non stop except for a five minute break todrink a soda. The grooms father shook our hand and thanked us through out the evening as well as the groom for our hard work. This is the first and only time that cameras have been an issue. My client posted his comment without even making one enlargement . The cameras used were same cameras used at Congressman Ron Lewis's house for his nieces wedding. This was one of the most awesome weddings I have ever done. Thanks for listening guys...have a great day!
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Old Aug 13, 2008, 1:30 PM   #30
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This was brides bouquet lying on edge of fountain by glass doors where sun was beaming through the door. Taken with nikon d40 ....6 meg...1600 iso on largest formatt setting.



I chose not to post any shots of people ...
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