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Old Sep 24, 2009, 6:33 PM   #31
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I take photos in public very often. I rarely go anywhere without a camera.

Now, if someone asks me not to take their photo, I'll comply (even though I don't have to if they're in public). I don't try to hide that I'm taking photos in any way and most people don't seem to mind.

Here's a 6 page article on the subject by Petteri Sulonen that some of you may find nteresting. It discusses how photographers should be aware of other's attitudes towards them.

http://www.prime-junta.net/pont/Pont...ds.html?page=1
All Id like to know Jim is, after you take their picture do you run home to post it on the internet? Its not the picture taking Im against, its the posting.
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Old Sep 24, 2009, 6:46 PM   #32
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If you're in a public place, you have no reasonable expectation of privacy. Just because you may not like having your photo taken (or shared with others), doesn't make it illegal. ;-)

Photography has played a big role in society (including documenting abuses and crime that may not have come to light if not for others taking photos and sharing those images). It's also a way to document history. I'd hate to think of a world where we didn't have photos showing changes in society and our surroundings.

A bigger concern to me is attitudes towards photography anymore, with more people thinking something is wrong with taking photos. So, I think we need to be careful how we portray photography in order to curb those attitudes. IOW, help to educate others on the positive role photography has played in society, and make sure they understand that they have no reasonable expectation of privacy in public (versus inciting anger at photographers). It's a matter of balance.

See the section titled "A Stand for Photographer's Rights" section on this page for an attorney's thoughts about it:

http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm
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Old Sep 24, 2009, 7:03 PM   #33
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Id like to know why the people you shoot dont have a say whether you post their image on the internet or not.
Wow I just got back after chatting with half a dozen of my neighbors. The language flew about what they would do if you posted their picture without their permission. So in the real world Im not so much in left field.
Ive got a fix for this Chato. How about we keep out of each others posts. That will solve the problem for me.
Why? I have no problems with your posts, and it seems you only have problems with a particular series - Clearly labeled. Simply don't bother to comment on those posts. Heck, you have no use for the images anyway.

Dave
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Old Sep 24, 2009, 7:04 PM   #34
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All Id like to know Jim is, after you take their picture do you run home to post it on the internet? Its not the picture taking Im against, its the posting.
It depends on the photo and if it offers something that I may want to share with others. Personally, if someone objected to a photo of them being posted, I'd remove it (even though I may not have to), out of respect to their feelings about it. But, I can't control what someone else may want to do with the photos they take. You don't have any reasonable expectation of privacy if you're in public. So, even though you may not like someone taking and sharing images of you, that doesn't make it illegal.
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Old Sep 24, 2009, 7:14 PM   #35
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If you're in a public place, you have no reasonable expectation of privacy. Just because you may not like having your photo taken (or shared with others), doesn't make it illegal. ;-)

Photography has played a big role in society (including documenting abuses and crime that may not have come to light if not for others taking photos and sharing those images). It's also a way to document history. I'd hate to think of a world where we didn't have photos showing changes in society and our surroundings.

A bigger concern to me is attitudes towards photography anymore, with more people thinking something is wrong with taking photos. So, I think we need to be careful how we portray photography in order to curb those attitudes. IOW, help to educate others on the positive role photography has played in society, and make sure they understand that they have no reasonable expectation of privacy in public (versus inciting anger at photographers). It's a matter of balance.

See the section titled "A Stand for Photographer's Rights" section on this page for an attorney's thoughts about it:

http://www.krages.com/phoright.htm
I've been involved with this issue ever since Bloomberg tried to defacto ban photographing the actions of City Officials.

When I was a kid, this simply was not an issue; nor has the net qualitatively changed anything - despite the hoopla over the question of the net.

Fewer people will see my images, even if I devoted ALL my time to showing them, then a person whose picture appeared in Life or Look, back in the fifties and sixties. And BOTH Life and Look, wanted you to see these pictures, wanted you to stare at them -

I look at the pictures my father took in the thirties, and some of them are of naked children - Pictures that would get him tossed into jail today - Completely innocent pictures.

Well, Bynx is being completely honest - He doesn't know why he is angry, nor can he really articulate why he is angry.

Ahh, well.

Dave
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Old Sep 24, 2009, 7:17 PM   #36
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It depends on the photo and if it offers something that I may want to share with others. Personally, if someone objected to a photo of them being posted, I'd remove it (even though I may not have to), out of respect to their feelings about it. But, I can't control what someone else may want to do with the photos they take. You don't have any reasonable expectation of privacy if you're in public. So, even though you may not like someone taking and sharing images of you, that doesn't make it illegal.
The unconsious humor here is that Bynx has posted images of himself, that I would Never post if I had taken them.

Dave
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Old Sep 24, 2009, 7:23 PM   #37
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The reason I didn’t respond to this thread was that I could see it was going down the crapper from the start. But now that we’re already there, I think I’ll put in my 2 cents...

I believe you should be able to photograph anything you want. However, before you print a picture of someone and hang it on a wall in a public place, or post it on the internet for the whole world to see, I believe you should have that person’s knowledge and approval. I’m not talking about legalities, and I’m not talking about forms and attorneys and courts and lawsuits...a simple, “Do you mind if I take your picture?” would suffice. Or, if the picture was already taken candidly, “Excuse me, I just took your picture. It came out really well - would you like to see it? If they say yes or show no objection to being photographed, then you should feel free to use it as you wish. However, if they object or seem angry, then you shouldn’t post it. Subjects have rights too. Just because you don’t give them a chance to object doesn’t mean they wouldn’t.

I’m not talking about pictures in which you can’t identify an individual, such as a crowd of people at a ball game, or a sea of humanity at Times Square on New Year’s Eve, I’m talking about the pictures in which you can positively identify an individual, what the individual is doing, the location, and the time of day.

I don’t think some of you realize the harm that a picture can cause. It’s one thing to have rights. Yes, we all have rights - but not the right to hurt other people. How would you feel if one of your candid street shots caused someone harm? Most of you look at this thread through the eyes of a photographer...a photographer with many rights. Try looking at it from the subject and the subject’s family’s point of view...what about their rights?

Tell you what - I’m going to follow you and your family around and take candid photographs of you - I have the right to do so, don’t I? All of the photographs will be taken in public places. When I’m done, I’m going to post those photographs on the internet...on sites which will get the most exposure.

Example 1 - You decide to call in sick from work one day, and go fishing. You catch a really nice fish, and hold it up to look at it - [CLICK] - I post the pic. The next day at work, one of your coworkers sees the picture, prints it out, and posts it on the bulletin board in the main lobby. The president of the company sees it. You get fired.

Example 2 - You go to a retirement party for one of your coworkers - another one of your coworkers can’t start her car and it has to be towed away - you have to drive right past her apartment on your way home, so you offer to give her a lift. You hold the car door open for her as she gets in - she is wearing a rather short skirt, and a blouse with a plunging neckline - she is extremely attractive - as she gets in, she looks up at you and smiles - you smile back - [CLICK] - I post the pic - your wife’s best friend sees it. You get divorced.

Example 3 - I see your young daughter standing on a corner waiting for the school bus to come. Very pretty little girl, holding her school books - [CLICK]. The picture I took shows a street sign directly over her head. It is legible and clearly defines the corner on which she is standing. From the EXIF information, one can ascertain the exact time of day the picture was taken. I post the pic - 1,000 pedophiles see the pic, and know where and when this pretty little girl will be every morning. Your daughter gets abducted (I’ll leave the rest up to your imagination).

I’m sure each and every one of you can come up with some other examples where a photograph can hurt someone. The point I’m trying to make is, you can’t possibly know what harm one of your pictures can cause. In all innocence, you could ruin someone’s life. Is it worth the risk to prove you have some kind of rights? Are your rights more important than mine? Than their’s?

Think about it.

The Hun
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Old Sep 24, 2009, 7:28 PM   #38
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The unconsious humor here is that Bynx has posted images of himself, that I would Never post if I had taken them.
Not everyone has the same perception of humor. So, lets leave the personal comments out of the discussion.

Thanks.

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Fewer people will see my images, even if I devoted ALL my time to showing them, then a person whose picture appeared in Life or Look, back in the fifties and sixties. And BOTH Life and Look, wanted you to see these pictures, wanted you to stare at them -
Actually, there was a news story published yesterday and today about how you can now browse over 1800 issues of Life in the Google archives. Here's a link to the archive:

http://books.google.com/books?id=N0E..._issues_anchor
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Old Sep 24, 2009, 7:47 PM   #39
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I believe you should be able to photograph anything you want. However, before you print a picture of someone and hang it on a wall in a public place, or post it on the internet for the whole world to see, I believe you should have that personís knowledge and approval....
You're not going to keep everyone happy, and it may not be practical to get everyone's approval in many cases.

Now, out of courtesy, I will sometimes ask someone if it's OK to post their photo if I take one I like. But, I don't always do that if I'm taking photos at an event. It's just not practical and it's pretty obvious that I'm taking photos. I think most people assume that photos of them may be shared if they see a photographer taking photos (for example, at parties, parades, weddings, public gatherings, concerts, etc.).

From my perspective, the bottom line is that you need to be aware that if you are in public, your actions may be documented by others. In other words, if the boss finds out you were out fishing when you were supposed to be sick because someone took your photo, then don't go fishing when you claim you're sick. ;-)

Now, if you're taking photos to deliberately harm someone, then you may be crossing the line, depending on your local laws. So, personally, I try not to take photos for the purpose of embarrassing someone.
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Old Sep 24, 2009, 8:10 PM   #40
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"From my perspective, the bottom line is that you need to be aware that if you are in public, your actions may be documented by others."

" Now, if you're taking photos to deliberately harm someone, then you may be crossing the line, depending on your local laws."

I have every right to take your picture in a public place, and you need to be aware that your actions may be documented by me. What line is being crossed here? You do something stupid in public, and I'm going to take a picture of it and post it on the web for all to see. According to your perspective, I have every right to do that. It's OK for you to sit on a park bench and snap pics of random passersby to post on the net. If I'm sitting on the next park bench taking pictures of you, taking pictures of others (in case one of your subjects wants to pay you back for posting their likeness on the web), that's not OK? That's crossing a line? What's the difference? Because you may be hurt by it? Too bad - I'm within my rights...according to you...

the Hun
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