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Old Oct 16, 2009, 8:33 AM   #111
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i wonder if the parent or police would have acted differantly if it had been a woman or a youngster taking the photo
First - it was someone driving a car that took the photos. I doubt it would have made a difference to the police if it were a woman or a teenager. Someone was concerned enough about the incident and the incident itself was unusual enough (looking over at a stoplight and seeing the driver next to you pointing a camera at your child in the backseat and taking pictures) that it still would have been worth the phone call. Again, circumstances matter. That's a very unusual occurance - at least for me - again I'm 39 years old and I can't remember a single time I've looked over at a car and seen someone pointing a camera back at me, much less my toddler in the back seat).

Now, if it had been on the street or a park, the parent likely wouldn't have a license plate # to give the cops. So the entire details of the story would be different. Just my opinion though.
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 11:42 AM   #112
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i wonder if the parent or police would have acted differantly if it had been a woman or a youngster taking the photo

That is an interesting comment.........worthy of consideration...
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 11:52 AM   #113
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I would suggest taking another look at what the OP said:


So - all the cop told the OP was they got a complaint from someone concerned about the OP taking pictures of his daughter. According to what the OP told us the cop NEVER accused him of anything. Just following up on a complaint. Any fears of being on a 'watch list' are entirely within the mind of the OP. I have several members of my family in law enforcement (father retired police chief and runs a county narcotics bureua) - when I asked him about keeping a 'watch list' of people based on a phone call like this he just laughed. This was a single phone call - not the cop showing up at the house, not taking the OP into the police station. A several minute phone call during which I'm guessing the OP did most of the talking. I think it's an overreaction to say the cop assumed he was guilty. The cop did what he was supposed to do - he interviewed the OP and when he determined there was no crime he let the matter drop. Police talk to people all the time - it's their job. In many cases no one is arrested or charged. This is a FAR cry from other situations my colleagues over at sportsshooter like to talk about when cops actually DO interfere with photographers rights. Anyway, re-read it and see if anything the OP said indicates the cop assumed guilt or that anything besides a several minute conversation took place.

Well, first...all calls are recorded. Was this one recorded? I have no evidence it was, or wasn't from the OP comments.

Based on what is happening here in Canada...I have little doubt it was recorded.

If a university student travelling from one class to another (cops knew the details of her class schedule) who 'happens' to be a friend of an anti-Olympic person, gets stopped and interviewed....then a photographer of a child will be duly noted. There is no question in my mind about that. Particularly since there ARE sickos out there. (that they can't catch..btw..)

If you suspect that I have lost faith in 'Canada's finest' yer right... The events in the last 5 years here plus the knowledge I have from RCMP 'friends'...have cast a LOT of concern over what was a proud organization.
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 4:50 PM   #114
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Maybe but I don't think that is the case here most are out to gain and if the father had a spot in some poor Constables soul life then ah the favor regained huh in to days greedy world...
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 4:58 PM   #115
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Oh the curse of having a good looking face eh?
I must say I have one I guess but the rest has gotten out of control.. and that was years ago and well I am with in a means of some kind of surveillance since I was little must be a number of causes of course when my grandfather was and FBI or CIA agent what comes of it all is more technical issues in todays world and a messed up life as well.. cause they all think I need to live a life of their own means.. unfair there..
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 8:55 PM   #116
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Like my great aunt minniethehun used to always say, ”It’s always something...if it isn’t one thing, it’s something else”.

the Hun
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Old Oct 16, 2009, 10:01 PM   #117
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I remember one incident where I took my two boys for a rodeo and there was a lady that took my sons photo for he was dressed to the hilt of a youngster whom was into the event I did not confront the woman and if she used the picture it would of been a great shot and therefore people just get carried away with every thing. Can I refill your tea of coffee men... being very much the lady in this talk of affairs of such carry on is making me thirst for more action....

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every one are my Granddaughters and I know they would love to have their pictures taken bay any one under proper reasons....till they are older and can decide for them selves that is what other kind they choose to have done.....

Last edited by SharpShotGal; Oct 16, 2009 at 10:08 PM.
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Old Oct 17, 2009, 12:29 AM   #118
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I feel for you I live in a small town write a monthly fishing article run a local website take outdoor photos and submit them to my local paper, many get published, I'm always driving around taking loads of pictures come home review them see what looks good, many are of scenery and people, unfortunatly we live in a world now that we have to really watch out for our privacy and there are lots of weirdos out there, if this would have happened to me I would have done the same take a plate and report it, but i would have most likely followed the person who did this, you just can't be to sure in todays world. Hope it all works out for you, if it was reversed what would you have done?
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Old Oct 17, 2009, 12:31 AM   #119
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anyone see the e-mail going around 1979 VS 2009 this is so true in todays world
HIGH SCHOOL -- 1979 vs. 2009
Scenario 1:
Jack goes quail hunting before school and then pulls into the school parking lot with his shotgun in his truck's gun rack.
1979 - Vice Principal comes over, looks at Jack's shotgun, goes to his car and gets his shotgun to show Jack.
2009 - School goes into lock down, FBI called, Jack hauled off to jail and never sees his truck or gun again. Counselors called in for traumatized students and teachers.



Scenario 2:

Johnny and Mark get into a fist fight after school.
1979 - Crowd gathers. Mark wins. Johnny and Mark shake hands and end up buddies.
2009 - Police called and SWAT team arrives -- they arrest both Johnny and Mark. They are both charged with assault and both expelled even though Johnny started it.



Scenario 3:

Jeffrey will not be still in class, he disrupts other students.
1979 - Jeffrey sent to the Principal's office and given a good paddling by the Principal. He then returns to class, sits still and does not disrupt class again.
2009 - Jeffrey is given huge doses of Ritalin. He becomes a zombie. He is then tested for ADD. The school gets extra money from the state because Jeffrey has a disability.

Scenario 4:

Billy breaks a window in his neighbor's car and his Dad gives him a whipping with his belt.
1979 -
Billy is more careful next time, grows up normal, goes to college and becomes a successful businessman.
2009 - Billy's dad is arrested for child abuse. Billy is removed to foster care and joins a gang. The state psychologist is told by Billy's sister that she remembers being abused herself and their dad goes to prison. Billy's mom has an affair with the psychologist.



Scenario 5:

Mark gets a headache and takes some aspirin to school.
1979 - Mark shares his aspirin with the Principal out on the smoking dock.
2009 - The police are called and Mark is expelled from school for drug violations. His car is then searched for drugs and weapons.


Scenario 6:

Pedro fails high school English.
1979 - Pedro goes to summer school, passes English and goes to college.
2009 - Pedro's cause is taken up by state. Newspaper articles appear nationally explaining that teaching English as a requirement for graduation is racist. ACLU files class action lawsuit against the state school system and Pedro's English teacher. English is then banned from core curriculum. Pedro is given his diploma anyway but ends up mowing lawns for a living because he cannot speak English.
Scenario 7:
Johnny takes apart leftover firecrackers from the Fourth of July, puts them in a model airplane paint bottle and blows up a red ant bed.
1979 - Ants die.
2009 - ATF, Homeland Security and the FBI are all called. Johnny is charged with domestic terrorism. The FBI investigates his parents -- and all siblings are removed from their home and all computers are confiscated. Johnny's dad is placed on a terror watch list and is never allowed to fly again.
Scenario 8:
Johnny falls while running during recess and scrapes his knee. He is found crying by his teacher, Mary. Mary hugs him to comfort him.
1979 - In a short time, Johnny feels better and goes on playing.
2009 - Mary is accused of being a sexual predator and loses her job. She faces 3 years in State Prison. Johnny undergoes 5 years of therapy.


This should hit every email inbox to show how

stupid we have become!!
AMEN TO THAT !!!!



























































Last edited by Canadian; Oct 17, 2009 at 12:34 AM.
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Old Oct 17, 2009, 10:21 AM   #120
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anyone see the e-mail going around 1979 VS 2009 this is so true in todays world
HIGH SCHOOL -- 1979 vs. 2009
Scenario 1:
Must be nice living in a small town. I doubt if any of these scenario's are realistic, either of then or now...

You wrote in your earlier post:

Quote:
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...unfortunatly we live in a world now that we have to really watch out for our privacy and there are lots of weirdos out there, if this would have happened to me I would have done the same take a plate and report it, but i would have most likely followed the person who did this, you just can't be to sure in todays world. Hope it all works out for you, if it was reversed what would you have done?
I would like to know why we have to watch out for our privacy today as opposed to when I grew up in the Fifties? Certainly attitidudes toward photographers were different. But photography hasn't changed in ANY qualitative manner. Everyone I knew, no matter how poor. had at least a Brownie, and most working people had those small 35mm point and shoots. And I know of what I speak. I was born in a quanset hut, and grew up in the projects of New York City.

We take more pictures today, then we did then, but it made little difference. Indeed, even in WWII most GI's went to war with their cameras. Nor have the number of "weirdo's" changed - True, most people today, as opposed to then, are freer to dress differently, wear their hair differently -

When I was a kid, the Street gangs were more numerous and as violent as they are today.

But there has been one dramtic change. When I was a kid, one parent could support a household. And kids, instead of needing day care centers, nannies, baby sitters, would and could be supervised and protected by at least one parent. Today, parents concerned about their children simply don't have the time for parenting. So, they're going to "take a tire iron" to some guy who thinks their kid is cute. They're going to do this because conditions have made them lousy parents, and now, they get a chance to vent their frustrations...

Pedophilia is a disease. It's been in this world for time immermorial. And the kiddie porn industry has been in existance for many millennium. The relative handful of those who actually harm children, should of course be removed from society.

Those who kidnap, rape and murder children are more than just pedophiles - They are raving psychophatic sociopaths - And they too have been around since humans walked the earth.

What does this have to do with photography and photographs?

People will an illness do not call the shots in a rational society. In a rational society a naked child is not an object of sexual desire.

NB.

We are so much our worst enemies here. We are in fact saying to the disturbed of this world that lusting after children is a rational and normal lust. Why else do we ban those books which depict naked chidlren being children? Are we not saying that these books should be banned because WE lust after children. Are we not declaring to the disturbed of this world, that we would all like to be pedophiles?

My friends, we are screwing ourselves, and this whole business of photography being a defacto threat to our children is a reflection of fear, frustration, and a short sighted recipe for disaster.

Dave
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