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Old Apr 24, 2004, 8:07 PM   #1
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Default Why dont Consumer Cameras have RAW options (at least KODAKs)

I Was just reading in another post about someone fretting over a RAW capability in their digital camera.... Although my opinion is that it is not necessary unless you are really in need of it... I was just wondering if anyone knows the answer to this question ffrom a Technical point of view... WHY no raw setting? Also does anyone know if the conversion ot JPEG is done in the camera by the firmware or the hardware of the Camera.

Also would it be possible to "Modify" the Kodak Firmware to Allow for a RAW file format? Why hasn't this been done already?
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Old Apr 24, 2004, 9:46 PM   #2
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Well,
after reading the answers to my post I decided I personally do not need RAW format support. I am just an newbie buying his 1st digicam to setup a web album and to do small prints.
From reading the whole thread it is clear to me that RAW is not a "consumer" feature: it takes a lot of space and is slow, and more importantly it goes against Kodakīs goal of delivering their "Kodak color" in their consumer cameras through image processing. RAW implies no processing, the opposite. So even if they could implement the feature with a firmware upgrade, I donīt see it happening.
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Old Apr 25, 2004, 11:30 AM   #3
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yeah I am just curious if it is limited at all by hardware or it resides purely in the firmware of the camera....I figure its in the firmware but I am at al loss for the exact way it works.
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Old Apr 25, 2004, 1:20 PM   #4
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Kodak doesn't even give you jpeg options, never mind RAW. They should at least give the user a HQ jpeg setting instead of just aggressive compression. Most mfgrs give you 3 levels of jpeg, the higher end cameras add RAW and Tiff.
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Old Apr 25, 2004, 1:23 PM   #5
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yeah I noticed that and I read a post from a Kodak Rep claiming that their Algorathm for Jpeg compression was not "High" but Very OPTIMISED... which kind of leads me to belive that it is on the higher end of things like you say it is... I wonder if they have anyinfo about the Stats on it... or is it all simply too hush hush.
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Old Apr 25, 2004, 1:33 PM   #6
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The JPEG conversion and raw for that matter is done by the hardware in the camera. It is controlled and fine-tuned by the firmware but it is pretty much a hardware thing. The consumer cameras are all built around a main board that has several large scale integration chips that handle all of the primary functions. Most consumers don't need TIFF or Raw image formats so the hardware has been optimized to process and store JPEG images. TIFF and Raw is nice if you plan on doing post-capture editing but thr truth is that most consumers simply snap and print for the most part.

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Old Apr 25, 2004, 1:53 PM   #7
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I read somewhere about the Jpeg compression being done by the firmware and I kinda had trouble beliveing that the bulk of the compression could be done in it... But had no other explanation.

Thanks for clearing that up
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Old Apr 25, 2004, 2:48 PM   #8
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Having worked at a company that designed its own chips and such, I can easily believe they do the jpg compression in hardware. I'm constantly amazed at what they can do in hardware

I'd even bet that they purchase most of the chips from others with little or no chances. TIFF or RAW support costs extra, I'm sure, so they only add it into models that they want to aim at that market. And that isn't a very large market, I bet.

Eric
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Old Apr 25, 2004, 5:45 PM   #9
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with what you just said in mind I wonder if the "KODAK Jpeg compression technoolgy" that the customer rep spoke of in a news group I was reading is embeded straight into the chip.....making recuding the amount of compression impossible by anything shotrt of changing out that chip.... (which I dont think anyone wants to do .. hah).
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Old Apr 25, 2004, 9:04 PM   #10
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We all know that the sensors are shared (so many come from Sony right now) but I wouldn't be surprised if much of the innards for many cameras are actually made by someone else. Humm... that might explain why Canon was so big on their new DIGIC II chip. I hadn't thought about it.

Yes, it's possible that their compression tech is directly embedded in the chip. The other thing is that flash memory is expensive (much more than an ASIC chip) so things that don't rate being upgradable are not put in there. Especially the lower cost cameras where margins are so thin they watch costs everwhere. I bet more of the camera's innards are "upgradable" in a 1Ds (or other multi-thousand cameras) just because at that price, they can slip in a 5 dollar part (flash) instead of a 50 cent part (chip.) Of course, my numbers are made up, but you get the idea.

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