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Old Dec 5, 2006, 7:14 PM   #1
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Hi all,

Joined your forum, too
I want to use the cam for my rally-car. I was using an old Hi8 cam but it couldnt get good quality because shocks from the road messed up tape recording unit on it, so the video was all messy.

I'm thinking of switching to a hybrid cam, since they use a memory card instead (no moving parts inside) But I'm a little confused in all the offers.

Now I read about the Digilife DDV-1000 and saw a lot of good thoughts about it. Also the Sony DSC-M2 looked like a good one, but it is 500 bucks. I read that someone had bought it for $250!! Good for him because I couldn't find it so cheap

Could you please help me choose? These would be the key features that I would like on that cam:
- no tape/moving matrix whatsoever, just memory card or stick
- probably a ccd sensor for better contrast and color
- easy to turn on and start recording a movie (since it can be time/effort critical before each special stage) I read that the DDV-1000 had seperate buttons for movie/still image.
- at least 1 h (prefebly 1.5 - 2h) long movie support (in total)

I also read about the MPEG encoding - that it doesn't 'like' a video that moves a lot?
As for the rest of the features (mp3 still cam etc) good to have them but the movie quality is the most important. I'm not looking for the perfect solution (bulletin cams) but just a reasonable price (around $200) one piece equipment. If it has AV in (to maybe later upgrade to a bulletin cam) and MIC in (for helmet mics to record - sweet) - the better.

Thanks a lot!!
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Old Dec 5, 2006, 7:18 PM   #2
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Forgot to mention - the racing is mostly on gravel roads, so they can be pretty fast and sometimes bumpy

Cheers!
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Old Dec 6, 2006, 7:36 AM   #3
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cigorins


there are many brands, makes, and models to chose from , bes advice is an av input, andtripod forstarters. you already mentionedccd lens so you'll need to find that model. also preferre older format AVI, for larger filesizeand more info, even thogh it is not old, nor new Mpeg4 compression will add more info to ASF and may cutdown on unwanted stuf.

Mic on hybrid not many haves o, this limits the choice

ccd, tripod, av input, mic. tapeless unit. remote control

tell you stay away from Aiptek your clearity shot in video is not thebest, buthas great features for its price.

lets see ifanyone can answer the topic andhelp out

Cheeze, or microtek, and dxg 505V or 301,2V may be a hybrid to look at . Onememberhas it and avidsample is up in thevideo samplelast post .

http://media.putfile.com/oct-7th-sutton

microtek mv500
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Old Dec 6, 2006, 11:07 AM   #4
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Thanks for the info!

Yes, the microtech seemed pretty fine just that it has cmos sensor and the mode selector is like a button that you cycle through (cannot be operated blindly, without looking into the screen)

I liked that it has 4AA batt, easy to change and bring extras, if ran out.

The tripod mount is not needed becuase we will make a special rack/tripod to hold it in properly anyway, since regular tripod mount doesn't provide with the neccessary stability. And remote may not be present, too. It would be enough with just a setting that turns it to video mechanically and when you turn it on, it goes in video mode, you know smth like that!!


Yes, and that footage you placed here was fine - pretty much what I'm looking for qualitywise (dunno about lower/changing light though, since it was pretty bright in that vid - would it affect the "blare witch syndrom")

What did you mean about choosing AVI over Mpeg-4 (asf).. didn't quite catch it.. sorry

Any other ideas? welcome )
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Old Dec 6, 2006, 12:40 PM   #5
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Mpeg compression

avi a larger file for editing on most programs

asf more compressed and smaller size.

sensor ccd or cmos, andits size 1,3,5 mb use up memory n file more info to the hybrid

lighting , camera will adjust to video, may not do it theway you like it. , andto trick the hybrid you need to turn on and film before it starts up.

you'll see shade differences. will try to show a vid it'll be an old mustek dv300 video low quality. need to find it

never point the hybrid to the sun you'll get black spotting. rainbow or prismatic effects. not like the Aiptek MPVr descussion on a grill. like a star trek transporter.

no natural or opt view finder on any hybrid, unless its the older Aiptek dv series.

so, vid record is always a priority choice, no thumbing to se up.




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Old Dec 7, 2006, 1:06 AM   #6
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The DDV-920 would be fine for this sort of thing. Use it with image stabilization turned on.:-)

An alternative would be the new ATC-2000 helmet cam. But I think it lacks image stabilization, and it certainly lacks a screen. So you could not review footage until you got to a computer.

The advantage of the helmet cam would be that you could aim it wherever you wanted. But I guess in a rally car, you have more important things to be doing.

My impression is that the files output by these cameras can be in .avi or .asf format. Both of those are then compressed by the Mpeg4 processing. My impression is that they lose a similar amount of detail in the compression and processing, and that the files are almost the same size.

Mpeg4 can compress to varying degrees. But it has to stay within the data throughput capacity of the camera. So when the subject matter is moving, the whole sensor has to be "redone" 30 times per second. This overloads the throughput, so the processing compresses more, by throwing out more detail, to stay within the limits. If instead you set the camera on a tripod, aimed at a static scene, in a couple of seconds the camera will map out the whole scene in its best detail, and then just keep recording that nice and sharp, but static scene.

In rally car driving, I'd expect that the most important subject matter will be in the center, and distant. The fast-moving, less important stuff will be around the perimeter of the scene. So the compression should do the most damage to the least important subject matter.
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Old Dec 13, 2006, 5:02 AM   #7
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Hey, thanks for the info!!

Yes, that ATC-2000 looks pretty nice. I found also some sample (demo) videos online and the quality was OK, that cam mentioned by fishycomics was better color and contrast quality I think.

What I am most concerned about ATC-2000 is the "wobling" of the image when its being shaken too much. Its like the pictures gets squashed from top and then it pops out again. I think it is to do with compression. It's not really a big deal as long as it is not too much..

Anyway, thanks for the help, if you have anything more to add, feel free )
M
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Old Feb 7, 2007, 11:19 PM   #8
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TREO PICamTek

Here's some sort of a common hybrid being sold with a spycam. They've been clever enough to power the lens unit from the camera. The info gives no hint of how they've connected the power wires to the camera, unfortunately.

http://www.pimall.com/nais/pitekcamcorder.html
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