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Old Feb 6, 2008, 10:47 AM   #21
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The SDR-S10 by Panasonic is my favorite hybrid camera right now.

As I mentioned, I have two of them.

Their video is very good when you consider how small the sensor is.

The low-light mode in the menu also works pretty well.

The data rate is high enough to ensure a good picture without the blockiness that you get so often with the MPEG-4 camcorders.

Consumers like very saturated colors.

But I tend to like the more realistic look that you get from the Panasonic video, which is not too saturated.

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Old Feb 6, 2008, 9:53 PM   #22
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Private Idaho wrote:
Quote:
The SDR-S10 by Panasonic is my favorite hybrid camera right now.

As I mentioned, I have two of them.

Their video is very good when you consider how small the sensor is.

The low-light mode in the menu also works pretty well.

The data rate is high enough to ensure a good picture without the blockiness that you get so often with the MPEG-4 camcorders.

Consumers like very saturated colors.

But I tend to like the more realistic look that you get from the Panasonic video, which is not too saturated.

Private Idaho



I agree. the mpeg-2 seems to hit my eyes like real world, and hints that is working quite fast...to me that is as real as it gets. To go further and respect the surroundings of the camera (environment and the camera stand at a minumum) I believe it will be close to a pro grade, if it really isn't deemed so already..

I do have a question that I do not have an answer...

I quickly threw in a regular class2 1gb san disk sd card...(quick clips no longer than a few min at a time- I do not believe I will be making a 90minute movie all at once and going to hollywood)and have no problems at all. The strange thing is they have a sd "hc" card at 2gb, and another 2gb that does not claim sdhc... should I just get sdhc for a bit more money or what?

The sdhc logo is on the side of the camera (I have the "p1" revision of the sdr-s10, also shock proof mil standard)

I know upgraded things are normally retroactive to the past, meaning anything will work... but would like to know the benefit of a 2gb sdhc vs. regular sd also at 2gb. I don't quite understand...especially if they both are in the same class (2 i believe is what I have found) also..the class 2 reads at 5mbit. Why would I want more? is that for higher speed than usb 2.0 people? if so, i do not need to change my cheap route to sd memory and not get sdhc. The benefit of this camera was the thought that the sd can get chucked in the trash (I literally have outdone them) and get a new one. Does wonders. thanks for help with this.
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 3:24 PM   #23
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By the way, brand new Panasonic SDR-S10s are being sold by a large electronics retailer in Montana (Vann's).

http://www.vanns.com/shop/servlet/it...=08-45767826-2

This seems to be a pretty decent price.

Private Idaho
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 3:28 PM   #24
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($200)
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 6:25 PM   #25
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How is low-light video from SDR-S10 versus Sanyo CG6?
Any samples available?
I pass thru Aiptek GO-HD,did not bother with A-HD anymore,also
a Sanyo HD700 which was from a bad batch probably (some of the users have reported good results) sent back to Amazon (it was $300 deal) and
the only one which has good image daylight and low light it was VPC-CG6
($200 at Walmart). Did not jump to HD 1000 because is too bulky for pocket carry.
I did not look at Panasonic then because it was like $450-500. Also SDR-S150 is looking good but I understand is not "shirt pocket" like this two models plus is no so easy find in stores.
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 7:44 PM   #26
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The Panasonic offers better video in both daylight and low light conditions.

The reason is the data rate.

Panasonic's highest data rate = almost 10 Mbps.

Sanyo's highest data rate = about 3 Mbps.

The Sanyo utilizes MPEG-4, which is more efficient, but that greater efficiency does not offset a data rate that is more than three (3) times as high.

The Sanyo is tiny... yes... even smaller than the Panasonic.

But the Panasonic is also a pocket cam; it's also quite small.

For people who use an APPLE TV to display home video on their home TV sets, the Sanyo video -- MPEG-4 -- is easier because the APPLE TV is designed specifically to play MPEG-4.

I'm a big APPLE fan and I plan to buy an APPLE TV.

That's why I have a Sanyo.

The Panasonic models utilize MPEG-2... less efficient... but higher quality and more appropriate for DVD disc playback.

So, if you plan to make DVD-videos, then the Panasonic would be a better choice.

If you plan on using an APPLE TV, then a Sanyo might make more sense.

Of course, one can buy both. :G

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Old Feb 7, 2008, 8:36 PM   #27
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A little bit to add: I bought a SDR-S10 the first week it was available, when it was still nearly $400! :O It was a bit overpriced then, but I have no regrets. I bought it to complement a Sanyo C6 (a very nice unit, BTW) but the Panasonic has become my favorite of some six camcorders I own. Video quality is as good as any low end consumer camcorder but in a very small bulletproof package. Video is especially good outside in decent light. The low-end 1/6 CCD is the main limiting factor.

The camera is tiny, people don't notice it. I bought a $3 camera case at Walmart and keep it hanging off my belt. I always use the highest quality video setting. A 4 GB card gives you about 45 minutes, which is about the same as the battery life. I always shoot 4:3 mode. The 1/6 inch CCD is just too small for a decent 16:9 picture.

I edit using Womble's MPEG Video Wizard. This low cost program ($70) allows fairly sophisticated editing without re-encoding the footage. What you distribute on DVD is exactly the same footage that's captured on the SD chip. This helps keep the quality up. (The biggest problem I have with MPEG-4 is that it always needs to be encoded to something else.) Womble has a lot of options. Besides making an edited MPEG-2 video for DVD, you can use the same edited timeline to deinterlace, resize, and encode the footage to MPEG-4 or Xvid for the YouTube crowd. Rather than being a multi-step process, Womble can do it in one pass.

Womble also includes a VFAPI driver, so the timeline can be fed to another application, such a an MPEG encoder without making an intermediate file.

I just got back from a long weekend cruise with John Mayer and a few other bands. (Check out the fun on YouTube.) I'm very happy with the footage I got. Sound on the Panasonic is reasonably good but I plan to sync footage with recordings made simultaneously with a Zoom H2.


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Old Feb 7, 2008, 9:49 PM   #28
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biophase,

If you're still reading this thread, then check out one more piece of software that I'm almost certain will allow you to play your Panasonic SDR-S10 16:9 aspect ratio files in Windows Media Player so that they will display correctly as "widescreen" videos.

You have jogged my memory.

I remember using a program called "DVD Patcher" (FREE) here:

http://www.videohelp.com/tools/DVDPatcher

I used this FREE program after downloading it because I wanted to change the headers of some similar JVC Everio .MOD files so that they would play as widescreen, 16:9 aspect ratio files in Microsoft Windows Media Player.

This "DVD Patcher" program worked for me.

Try it.

I think it will work for you.

(If you're still reading this thread.)

Remember, the .MOD files are not just recorded by Panasonic camcorders.

You'll find those .MOD files are also recorded by some JVC camcorders.

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Old Feb 7, 2008, 11:16 PM   #29
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I'm still reading. Will try it. Thanks.
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Old Feb 8, 2008, 3:33 PM   #30
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I too have been very interested in this model myself since it uses MPEG2 like miniDVD camcorders but without the recording length limitation of the media. I was thinking that the video quality in low light should be better than the Sanyo's since it uses a much less densely packed imager of only 680K pixels more like a regular camcorder. I also tried the HD700 and in daylight, I have to say the image quality was amazing but in lower light the noise levels were high. Now I don't expect to be able to record in very low light without an external light source but it should be able to cope with regular indoor venues such as peter piper pizza etc. My old regular camcorder would've had no trouble and that was because of the non megapixel imager.

I have been wanting an inexpensive camcorder for use with my 2 year old that doesn't require much in the way of conversion. miniDVD recording times are too short, plus they have other disadvantages that go along with the fact that it's a mechanical recording system which I am trying to stay away from (ie like miniDV).

I have the Sanyo C40 which I love, but I am looking to see how this panasonic compares with it since I am one of those who rarely edits my video. I just archive them as they are, or burn it straight to DVD which in this case would be good as I wouldn't need to spend time converting it.

I am also looking at the 3CCD SDR-S150 since it's now only $399 on amazon.com. Does anyone here have the SDR-S150? I would like to compare a clip from that model with the SDR-s10 since I have heard it has very good image quality being 3 CCD.

Of course I like the fact that my C40 doubles as a decent still image camera as well. The HD700 was actually dissapointing in that regard and while I would've liked a camera that does both, if the panasonic can do good video indoors then I'll be happy with it just being a camcorder.

bgd73: That clip was great. I was able to download the original as well. I would be grateful it you could upload a clip with people in it to see who it would compare with what I mainly use my C40 for.

By the way, how does the EIS cope when you are walking? I actually found the EIS on my old JVC VHS-C camcorder coped with it pretty well while on my Sanyo C40 it doesn't seem to cope. Of course my old JVC had a bit more mass than these tiny devices which is probably why it coped a little better.
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