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View Poll Results: Are you interested in going 4k, and how much are you prepared to pay?:
Like a regressive, I am not interested in going 4k. 0 0%
I am willing to pay more than $500 for a 4k ultrahd hybrid camera. 1 50.00%
I am willing to pay $300-$500 for a 4k ultrahd hybrid camera. 0 0%
I am willing to pay less $300 for a 4k ultrahd hybrid camera, you stooges. 1 50.00%
I am willing to pay more than $5000 for a 4k ultrahd TV. 0 0%
I am willing to pay more than $3000-$5000 for a 4k ultrahd TV. 1 50.00%
I am willing to pay more than $2000-$3000 for a 4k ultrahd TV. 0 0%
I am willing to pay less than $2000 for a 4k ultrahd TV, you stooges. 0 0%
I am willing to pay more than $1000 for a 4k ultrahd monitor or 27-32 inch TV set. 1 50.00%
I am willing to pay less than $1000 for a 4k ultrahd monitor or 27-32 inch TV set, please! 1 50.00%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 2. You may not vote on this poll

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Old Jul 16, 2013, 11:35 AM   #81
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Default $699 39 inch UHDTV.

The absence of well priced Ultra HD cameras is blatant, but cheap Ultra HD TV's keep coming.

Seiki has announced a $699 39inch Ultra HD TV. At last, a descent monitor, but the previous 50 inch did not have 50/60p modes, and did not receive a thumbs up for professional grading work from some color graders I know. So the new set might be better or not. Looks like the 50 inch went for less $1000 at some stage.

http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2013/06/th...y-costs-us700/

The TV products section of the 4k resolution page at Wikipedia, has been upgraded with many cheap Ultra HD TV's:
Look at the features set of some of these at their brand websites.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/4K_resolution#TVs

Monitors remain expensive.
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Old Jul 18, 2013, 3:55 PM   #82
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OK, some concern has popped up with the ultra HD TV's. There are Ultra TV's with HDMI 1.4 spec but not the ultrahd mode. There are TV's that you have to use multiple HDMI cables to get a ultra HD signal into the. I don't think the industry is going towards consumer playback devices that support ultrahd all these cable connections. There are a lot of TV's limited to 30 frames a second ultrahd. The slow frame rate does not support the sort of 3D we expect.

HDMI 2.0 is coming, and it is said it will support at least ultra HD p60 in 8bits. More advanced version of Display port can support this, and some TV's have display port. Thunderbolt 1.0 does not support as high modes as display port native does. HDMI old version supports a lot less color purity (color rec 709 space) then the future ultra HD 2020 color space.

So if you want a better ultra hd tv set, check the specifications to see what it has.

I looked at the new 65 inch hisense set yesterday. It looked poor against fullhd sets a quarter the price. I fiddled with the settings and quickly got the picture up to looking better that the new Panasonic and lg fullhd sets next to it. However, it seems to lack the color purity, and maybe the color balance, of the fullhd $1700 set. I don't know if this is related to it running a fullhd input, but the website says that their tv sets go up to 105% of NTSC color space, the other sets are probably going a bit above this (maybe at least 120% NTSC) but the human eye can see around 200℅ NTSC. 105% is rather old hat for an expensive set, which maybe why the cheaper fullhd sets are now going for better color purity leading to a wider range of colour, but it is hard to tell.

Color balance, is where colors line ups ty the color they are supposed to be displaying on screen. Various TV's are not balanced, so the sky might not be right, or the Reds etc, because some other color is mixed in there, like yellow. Even though I could not get the TV to natch the other TV's above because of this (without a fair bit of playing around, and maybe using setup on external devices to get it right) it does not mean that this set is necessarily the unbalanced one, it could be the other set that has colour unbalance.

Wayne.

Last edited by Wayne12; Jul 18, 2013 at 4:04 PM.
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Old Sep 7, 2013, 9:30 AM   #83
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Default Cheap 4k 60p Acer camera/phone, 4k 30p Samsung Touch3. Sony Prosumer, gopro 4k 24p.

Finally, a 4k 60fps camcorder and it's a phone, and maybe a Tablet as well. I guess the extra functionality makes them true hybrids.
(15fps 4k is just a motion still camera, sorry gopro, but 24fos should be possible, more latter).

http://www.slashcam.com/news/single/...-4K-10865.html
http://www.tomshardware.com/news/ace...-s2,24096.html
http://nofilmschool.com/2013/09/acer...ng-smartphone/

I've put in some happening sites you guys should check out.

http://www.slashcam.com/news/single/...ng--10860.html

I can do some recommendations. My 7.7 inch amoled screen based tablet is pretty interesting to use for filming. The screen is pretty incredible, and you can see it on an angle, you can see what you are filming, but sunlight washes it out a bit, though their is a extra bright sunlight mode. So, this Samsung tablet, if it ever has 4k video recording might be best, except the tablet might be a bit big and heavy (if it was too thin and light it might get blown around on the other hand), but the Acer is going ti be smaller. It is worth trying out. If anybody releases a descent app for it, it might be very well. But in reality something that uses a Google glass like wearable screen and handheld camera instead is desirable

Sony has come up with an idea I had many years ago, an external attachable camera for your tablet or phone. Unlike when I had the idea, it has fast WiFi, likely WiFi direct. They have a hybrid sized sensor in one model, and a 1 inch in another, with zoom lens. WiFi is moving to 7 GB/s in future, so on be day some nice external cameras might be possible.

The 4k screen 20 inch Panasonic tablet is to be released at a great price not worth getting into, but at least it is a tough book (ussually hardened commercial casing).

Other:

Sony and Panasonic are developing a 300GB+ optical disc format for 2015.

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/300...nal,23723.html

HDMI 2.0 is out, with TVs, so it looks like those who said (elsewhere) it will take I'll next year for sets to be out, were wrong (but it did not make sense to insist a much delayed doable tech would be delayed like that, as delays allow doable tech to be released in products on release of the tech).
http://www.slashcam.com/news/single/...60p-10869.html

He, he, 4kp30 MHL USB video output on your phone.

http://www.slashcam.com/news/single/...dio-10847.html

Sony 4k p60 150mb/s FDR-AX1 prosumer camcorder and fullhd action cameras

http://www.engadget.com/2013/09/04/sony-4k-camcorder/

Pricy, think around the price of the Black Magic 4k 30fps camera, minus the quality, and a bit more price, but don't worry, it uses a hybrid sized sensor. At least my $59 fullhd camera won't be lonely. If you go through to the b&h link and their listing link, you notice that the 60fps mode is not twice the data rate of the ultrahd 30fps mode. Why is it so pricey? Well at least the JVC one might drop in price, I think it might use the same, or larger sensor. Tempting, Sony makes easy to use prosumer gear, because it is setup for videoing and instant end results rather than film production plus accessories to make it better for video use and footage processing. The difference between the Sony and the BM at uhd p30 should be significant in professional terms after the work is done if the bm footage, but the difference between the Sony and a descent $500 4k should not be much, if one ever could get made. I wonder if the Sony uses an ambarella chip? This would mean that ambarella chips would likely be between 64-80-100mb/s, the 150mb/s 60fps mode would likely be a special edition of the chip.

- 4k gopro 24fps.

OK, the problem with gopro not hitting 4k at 24 frames a second, is cooling. They use older ambarella chips, however, if you pulled one apart and put a descent circuit cooler in it (or with a new case) I imagine you should be able to hit 24fps. However, I imagine you would get better results from the gopro4 and whatever other camera is coming. How come others don't think of this?

- Side note.

You might notice I have stopped covering 4k display. Since you can get a 39 inch ultra HD TV for $699 (previous post), it is pretty much here. However, we have been waiting for a 4k Dell, Gateway etc monitor for 5 years. Dell has announced, Samsung has announced, Acer or Asus, Viewsonic, and Sharp has announced, LG is to come. So things are coming through there.

- Why has 4k taken so long.

What is happening, why has there been no cheaper 4k camera until now? What reason could there be, is it lack of part supply or tech, why and how, benign conspiracy, or do they just plane think alike? The fact is that 4k is at a level of older technology capability, and should have shipped 5-7 years ago with TV's. 8k is more cutting edge. Now even mobile phones and tablets can throw it in as a side feature. The days of control and financial privilege are over, let's support the new generation of cheap consumer 4k from arms gpu's and android. The more the merrier, let the camera companies compete, let the Chinese, Indians, SE Asian, South American and African take advantage of this.

- Will Steve's rise again?

They have to be serious about it, if things are moving to phone, tablet (interesting stuff, have used my small amoled tablet) action and r/c, then they need to make groups for them. People are even doing photography by r/c craft. In today's hybrid function, we need video on stills forum and advice, and as Small Video Stills (hybrids and some compacts) become more popular we need a forum for them. For now a Video Stills (hybrid, action, phone, tablet, and R/C) forum could attract enough people.


Luv you guys.

Last edited by Wayne12; Sep 8, 2013 at 8:42 AM.
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Old Sep 8, 2013, 8:28 AM   #84
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Default An external battery.

I've had a external battery recharge pack for some years now. I bought it to plug into my camcorders' recharge ports to recharge as I was using it, to extend battery life. Some camcorders don't allow you to do this. It cost $70. On holidays I saw a new one in a discount chain called "The Reject Shop" for $25 with I think doubles the battery, and 0.6 and a 2 amp USB power sockets and a torch led light (I will have to test how long it lasts on that battery, but it might be weeks nonstop). Good value. New battery technologies should extend such a product ten times in capacity eventually. Useful.
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Old Sep 13, 2013, 9:22 AM   #85
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Default 100 GB 4k Bluray discs and the mystery of Sony 4k.

Well, good news, for me at least. It appears the bluray consortium is working on 3 layer 100GB disks. I might have a player allready. Mine is a portable external drive that suports xl 3 layer discs that I could connect up to a Mac pro (probably won't work properly even then as it is a prior machine) which is one reason I bought it.

http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2013/09/le...100gb-of-data/

One of the commenters on article commented about the 4k movies that came with the 4k Sony TV's. He said they matched the 4k upscaling algorithm to the 4k film to 2k downscaling algorithm originally used to restore it to 4k. Exactly the scheme I proposed many years ago in a forum they would be reading. I was wondering what they had done to get the extra compression. Only dumb jackasses wouldn't listen. There is another compression leading company running scared they don't want to tell me how they are achieving their less than top rate compression.so I can compare it to my old posts and my private schemes.
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Old Sep 13, 2013, 9:28 AM   #86
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The so called violet ray disc would be latter. It might be possible to read such a disc with blueray tech through some technique. Such technique could yield over a terabyte of data on a single layer. My guess is that Vray will be 100-300GB a layer.

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Old Sep 14, 2013, 4:44 AM   #87
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Default List of ambarella based cameras:

Come across ambarella camera listings at alibaba with over 18 thousand products from 172 suppliers:

http://www.alibaba.com/showroom/amba...10202060030001

You notice you can type in for action cams etc.

Unfortunately it looks like you gave to enter different searches for 4k ultrahd, ultra-HD, ultra HD, uhd, 2160p, 3840. For now I'm just getting umbrella listings as it can't find ambarella 4k ones.

Just one 4k android media player:

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/88..._4K_2160P.html
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Old Sep 14, 2013, 8:54 AM   #88
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price ~ $80








with camera & mic ~ $100













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Old Sep 14, 2013, 11:41 AM   #89
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Yes Donald, thanks.

When you say $100 with camera and mic, which did you mean?

In case you haven't been for a while, there are links to two 4k camera phablet phones, and a $699 4k 39 inch TV. I'm waiting to find out more about the Acer 4k phone. Price is late $500 to early $700, October release I think. The gopro 4 people are speculating this year. I'm looking at buying a black magic pocket cinema camera.

Indeed with those android things you pointed out we are getting close to being able to make our own 4k cameras, instead of waiting on companies to release cameras. We can add external camera, controls and mic to a tablet, or just a program on a 4k tablet. Time to talk to some people. They may not turn out to be as fast or low powered, but they can be here months to years before the industry will give us them, and with what we want. Android was originally designed as an camera OS.
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Old Sep 14, 2013, 11:44 AM   #90
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There is open source camera software out there for years from our old group. Keeping it simple, it could record something recordable to dual ssd using less of the cores performance. Any under clock will give some power saving and reduce heat.
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