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Old Jul 22, 2007, 12:42 PM   #11
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Hi.

I just bought the Kodak Z712. I love the camera and the disposable it came with lasted a fairly long time (got around 250-300 shoots and lasted 5-6 hours with the scren on and playing withthe settings alot).

unfortunitly when looking for a battery I just bought an Energizer CR-V3 (only recharables the store had). At full charge the battery lasts for around 1 hour :X
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Old Jul 22, 2007, 7:20 PM   #12
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wizuriel wrote:
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...I just bought an Energizer CR-V3 (only recharables the store had). At full charge the battery lasts for around 1 hour
As you may have seen, we've been discussing CR-V3-style batteries round here and in the 'Batteries and Power supplies' forum.

It's far from the clear how well the 'rechargeable CR-V3' batteries you and I have will work the camera, and what their performance is relative to the recommended Kodak KLIC-8000, and its cheaper substitutes. The Z712 and Z612 cameras have three battery contacts, and will use different pairs with the CR-V3 and KLIC-8000 batteries. You, 'wizuriel' ,are the only person other than me who's reported using 'rechargeable CR-V3' here. Other users were either provided with or purchased KLIC-8000s. I note that my two CR-V3s are 1300 and 1350mAh, and the KLIC-8000 is 1600mAh.

I have been concerned at how little warning I have had of impending shutdown, but users with KLIC-8000 seem to find no problem. However, I had little warning when a disposable CR-V3 ran out, so for all I know it may be my specimen of camera that's different.

When I read your alarming message about short battery life, I went straight to the camera and switched it on, to find that it extended the lens and then retracted it again, showing battery exhaustion. Not knowing what to expect, Ihad not particularly noticed short battery life. Now I've done my best to see how many shots I've got out of a fully-charged 'rechargeable CR-V3'.

I'm only certain about the last charge, lasting from 4th July to today, and I think I've taken 90 shots. I use the electronic viewfinder mostly, and the screen for occasional reviewing, or when I have to hold the camera away from my eye. The camera has seldom been switched on for very long at a time. There's been lots of zooming.

Since I acquired my 2 CR-V3 rechargeables on 5th June, I reckon I've taken at least 507 shots, on a minimum of 4 and probable maximum of 6 charges. So the lifetime is a lot less than folk report for KLIC-8000s, but probably quite usable for my purposes, especially as I have two batteries and a spare disposable. The pair have behaved quite consisently, registering the same terminal voltages and discharge currents through standard resistors both fully charged, and after camera automatic shutdown; about 3.8V at start and 3.1V at finish.

I am annoyed that in the UK at least, a KLIC-8000 & charger was supplied with the Z612, but only a disposable CR-V3 with the Z712, presumably to keep the price down. Now I discover that to get optimal performance I may well have to buy the proper battery & charger anyway.

To be fair Kodak do say in the online manual that rechargeable batteries from other other manufacturers won't do. It doesn't say that explicitly in the 'Getting started' bookletthat comes in the package. My pretty expert camera dealer and I naturally assumed that Kodak were promoting their own battery for commercial rather than technical reasons.

So, given your and my experience, we should probably recommend folk to get KLIC-8000. Any further reports from users or experts would be very welcome. I think the camera may be shutting down on the CR-V3 rechargeables when there's still plenty of energy left.

The camera is wonderful, by the way.


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Old Jul 22, 2007, 9:04 PM   #13
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yeah I've oredered a KLIC 8000 batteries and just waiting for it to arrive. not wanting to take another risk with CR-V3 (really pissed off that the store expert sold me it and won't take it back). Hoping the KLIC work better (ordered from http://www.bestbatt.com/)

just tried the energizer again. at full charge without taking any shoots (though having the LCD on) the battery lasted 51min before powering down.

actually when they list batteries on the kodak site they do say only disposable for CRV3
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Old Jul 22, 2007, 11:15 PM   #14
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wizuriel wrote:
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(really angry off that the store expert sold me it and won't take it back). ......
.....actually when they list batteries on the kodak site they do say only disposable for CRV3
It's not an unreasonable assumption that if a disposable works, a rechargeable variety will. If you follow links...

http://wwwuk.kodak.com/global/en/ser...?pq-path=10725; then "battery compatibility" , you go to...

http://wwwuk.kodak.com/global/en/ser...mp;camera=Z712

...where you see Ni-MH, which won't work, and if you click "First select your camera" the Z712 isn't listed, and if you choose "Z612" instead, you get....

http://wwwuk.kodak.com/global/en/ser...ml?camera=Z612

...which correctly lists the two options that actually apply to both the Z612 and the Z712, but doesn't explicitly say that the rechargeable varieties of CR-V3 won't work very well.

So it's an easy mistake to make!

Hi, ho. Good luck!

Alan T
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Old Jul 22, 2007, 11:46 PM   #15
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Ni-MH won't work in the Z712? They are also listed in the manual as a compatable battery type :?:
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Old Jul 23, 2007, 12:05 AM   #16
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wizuriel wrote:
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Ni-MH won't work in the Z712? They are also listed in the manual as a compatable battery type :?
Oh dear, I'm getting more and more confused, just when I thought I was beginning to understand it all. I've tried Ni-MH, and got even worse results than the 'rechargeable CR-V3' ones you found, and I fear, and I haven't seen anything that says Ni-MH will work on the Z712. If possible, can you show me exactly where you saw that, please?

Have you read all the previous stuff in the 'Batteries or pwer packs' forum around these issues?

See http://forums.steves-digicams.com/fo...mp;forum_id=51

http://forums.steves-digicams.com/fo...mp;forum_id=51

http://forums.steves-digicams.com/fo...mp;forum_id=51

and http://forums.steves-digicams.com/fo...mp;forum_id=51

And after all that, it's still not clear! I've probably left some threads out as well.
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Old Jul 23, 2007, 3:41 AM   #17
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As I wrote earlier, someone tried the Ni-MH and said it lasted for 50-70 shoots, 2600mAh ones without using LCD and little to no zoom.
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Old Jul 25, 2007, 8:48 AM   #18
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Just to let you know that I ordered the Z712 and will be posting my first pictures as soon as I get it :G

Thank you all!
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Old Jul 26, 2007, 9:39 AM   #19
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Karsa wrote:
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As I wrote earlier, someone tried the Ni-MH and said it lasted for 50-70 shoots, 2600mAh ones without using LCD and little to no zoom.
I'd love to hear how you get on with the Z712 & Ni-MH. I'd recommend you carry a disposable CR-V3 primary lithium battery as well, as a backup. They have a long shelf life; it says until 2016 on mine, and will take a large number of shots, reliably.

Please tell us your results. This will help eliminate variations between different specimens of the same camera.

Igot extremely variable, but usually unsatisfactory performance withNi-MH. Just once I got many tens of shots. More often it was just a few. Since trying them a few times and experimenting a bit, I've been using 'rechargeable CR-V3' Li-ion power. I'm concerned that even thatmay not be giving reasonable life reliably. I might well have to buy a KLIC-8000 and charger when I've finished experimenting. Kodak'sinstructions make it clear that they consider Ni-MH unsuitable in the Z712.

I can theorise about why this may be, but I'd really like to hear authoritatatively from someone expert in batteries and in camera electronics & power.

These cells have quite a flat voltage vs time curve as they are discharged. It's important particularly for Li-ion batteries that they be shut down in good time. Some threshold voltage will have to be set to provoke 'low battery' then shutdown. With a steep bit at the end of the plateau it must be difficult to decide the shutdown voltage, whichmay therefore vary from camera to camera.

The current drawn will drop the battery terminal voltage to varying degrees, depending on state of charge and internal resistance. The shutdown might occur immediately a large current drops the voltage a lot, e.g., writing to disk, screen on, zooming, focusing and stabilising at the same time, or maybe it'll tolerate transient current peaks/voltage dips.The current-voltage-time characteristics of each battery chemistry differ.

So it's not surprising that folkreport, and sometimes notice, great differences in battery life between charges.

Good luck! Alan T
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Old Jul 26, 2007, 11:56 AM   #20
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I was just reporting what someone else said... I already ordered a pack of 2 rechargeable CR-V3 Li-ion + charger for myself.
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