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Old Oct 11, 2002, 8:29 AM   #11
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There's no such thing as 5600HS without ADI support (D)
Good point! However if one needs to have cheap muti-slave units, the 5400HS, 5400xi, (or even the 5200xi) can served as remote slaves since they all support the wireless function, and can be had for a bargain on the 2nd-hand market... (ie only the 5600HS-D need to be mounted on the camera).

Ditto for the 3x00xi series...
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Old Oct 11, 2002, 12:25 PM   #12
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Default Inly 3600 and 5600 support preflash metering

"Good point! However if one needs to have cheap muti-slave units, the 5400HS, 5400xi, (or even the 5200xi) can served as remote slaves since they all support the wireless function"

Wrong again. There are two wireless modes. The normal/old (introduced ten yers ago) wireless mode is based on OTF-TTL metering - there's no pre-flash, but the camera meters light while the shutter is open and commands the slaves to stop when the proper exposure has been achieved. Of course, the communication between the master and the slaves takes some time and, as a result, the sync speed is only 1/60 s.

The Dynax/Maxxum 7 introduced a new wireless mode called HSS wireless. It's based on pre-flash metering - that's the only kind of metering the D7i/Hi are capable of. The only flash units supporting HSS wireless are the 3600 and the 5600.

I'm afraid it's not possible to use the 5400HS etc. as wireless slaves. I've not tested them, but for above mentioned reasons I'm quite sure they won't work. I also assume that most (all?) 3rd party flash units (from Sigma etc.) only support the old wireless mode.

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Old Oct 11, 2002, 3:01 PM   #13
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The xi does not support High Speed Sync but the HS does (ie the 5400HS). Only the D can pre-flash on the 7i/hi.

The wireless feature seems to work similarly on all three HS-D, HS, xi with my 9xi film camera (even with the IR controller).

Can one actually do HSS in the wireless mode? The mode selection on the flashes prevent from doing both (ie one has to pick HSS or wireless, but not both!).
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Old Oct 11, 2002, 3:14 PM   #14
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Default Still can't edit yet !!!

... and BTW the 5600HSS-D manual still shows that one can interchageably use the 5400HS or 5400xi or 3500xi in the wireless mode as slaves.
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Old Oct 11, 2002, 4:39 PM   #15
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Default Dimage needs pre-flash for metering

> The xi does not support High Speed Sync but the HS does (ie the 5400HS).

In this case, HSS stands for flat pulse flash (the flash fires a rapid series of pulses while a narrow slit travels over the film frame - the shutter is never fully open if the shutter speed is faster than the x-sync speed). It is needed whenever the shutter speed is higher than the X-sync speed.

However, the wireless HSS is simply bad terminology (Minolta's mistake). It means that the shutter speed can be higher than 1/60 s. I've never seen a decent description of this mode - all I know is that it is based on pre-flash metering.

I'm assuming the D7i/Hi is using this mode, because it NEEDS a pre-flash for metering purposes (no dedicated flash sensor).

> Only the D can pre-flash on the 7i/hi.

Exactly. That's why flash metering does not work with older units.

> The wireless feature seems to work similarly on all three HS-D, HS, xi with my 9xi film camera (even with the IR controller).

Because your camera only supports the old (max. 1/60 s) wireless mode. I bet you can see only one flash pulse, the built-in flash and the slaves seem to fire at the same time and only once.

The D7i is different. There's definitely a pre-flash. In fact, more than just one pre-flash - the slave seems to fire twice and the built-in flash two or three times.

> Can one actually do HSS in the wireless mode? The mode selection on the flashes prevent from doing both (ie one has to pick HSS or wireless, but not both!).

I don't think wireless HSS has anything to do with the "real" HSS mode. According to the manual (of the 5600 flash unit) the max. sync speed in this mode is 1/200 s. Interestingly, this is the same as the x-sync speed of the Maxxum/Dynax 7 (the only camera supporting this mode at the time the manual was written). But D7i is able to exceed this limit. It has no trouble syncing at 1/2000 s!

Looks like the wireless HSS mode is based on pre-flash metering, but the main flash is a normal, single pulse. On the other hand, the normal wireless mode is based on pulsed flash - are you confused enough?

:P

Conclusion:
It's not possible to use the 5400HS as a wireless slave, because it doesn't support pre-flash metering. However, it will work OK with all Maxxum/Dynax bodies and you can use it along with 5600 units. The manual of the 5600 unit was written a couple of years before the D7(H)i. That's why it (and it's limitations) are not mentioned.

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Old Oct 12, 2002, 12:01 AM   #16
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Is the model naked?
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Old Oct 12, 2002, 4:40 AM   #17
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Default After checking the manual again...

Oops, I really should learn to check the manual before writing anything.

There seems to be TREE wireless flash modes. The manual describes them very vaguely:

"Other than HSS modes:
Maximum 1/60 sec
1/60-1/200 sec"

I guess the only difference between those modes is when metering is carried out; during the exposure (OTF-metering) or before it (pre-flash TTL). The guide numbers seem to be identical.

But there's indeed a wireless high speed sync mode I forgot in my previous message:
"HSS: 1/250-1/4000 sec"

The guide number is lower in this mode indicating that it is using pulsed flash.

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Old Oct 12, 2002, 6:39 AM   #18
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Default Exactly...

In small print, they also listed throughout the manual some film cameras supporting HSS wireless flash or not (but no digicams). My understanding from the 5600HS-D manual:

2 wireless modes of operation charted out:
o HSS mode.
o Other than HSS modes.

Film cameras do OTF-metering, whereas the Sony based CCD's digicams(F7x7, CP5x00, D7i/hi) do a pre-flash TTL. This is caused by the cameras implementation of using the CCD itself to meter the flash pulse prior to the real shot where the CCD will be too busy sampling the real picture data to control the flashes! I don't have a d7i/Hi yet to try, but my guess is if one does studio shoot @ 1/60-1/200 (ie non HSS mode), the 5600HS-D on a D7i/hi will be able to control the older flashes wirelessly... which it indeed does on an 9xi!



However in getting back to the original question on multi-burts strobe mode, the camera needs to be set on manual anyhow, and the manual shows how to compute and set the shutter speed depending on how many flash pulses anyone wants to set his/her camera & flash combination. The bottom line is this camera/flash system is pretty comprehensive and very well thought out (unlike in comparison to Canon/Nikon digital offerings in the same price range or even higher!).
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