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-   Memory Cards, Microdrives, Card Readers (https://forums.steves-digicams.com/memory-cards-microdrives-card-readers-51/)
-   -   Rio Carbon Player - Seagate 5GB Microdrive (https://forums.steves-digicams.com/memory-cards-microdrives-card-readers-51/rio-carbon-player-seagate-5gb-microdrive-34657/)

iGa Jan 19, 2005 5:34 PM

Dear Steve & Everybody

If you'll be able to reach a hand here, I'm already frustrated... :?

Bought a Creative MuVo2 FM with the Seagate 5GB in it.
Replaced the card with a former Hitachi 4GB I had.
Formatted, Firwared, The player rocks, thanks god.

But then I went to deal with the 5GB card -
Thought it would be a piece of cake...

Formatted in PC - Worked there & recognized,
but when I entered it to my Rebel Digital
(The reason I bought the whole thing)
I just keep getting ERR 02.

[Card in, Camera On, EOS on LCD for a minute, then ERR 02 and freeze]

Please, if anyone has a way of trying to get this fixed, I'll be very grateful. :-)

Info from back of card:

SN: 3MEOQQW1
P/N: 9AF212-001
Model: ST650211CF Date: 05134
Warranty void if seal is removed
[but wasn't any seal]
Product of Singapore

And after the 'Do Not Seal this hole' it says
'For Embedded Application Only' :O

Does it say that always or did they did that trick again?!

Thanks so very much!
[email protected]

iGa Jan 19, 2005 8:06 PM

By the way - forgot to mention - no Firmware number on back of card...

I just don't get it - it's not IDE locked, right?
It works in my computer!!

So why not in the digital rebel camera?

:mad:

steve Jan 20, 2005 12:23 AM

Well, there is no guarantee that the latest ST1 drives will work in cameras. Same thing happened with the Hitachi 4GB drives in later Muvo2 and mini-iPod players. They purposely made them -not- work with cameras, only mp3 players. Seagate will be selling their 5GB Photo Drive soon though.

Here's what the back of my ST1 drive looks like, it does work in cameras.

http://www.steves-digicams.com/dl/st1.jpg

iGa Jan 20, 2005 5:47 AM

1 Attachment(s)
Dear Steve,

I appreciate your response, but am not willing to surrender...

Is it logical - that it will work in the computer but not in camera?

regards, and thanks.

Here's my card:

Madwand Jan 20, 2005 3:00 PM

Quote:

I recently readareview of the Seagate against both a 4gb Hitachi and GS Magicstor 2.2gb microdrives thatkinda showed the Seagate in the performance lead... although they weren't "in camera" tests....check it out over at X-bit labs for the review.
Thanks, but I've done my own measurements in-camera. These were documented here:

http://www.photo.net/bboard/q-and-a-...?msg_id=009t7K

So no third-party report is going to convince me that the Seagate is faster than the Hitachi, when I've done the measurements myself. Check my post to see if you can find any flaws in the method. This method can also be used by anyone, with their camera and choice of memory cards. Of course, it requires that the storage card works in the particular camera... Based on my own tests, I wouldn't bother with the Seagate further and would go with the 4GB Hitachi, esp. a retail one at the reduced retail price.

hotate Feb 3, 2005 12:16 PM

Hi guys... :bye:

As this is my first post, I'd just like toquickly say thanksfor Steve'sbrilliant and informative service... It's most definately a service I've come to rely on...

Anyway.. Does anyone have a list of what CF cards you put back into the Rio to replace the ST1?

After pulling the ST1 out of my Rio Carbon... found out that the card i'd intended to replace it with wasn't compatible... so I was hoping that some kind soul might give me some indication what cards i can choose from for replacements...

Thanks in advance... ;)

MarcoD Feb 5, 2005 1:44 PM

Hi,



I have the same problem and I started another thread on this (Seagate ST1 5Gb not working on Canon 20D).

One guy there belives that models with the firmware indication on the back won't work, but from what I can see from your image this is not true (you have not firmware indication on the back and your drive doesn't work too).

Please anyone who can help post answers in both threads.



Thank you



Solaris Feb 18, 2005 7:58 AM

Yeh there all, I've read through many posts about this and found out I have a seagate 5gb St1 drive witht he firmware that disables camera support (canon 300d). I'm about to sell it online but would like to check if anyone has found a way to rewrite the firmware on the card or camera to support the card somehow.

Basicly what I need to know is: Sell it or not?

Thanks :)

motorcyclefreako Feb 19, 2005 10:42 PM

Hello, Im new to the forums and wanted to say Hi. Anyway, Could someone tell me if this drive will work on digital camera? if so, witch ones. I got it out of a rio carbon and wanted to know witch camera to buy to put it in. Thanks

http://www.freewebs.com/motorcyclefreako/untitled.JPG

steve Feb 25, 2005 11:53 AM

Guys - Seagate has stated that none of the 5GB ST-1 drives were made for use in cameras so why beat a dead horse? Seagate will soon release its PhotoDrive with a fully CF-II compliant interface and these will work in cameras.

Hitachi just announced their new 6GB Microdrive for $299, available very soon!

SAN JOSE, Calif.--Feb. 23, 2005--Users of miniature MP3 players and other storage-demanding handheld consumer electronics can rejoice today as Hitachi Global Storage Technologies begins shipping its 6 gigabyte(a) (GB) one-inch hard drive in high volume. With 6 GB, the new Microdrive lets consumers carry even more of what they love -- 1500-3000 songs, 6,000 pictures (1 MB each) or 8 hours of MPEG-4 video(b). Hitachi is making all this possible, now, at a significant price reduction, retailing the 6 GB Microdrive for $299 USD or pennies per megabyte.

Read the Hitachi press release.

http://www.steves-digicams.com/micro...b_film_500.jpg

tcharron Mar 23, 2005 3:05 PM

1 Attachment(s)
It seems to me that the date field is the key to whether the ST1 works in digital cameras. From what I've noticed, dates less than 05090 seem to work, and dates above 05090 don't.

On a related note, check out Ebay auction #7503032450 -- a 4G Seagate ST1! The model # is ST640211CF, which doesn't match anything in Google. Here is the picture of the back (FW: 3.07, and date is 05253):





Cobray380 Apr 18, 2005 12:28 PM

Hi, I've bin reading about all the problems everyone having with ST-1 drive. I bought a Rio carbon in November 04 for the drive it try in my new Konica Minolta DiMAGE A2 and no, it did not work. Tried to format in the camera with no luck. Formatted it FAT32 in my desktop comp that I have a PCMCIA slot that's wired through a PCI card, not a USB. Worked as it should as a hard drive with no problems. Still didn't work in camera. So not knowing the size of the drive the camera could support. I booted up XP install disk and partitioned the drive half the size (2.5gb) FAT32 and (2.5 unformatted)it worked! I was able to get the card working as a 3.7gb drive. Any bigger with no luck. The card is to slow for pictures @ 3264x2448 but for movies @ 544x40830fps worksand holdsover 1 hour of movies (15min max each file)@ 945 KB / second. The only problem I have now with the card is when it goes to sleep. The camera will not read the card. I have to power off the camera and wait 1 min. andthen itwill work.

Steve

seagate May 4, 2005 2:30 AM

I have extracted the seagate st1 5g drive in muvo2 fm, it can not work neither in usb card readernor digital camera.Under windows 2000, use usb reader can not detect the disk existed. Under digital camera, it display "no disk" error.
Have anybody the same situation with me?

SN: 3ME0Q2XY
P/N: 9AF212-001
Model: ST650211CF
Date: 05133

bonus45 May 22, 2005 3:44 PM

Hey sorry to butt in on the conversation, but here's a 5gb Carbon for $149. Decent deal ?

http://www.woot.com/woot_detail.aspx

ardhuru Jul 7, 2005 9:52 AM

Hi guys,

My Crabon Rio started behaving erratically, so I flashed the firmware. Now, the 5 GB seems to be corrupted, but does not format thru' Windows (XP with SP2). (Windows displays the message that it was unable to complete format).

I'm hoping I can extract it from the RIO, and format it using a card reader.

My question is, hhow does one open the Rio? With the rubberlike gasket around the center, does the fron (LCD) side come off or the bottom half?

And once opened, does it close again or do the panels get twisted out of shape?

Any advice would be HIGHLY appreciated!





bwiese Jul 7, 2005 6:02 PM

I recently wrote about these matters in thread, 4GB Microdrive from Apple miniIPOD in this forum.

This is similar: if the drive doesn't have a "CF" or "CF+" logo on its label it's quite
likely not CF compliant - though not guaranteed not to be so! - and only
works in "True IDE" (aka True ATA) mode - that is, essentially exactly like a 3.5"
IDE HDD inside your PC.

Thus, this is NOT a CF card even though it's in a CF-form-factor casing.

I'm betting that large OEM consumer electronic purchasers for drives like the
Seagate and Hitachi microdrives are able to get a bit of discount for not being
fully CF compliant: no special CF interface logic or attribute memory, etc. are
needed, less firmware, less internal wiring, and less testing required. Of a
50pin CF connector, IIRC, less than 40 pins are required to be connected for
TrueIDE mode. These OEM customers are perfectly happy 'talking' to these
drives in TrueIDE mode, and using other CF modes (memory-mapped, or one
of the I/O mapped modes) might be more troublesome.

Drives extracted from equipment like iPODs and Rio Carbons were never
designed to be used elsewhere.

BTW some PC card readers will attempt to read CF-form-factor cards in IDE mode,
while others will try to use a CF mode. Hit or miss, I'd guess: some readers
will be able to read/format these, while others won't. The readers that have
no hardware and connect straight to IDE cable should be able always read
any CF card or even these iPOD Mini or Rio Carbon drives that run in IDE only
mode. USB-attached CF card readers are more likely to have problems.

For whatever reason, Canon and other digicam companies choose to run their
CF-form-factor memory devices in a CF mode and not True IDE mode - it seems
that the new CF+ memory card standard no longer mandates that storage cards
do offer TrueIDE mode (unlike orig. CF spec) - although I don't think I've ever
heard of any CF+ storage cards lacking a TrueIDE mode.

BTW, even if you get the right kinda CF HDD, there's other things that may or
may not cause problems: FAT16 vs FAT32 formatting, multiple partitions might
cause problems, etc. I would generally always let the CAMERA format the CF
card or CF HDD. Putting in a card formatted by a Windows box may confuse
the camera: there are quite a few default options for formatting that Windows
uses that might not quite be suitable for a camera - using Windows CHDDSK
and FDISK utiltiies on a camera-formatted disk while in a PC reader may give
useful info.

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA USA























dsahota Aug 15, 2005 11:57 AM

So does anyone know where i can find a 5gb zif style connector driveto putinto a Rio Nitrus. Everyone seems to be going the otherway.

Lin Evans Aug 28, 2005 5:54 PM

steve wrote:
Quote:

Well, there is no guarantee that the latest ST1 drives will work in cameras. Same thing happened with the Hitachi 4GB drives in later Muvo2 and mini-iPod players. They purposely made them -not- work with cameras, only mp3 players. Seagate will be selling their 5GB Photo Drive soon though.

Here's what the back of my ST1 drive looks like, it does work in cameras.

http://www.steves-digicams.com/dl/st1.jpg
Quote:

Some, but not all digital cameras require a CF Compliancy bit which is likely missing from the drives which do not work in your digital cameras.
Quote:

Several years ago I purchased a coupleIBM OEM products (1 gigabyte microdrive made by IBM and OEM'd by iOmega) which eventually failed in my D30 but were recognized in several of my non dSLR cameras. After much investigation I discovered that this CF compliancy bit was contained in the controller chip and could not be accessed through normal means. To refresh this damaged firmware requires specialized equipment and I could not get either iOmega, IBM nor Hitache (who purchased the IBM license and now manufacturers the drive) to own up to either the problem or how to fix it. As it is I now have two 1 gigabyte micro drives which are only useful in a few of my digital cameras which don't query the firmware about this CF compliancy bit.
Quote:

Just be aware that this small change in firmware in the controller will render a microdrive useless in many of your cameras. It will work in a PC or in a few digicams which allow microdrives but don't look for the CF compliancy....
Quote:

Lin

ahdi Oct 17, 2005 7:26 AM

Hi Everyone.. I`m a newbie in this forum and came across this forum on other websites.. For your info.. Seagate Drive is CAT into 2 firmware version.. The OEM & the Retail version... All the drives U get from players are in the OEM firmware, tat explains why U can`t use it on camera. For others that manage to get the older version and can`t use it on your cameras.. Try updating your camera firmware.. It was solved in most of the CFII cameras.... Enjoy.. Feel free to ask abt this issue as... I`m working in one of the major companies producing CF.

bwiese Oct 18, 2005 4:59 PM

Ahdi...

Some/many CF digicams simply cannot run their CF slot in TrueIDE (a.k.a. TrueATA)mode; the wiring & firmware support isn't there. Even with a firmware update, some wiring/timing issues could remain.

Thus OEM drives like Hitachi & Seagate that support only TrueIDE (and not the CF memory- & I/O-mapped) modes will never work in many of these cameras.

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA



ahdi Oct 20, 2005 11:24 PM

bwiese...

Wat I mean by updating the camera`s firmware is for the Retail microdrive to be able to be use in some of the cameras like Nikon 8400, 8800 or D2H.

It is true that the OEM drive is not able to be use in the camera as the code in the OEM microdrive is not CF enabled thus it only runs in True IDE. If U want ur OEM drive to be able to use as a Retail drive. U got to reflash the Retail code into it.

bwiese Oct 21, 2005 12:48 AM

Ahdi...

The OEM vs retail microdrives could differ in hardware as well as firmware. This may vary by mfgr and model (i.e., Seagate vs Hitachi vs orig IBM...)

CF cards need nearly 50 pins' worth of signals to be fully CF compliant, while TrueIDE needs less than 40 (not counting power & ground). A simpler interface could thus be used - meaning not all pins would be brought out to the CF connector and many CF pins would be 'dead'. So even if new firmware were burned in, this might prevent CF functionality from being active.

And no attribute memory is required for IDE mode. Simpler and more compact firmware would result from no support of CF mode, significantly saving ROM space and chip I/O features - reducing chip area.

Many drives use mask ROM to store their firmware, mask ROM is not updateable w/o replacing the chip that contains it.



Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA

mspivak Oct 22, 2005 2:11 PM

I purchased a Seagate Micro Drive on Ebay. It worked perfectly in my Canon Rebel XT for 3 months and than failed when it was put into my SanDisk Card Reader. Prior to that time it worked with the SanDisk for the entire three months. It has never worked again. Unable to format, read, etc.

BEWARE, Seagate will not provide warranty service on these drives, which have been removed from MP3 players.

Does anyone know if these drives can be repaired?

vaaliben Dec 11, 2005 4:54 AM

HI,

I just boughtthe Seagate 5GB ST1 drive for my HP ipaq 2415 PDA. The PDA does not recognize this so called Type II CF card. Can any one please tell/help me how to make the ST1 drive work on my PDA? I am planning to use this drive only for my pda and nothing else. If anyone knows the steps/procedures involed in making this work, you can either reply to this thread or email me at [email protected]. I would greatly appreciate your help.

bwiese Dec 13, 2005 6:09 PM

Vaaliben...

Sorry, but there's probably nothing you can do. If you look in previous posts in this thread and a few others here, this likely is just a smalldrive in a CF Type II casing, but is not a Type II-electrical spec CF card.

The card you have likely only runs in "TrueIDE"/"TrueATA" mode ONLY,while your pocket computer does not want to use this mode - it wants to communicate with CF card in either a memory-mapped or I/O-mapped mode, along with special attribute memory telling the host device what its capabilities & features are.

Many drives like these were removed from consumer devices; they were not designed to work as CF cards. I doubt you'll see any "CF" logo on this drive, either.

There are many of these drives being sold on EBay, etc. incorrectly being called CF drives. These drives have been scrapped from Rio Carbons - and similarly-crippled Hitachi drives from Apple iPOD Minis have the same issues.

These drives had features removed to drive costs down for large OEM customers making consumer electronics devices that don't need a removable drive.

You didn't buy this actual drive in a factory package, did you? What did the packaging say?



Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA





vaaliben Dec 15, 2005 1:16 PM

No, it did not say CF any where on the card. It only said 5GB ST1 and had a FW: 3.08 on the back of the card. But, the online retailerI bought it from said that it is a CF type II card and would work with my PDA. Hell no! So I returned the item for a full refund.

Thanks.

bwiese Dec 15, 2005 1:35 PM

vaaliben wrote:
Quote:

No, it did not say CF any where on the card. It only said 5GB ST1 and had a FW: 3.08 on the back of the card. But, the online retailerI bought it from said that it is a CF type II card and would work with my PDA. Hell no! So I returned the item for a full refund.

Thanks.
Your salesman/retailer just doesn't know what's what. Just because it looks like a CF card doesn't mean it is one ;) It is just CF Type II form-factor, that's all.

There are prob lots of these drives coming on the market as manufacturer overrruns, surplus (or even out-of-spec rejects). Your retailer was probably a victim of this too.

Your drive is essentiallyan IDE drive in a small package without CF electronics.

Bill Wiese
San Jose CA USA

5.9LITRE Dec 25, 2005 6:02 PM

I bought a Seagate 5gb St1 drive and it says firmware 3.04.

I read through all these replies but unlike people trying to get them to work as CF cards in digital cameras or PDAs, I'm just trying to use mine in a computer.

I plugged mine into a PCMCIA adapter and into the slot (just like you use other microdrives) and it says "Seagate ST1 recognized" then "ATA/IDE Controller installing hardware" then "your hardware has been properly installed and is ready for use"

However, then there is no drive listed in my computer, under disk management or if i select defrag disks.



Is my Seagate drive dead (can't tell if it's even spinning but wouldn't it have never been recognized in the first place if it was dead?) OR does it just need formatted/installed (which I don't know how to do) OR does a PCMCIA adapter slot mean it is trying to read it as a CF card? It really should work shouldn't it? I understand if it didn't work in a certain camera or as a CF drive but I am just plugging it into a compatible computer's PCMCIA drive.



Any help would be GREATLY appreciated. Thanks!

AbeFM Jan 5, 2006 1:35 PM

5.9 - whats the "date code" on the back?

5.9LITRE Jan 5, 2006 6:32 PM

i don't have the drive on me right now so i can't check. it is 3.04 firmware release and date code was like 052805 or something like that I don't remember.

Anyway, I figured maybe the PCMCIA adapter wasn't giving it enough power so I bought a USB compact flash reader and that works. Which kinda sucks but it will do I guess.

filtrate Mar 19, 2006 10:41 PM

Hi, I.ve had a rio carbon for two years and it now it broke.. the wheel for turning up the vol broke.. so i took the CF drive out... can't seem to be able to format the FC using a dazzle card reader... Can i get some HELP on the subject?

bwiese May 25, 2006 11:18 AM

Filtrate..

You'll have to try a variety of new card readers. Your Rio Carbon drive prob only runs in TrueIDE mode, and many if not most USB CF readers run CF devices in memory mapped mode.

The drive from your Rio Carbon is not really a CF drive even though it looks like it. Similar results are experienced by folks removing them from Apple iPods/iPod Minis and not being able to use them in their digital cameras.

Bill Wiese
San Jose, CA


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