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Old Aug 25, 2013, 10:36 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by Greg Chappell View Post
Salivating as I check that lens out.

Warming up the credit card now...
Hey, I have a question for Greg and the rest of the folks here.

My most used lens is the f/2 14-35 on the E5. For indoor available light event photography I'm shooting at ISO 1250 and f/2 to get a marginally adequate shutter speed and reasonably low noise. That rig gets pretty heavy after a couple of hours, and assuming I win the lottery I would love to get a camera body + lens that weighs less if I could get close to the IQ of the 14-35.

That m43 12-40 is one stop slower - do you have any idea how much usable ISO I would get with this new camera body? That would be a heck of a lot of money to spend if I only gained one effective stop in shutter speed. Also, is the 12-40 at least an HG lens?

Thanks!
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Old Aug 25, 2013, 11:05 AM   #22
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Yes, I agree about the finish.

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Originally Posted by HarjTT View Post
Hey Steve
Nice find.. have to say it looks good with that new lens (which looks to be the same size as the pana 12-35F2.8 but much better in build quality). Definitely looks to have the EX finish on it.
Interesting lens. Notice that is a fixed aperture F2.8 zoom, and according to some sources it is going to carry a "Pro" label. So probably will be water and dust proof. And it probably will be the most likely kit lens (at a high price I'm sure.)
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Old Aug 25, 2013, 11:15 AM   #23
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I dont have an EM5, that said the source over at 43photo says EM1 isnt the EM5 sensor. Im assuming it is therefore a little better.
That said lets keep EM5 as a baseline.

Ok so among 3 cameras, E5, GH2 and EM5 I have GH2 and E5
they rank pretty clearly as EM5 > GH2 > E5 for noise performance

Lets shoot straight up to 3200 ISO
You dont really see the worst of E5 until you have shadow noise or blacks to deal with, then it is in my view impossible to recover.
GH2 will show noise especially in shadow and it sorta loses it in darker areas. But it is sharp in the light, which wont be a lot if you are shooting 3200.

EM5 different story. Its a lot less effected by shadow noise, and at 3200 it looks like more than a stop less on E5. T
hat doesnt sound like a lot but really the difference is stark.

Keeping that stop between them, EM5 in the lit areas looks noisier, but it is off the type of noise easily dealt with with NR. It has a little more trouble with red, red colour looks noisier than the rest of the image.
GH2 is somewhere in between, certainly more noisy than Em5, but on another planet to E5 for shadow noise. Attached is a sample from Sat nights concert full size.

I cant use an SLR or make any noise at this venue, so GH2 is set to 40fps which renders small jpegs like video stills but better, but it is 100% silent.
Its great to use because you can choose a file out of 40 frames were expressions on faces and stuff can change quite a lot.
They can look a bit tortured as they play so its worth it

GH2: 1/100 sec, ISO 3200, Oly 45mm wide open f/1.8, there is no post at all on this file and it is full size at the link.
open the link and click the magnifier glass bottom right, twice
http://s194.photobucket.com/user/rea...dc3fd.jpg.html


should say the light is deplorable at this venue
so much so Ms Layton requested a light so she could see the sheet music!

Last edited by Rriley; Aug 25, 2013 at 11:29 AM. Reason: additions
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Old Aug 25, 2013, 11:46 AM   #24
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Thanks for your thoughtful answer. Do I understand correctly that you're thinking the new cam will be good at 3200? If so, with a 2.4 lens that's not much of a gain over the E5 and an f/2 lens at 1250. Although the new rig would be substantially lighter I dunno if the likely price is worth that.

Of course this is all speculation until we see the camera.
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Old Aug 25, 2013, 12:17 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by tkurkowski View Post
Thanks for your thoughtful answer. Do I understand correctly that you're thinking the new cam will be good at 3200? If so, with a 2.4 lens that's not much of a gain over the E5 and an f/2 lens at 1250. Although the new rig would be substantially lighter I dunno if the likely price is worth that.

Of course this is all speculation until we see the camera.
my E5 and 5D are unusable in the same circumstance which you see this GH2 image. But then I dont have fast glass for 5D, and mostly its the colour that sucks on it at 3200. Its ok if you can always live with B&W hight ISO.

The relationship between GH2 and EM5 was heavily 'investigated' over in dpr m43rds forum, and EM5 was a clear winner for DR and noise.
3200 seemed to be the point were EM5 actually dipped a bit.
EM5 at 1600 is rather like E5 at 400 in the darkest shadows, a little noisier elsewhere. This as it happens is an important observation

you can look at dpr studio viewer thing and get an idea,
but the effect of shadow noise isnt enough to properly evaluate more usual poorly lit high ISO conditions.

see if these work

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/stud...18157094864818

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/stud...56838905775072

My own interpretation is ISO 1600 seems publishable, 3200 in some circumstances.
The highest I have ever published for GH2 is 2000, but we sorta needed that file pretty bad.
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Old Aug 25, 2013, 12:42 PM   #26
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If its a "pro" grade lens, so this is the first HG quality lens from M43 and if thats the case it should be as good as the 14-54 or possibly even the 12-60. Looking at those pics, I;d say its clear that the balance of the new cam and the ergonomics are going to be very good with M43 designed glass but not so for FT.

What do you think Oly is going to price the new lens at .. HG prices or SHG as its a constant F2.8 ?

A few months ago I got to handle both 12-35F2.8 and 35-100F2.8 pana lenses and I'm afraid to say I wasn't impressed by the build quality. The small size of both lenses got me - the 35-100F2.8 is shockingly small, just a tad bigger in length on the 14-54. My thoughts at the time was ok.. great size and weight but how much software correction is going on with both lenses compared to the HG/SHGs.

Ted, if the new cam is useable with the Bgrip then the weight saving is going to be a fair bit over the E5 but then again we have no idea of the weight of BG and the battery so it could end up being close to the weight of an E5.

Last edited by HarjTT; Aug 25, 2013 at 12:45 PM.
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Old Aug 25, 2013, 1:13 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by tkurkowski View Post
Hey, I have a question for Greg and the rest of the folks here.

My most used lens is the f/2 14-35 on the E5. For indoor available light event photography I'm shooting at ISO 1250 and f/2 to get a marginally adequate shutter speed and reasonably low noise. .....

Thanks!
Just an observation Ted. IIRC there have been some comparisons in the past on different forums, and the Oly noise is somewhat worse at the odd number ISO rather than the even. I think that the noise at 1600 was no worse, or better than, the noise at the lower 1250. Have you done a comparison of that on your camera? If you could go to 1600 instead of 1250 wouldn't that give you a little better shutter speed for available light?
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Old Aug 25, 2013, 1:41 PM   #28
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Originally Posted by Steven R View Post
Just an observation Ted. IIRC there have been some comparisons in the past on different forums, and the Oly noise is somewhat worse at the odd number ISO rather than the even. I think that the noise at 1600 was no worse, or better than, the noise at the lower 1250. Have you done a comparison of that on your camera? If you could go to 1600 instead of 1250 wouldn't that give you a little better shutter speed for available light?
actually thats usual for Olympus
its the ISO steps that vary occasionally
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Old Aug 25, 2013, 1:43 PM   #29
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Originally Posted by Steven R View Post
Just an observation Ted. IIRC there have been some comparisons in the past on different forums, and the Oly noise is somewhat worse at the odd number ISO rather than the even. I think that the noise at 1600 was no worse, or better than, the noise at the lower 1250. Have you done a comparison of that on your camera? If you could go to 1600 instead of 1250 wouldn't that give you a little better shutter speed for available light?
Funny you should mention that - I was remembering that after I posted the message today. I designed the lighting in the Temple and it's fairly evenly lit - not many places with deep shadows. (This was back in the film days and I was darned sure trying to avoid the fast films of the time.) But I need to reset that MyMode to 1600.

The biggest problem I have to pay attention to, is the White Balance. We have daylight, compact fluorescent, and halogen lamps in there, the WB changes depending on which direction I'm aiming the camera (and as the sun goes down). The E5 tries hard but 3 very different light colors is too much for it. We put the CF lamps in to reduce the cooling load during an event but they condemn me to hours of PP.
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Old Aug 25, 2013, 3:22 PM   #30
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pricing guide, not sure its true

http://www.dailycameranews.com/2013/...ro-lens-price/

See below for the price information of the new camera and lens kits.
  • Olympus E-M1 Camera Body Only (with BCL-1580) JPY ¥145,000 USD $1,450
  • Olympus E-M1 Camera Body with 12-50mm F3.5-6.3 Lens - JPY ¥170,000 - USD $1,700
  • Olympus E-M1 Camera Body with 12-40mm F2.8 Lens - JPY ¥220,000 - USD $2,200
  • HLD-7 Battery Grip - JPY ¥20,000 USD $200
  • PT-EP11 underwater housing - JPY ¥100,000 - USD $1,000
  • Olympus M.ZUIKO DIGITAL ED 12-40mm f/2.8 PRO lens - JPY ¥90,000 - USD $900
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