Go Back   Steve's Digicams Forums > Digital Cameras (Point and Shoot) > Olympus

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old Mar 6, 2004, 11:40 AM   #11
Senior Member
photosbyvito's Avatar
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 5,710

hmmm...wat settings? time?
photosbyvito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 6, 2004, 12:03 PM   #12
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Indian Rocks Beach, FL
Posts: 4,036

Originally Posted by jkusmier
But you'll lose all of your settings! This is probably why the original poster stores the camera w/ normal alkalines.
I’ve never left one for a long period of time without a battery. None of mine lose the settings over short periods though.

Compare apples and apples here. If the camera drains charge when switched off you can’t leave alkaline batteries in them either. If the power drain is small the proprietary batteries will drain for a much longer time without losing the settings. If the power drain with the camera off is large the alkalines have a good chance of leaking and damaging the camera if left for a month or so.

If the camera works like most good cameras and doesn’t leak a charge when switched off the only batteries that need recharging after a long storage period are NiMH. The proprietary lithium battery in the 5060 should be able to sit almost indefinitely without discharging unless there is a design flaw.
slipe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 6, 2004, 12:53 PM   #13
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2003
Posts: 162

Firstly, I was simply trying to point out that digicams don't run on pixie dust, and most will forget their re-settings within 48 hours. That's not a "short period" - and many people probably go days without even thinking about their camera.

While it was not my intention to discuss the merits of alkaline v NiMH v Lion, I will respond to your post. All rechargeable batteries exhibit self-discharge. Yes, NiMH's self-discharge at a higher rate than do Lithium ions, but the point is that Lios do self-discharge. They don't have the same, seemingly limitless shelf life of their non-rechargeable cousins.

Because they don't self-discharge, alkalines would be a better choice than NiMH for long-term storage. Most digicams draw but a nominal charge when off, sufficient only to preserve the settings and power the clock. A fresh pair of alkalines would provide sufficient power to perform these tasks for several months. I wouldn't worry much about leaking alkalines - true, there's some risk of leakage, but it's also nominal. Granted, one should check once a month - and it's difficult to conceive why anyone would shelve their camera for months at a time. But if forced to choose between NiMH and alkalines for long-term storage, I'd opt for the latter.
jkusmier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 6, 2004, 2:18 PM   #14
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 32
Default Re: Well, I was going to buy a C-5060, but no AA batteries.

Originally Posted by CloseUpReady
Frustrating! I'd rather have an extra inch added to the camera for extra AAs than get stuck with Lithium only.
I feel the same way.....i like the convienience of at least being able to use AA's in a pinch if i have too....besides that, i can use the batts in other things too. but looks like with most newer cams, users are being forced to use proprietary batteries.
dal81 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Mar 6, 2004, 8:17 PM   #15
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Indian Rocks Beach, FL
Posts: 4,036

Because they don't self-discharge, alkalines would be a better choice than NiMH for long-term storage.
I think you missed my point. We are discussing lithium proprietary batteries verses AAs. CloseUpReady seems to think the proprietary lithium batteries will not power his camera adequately after sitting for a month and that shouldn’t be true except for the odd camera with a bad drain. But alkalines would fail sooner under the same drain.

I found this on a site that distributes lithium ion batteries. Not sure they all have the same discharge rate because there seem to be a lot of different types. It does appear that cellphones and digital cameras use the same type though:

Q. Will the battery function properly after it sits unused for a long time?
A. Yes, the recoverable capacity of cells stored for over one year at room temperature and fully charged is 94%. The retained capacity of these same cells is 87%. This means the self-discharge rate for fully charged cells was approximately 150 mAh per year or 427 uAh per day. The self-discharge rate for cells is non linear, a partially charged cell has a self-discharge rate of about 80 uAh per day.

This is probably more realistic as I think all devices need the safety circuit to keep from discharging them too far and damaging them. And it is specifically aimed at consumer devices:

” The self-discharge of the Li-ion battery is five percent in the first 24 hours after charge and averages 1 to 2 percent per month thereafter. In addition to the natural self-discharge through the chemical cell, the safety circuit draws as much as 3 percent per month. High cycle count and aging has little effect on self-discharge on lithium-based batteries.” http://www.buchmann.ca/chap14-page1.asp

So I would guess 4%/month might be average since the safety circuit is “up to” 3%/month and hopefully they put decent electronics in upscale digital cameras. Evidently the first quote was for a battery not connected to anything. I am guessing the safety circuit discharge would be constant and the natural battery discharge decrease with time.

But taking a worst case scenario of the maximum safety circuit discharge of 3% and the battery maintaining a maximum discharge of 2% throughout the entire time, the battery would still have 35% of its capacity after a year of storage. That is probably equal to a fresh set of alkalines. Stored over a month a lithium battery will have at least 90% of its capacity left if there is not a drain from the camera. And such a drain would deplete alkaline batteries before a proprietary lithium ion battery. And the safety circuit would shut the lithium battery down where the alkalines would continue to drain until a point where they could cause damage to the camera.

That seems to correspond with my experience. After sitting a few weeks the proprietary batteries show no measurable loss of power in my cameras. That isn’t true of my camera that uses AAs though – the NiMH batteries are well below half capacity and need recharging if I want to use it. Alkalines are sufficiently useless in my camera based on the experience of other users over on dpreview that I have never bothered to put any in the camera.
slipe is offline   Reply With Quote

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

All times are GMT -5. The time now is 4:47 PM.