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richardmanley Oct 25, 2003 12:08 PM

Just got FZ2 - first impressions
Hey all,

After MUCH deliberation over the past few months, i finally picked up an FZ2 today. While i am happy with the zoom and it's features, i have to say the image quality in normal indoor light is no where near as good as my old Canon A40. There is very bad noise at all ISO levels except 50 and maybe 100. It's kind of disappointing as when i look at a picture taken with the FZ2 in full auto mode and compare it with a picture taken with my old Canon A40, the A40 looks far less grainy even when comparing pictures taken in full light or with proper flash use. Any comments appreciated.


Humble Oct 25, 2003 1:37 PM

FZ series noise
Apparently the FZ series or the Venus engine has a problem with noise. I wrote Bob a note commenting on noise in the ISO 100 samples of the FZ10 and got a lecture on how noise was inevitable at high ISOs. He did not comment on my point that the FZ10 had to at least equal the performance at ISO 400 of my old Canon Pro90 IS for me to use it. Instead I got another lecture on why the Canon 300D has low noise. (Heaven know why this lecture - in my post I pointed out I use a 10D and Pro90 IS but wanted to add the FZ10 if 400 noise was usable with Neatimage.)

At any rate I have cancelled my preorder for the FZ10 and will wait for reviews. Too bad; I looked forward to the FZ10 to complement my Canon 10D. With my stabilized Canon lenses I have a good range compared to the FZ10 (40-480 mm for the 10D) but the kit is bulky, heavy and obtrusive compared to what the FZ10 would have been. Or might be if the actual camera as released is satisfactory.

It is obvious that pre-release speculation about it is useless.

Tazman2 Oct 25, 2003 3:10 PM

Well the low light performance should be improved with the fz10 i'm hoping because of the larger CCD and lens size. But yes i agree with the noise. I have FZ1 (selling on ebay now) and i had alot of that. I'm not a pro or even a amateur but even my dads older mavica with floppy did better pics. It also had a 10X optical zoom but extremely slow save times because of the floppy. I'm hoping they improve alot of the things i disliked about the fz1 on the fz10. I too maybe should wait for some reviews. I just hope the black one won't go up in price later or be short on supply like what happend with the fz1 a few months ago. Well heres to hope! =D

Nathcoo Oct 25, 2003 3:15 PM

To Humble

How can you compare the 10D with the FZ series ?????????????

The FZ series use very small captor ! This mean noise at high Iso.
The FZ 10 use the same captor as the LC33 and LC43


I use the Fz-2 for 1 month now for outdoor action pictures.
Great camera !

Humble Oct 25, 2003 4:20 PM

One last time -
I am NOT COMPARING the FZ10 noise to the Canon 10D.

I am comparing it to the Canon PRO90 IS - the 2.3 mpx 10 zoom digicam which started the whole long zoom digicam thing. This same Canon lens was used in the UZI. YES there is noise at 400 but Neatimage can cottrol it.

ONE MORE TIME - IF THE FZ10 can't equal my Canon Pro90 IS smaller sensor in 400 noise I can't use it.

I am comparing the FZ10 to a two year old Canon Pro90 IS digicam with a smaller sensor NOT to any other camera. If the FZ10 with a larger sensor and a two year improvement in software cannot equal the noise at 400 ISO of my old Canon Pro90 IS personally I will be unable to use it.

I happen to also own the 10D. That does not mean I am comparing the FZ10 to it. I should never have mentioned it!!!!

Best wishes to the FZ10 and all here.

richardmanley Oct 26, 2003 8:01 AM

Well, i just looked at some sample photos from the waterproof Olympus ultra compact (can't remember the model numbers), and they too have the same kind of noise at 100 iso when not in bright sunlight. So it appears to me that it's not just the FZ2, but a feature of some other cameras too. The Olympus cams i'm reffering to are the 3MP and 4MP ones. Makes you wonder how Canon cams avoid it...maybe they just have better noise reduction, or better firmware.

Check out a few of the photos I have taken so far and tell me what you think:

Jimmie Oct 26, 2003 9:09 AM

What camera were you using? They look good especially the flower and spider Macro's...

richardmanley Oct 26, 2003 9:07 PM

Using FZ2
I was using the FZ2 (just got it). The image stabilizer really does work well - the two zoomed photos are handheld at full 12X zoom. The two macros are done using the standard macro mode.

pwc Oct 28, 2003 4:03 PM

I think that the pics look rather good. Here is a suggestion. Set the in-camera sharpening to low and then run your images through Neatimage. A fully functional demo is available online as well as some excellent noise profiles for the FZ1 that should work great with the FZ2 also. Neatimage will also let you do sharpening after the noise reduction with better and more flexible results.
I ran your pics through Neatimage and added a bit of sharpening to the spider and they look great. Pictures shot with the in-camera sharpening algorythm turned off will be that much better (sharpening the noise reduces its distinctive qualities and renders the program less able to distinguish it from other grain.)
Hope this helps.

richardmanley Oct 28, 2003 4:41 PM

Interesting, because i'd already run the pic with the yellow flower through neatimage. Where can i get these FZ1 profiles from?

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