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Old Oct 22, 2003, 1:25 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic
Bob, is it possible for you to try to run an idea by the "panel of people in the design and planning areas of our company (in Japan)" and tell us whether they are open to it?

<RESPONSE>
Great idea, but it will never happen. Planning can be 18-24 months ahead of production.
So is it reasonable that the feature set for the next generation of products is already set (barring the last-moment changes you were speaking about)?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic
Having the general public "vote" would disclose the products to the competition. You have a better chance getting public tours of NSA!!
Not necessarily. For example, consider the following snipet:
Based on what criteria you'll purchase your next digicam?
( ) Number of pixels
( ) Size of sensor
( ) Optical zoom with stabilization
( ) Wide angle
( ) Manual controls
( ) performance under varying conditions


No confidential data at all.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic
The idea is very simple: set up a web site on which we will be able to "vote" on which features we consider the most important.
Panasonic gets free user feedback and market research, we get the option of making our wishes heard, it is a win-win situation.
<RESPONSE>
Recall what I said...
The people in these forums represent anout .0000000001 % of the decision process.
That is why I suggested expanding the exposure. Think of the publicity benefits ("Panasonic. We listen to you. Go to www.hey-panasonic-listen-to-what-i-say.com and tell us what you want in your next product!).

By the way, your comparison was flawed because the NSA is not a private organization and therefore should be accountable to the public.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic
I always find it strange that companies pay huge sums for "market research" when they could just ask the market almost for free.

<RESPONSE>
Yes, and in doing so the competition knows whay you are up to ;-)
You need to understand the fierce competition in this market.
See above. I am not talking about proprietary information, just about buying preferences.
I think that automotive industry is about as competitive by I recall stumbling on pages on manufacurers' sites asking me whether I'll buy my next auto based on price, performace, fuel economy, safety or convenience features.

I also get these questioneers with most of the products I buy but sometimes postal mail is a hassle...
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 11:08 AM   #22
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All great suggestions, but I don't see any of this happening.
As far as what's already decided.. I honestly don't know and I suspect if I did it would not be "public" information.

By now you are all probably thinking that I'm not open to suggestions. To better understand the "system" you would have to have worked in this industry as long as I have.

There are guidelines and protocols that are followed. In part these are supported by the fierce competition in this industry and on decisions made by our marketing people.

We are a support group and we don't make the rules. That's the way you play the game. While I admit that there are times I disagree with some decisions, in the end the outcome is positive. I'm now pretty confident that the people in control are on target.
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 11:49 AM   #23
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I can't believe all the hand wringing...whining...carping...two-year-old'isms I'm reading here! JFC! ...it's a $600. f'ing camera that's not even in the steet yet and you guys are complaining that it's not build, or will perform, to your PERSONAL specifications?!

....for $600!? Jeeez'! That's cheaper than a vario lens from Leica.. Go buy a body from Leica to go with it!

And I can't believe that you're backin Panasonic up to a wall with vague threats of your personal satisfaction with him, his design teams, engineers and the people who don't speak english who put these together.

Everybody has questions...we're all anxious (I put my Visa # where my mouth is) but lay off the whining. I have a feeling the people complaining the loudest will next bitch because they can't get it $20. less in a state where they don't have to pay sales tax...

One of the reasons I was confident enough to give my Visa # was the great response from Panasonic in this forum. Lay off him - I want him to stay around.

Jim
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 11:51 AM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic
By now you are all probably thinking that I'm not open to suggestions.
Not true. Personally, I think that you are working in a noon-local branch of a mega-corporation with a conservative Japanese leadership and a rigid structure. Also, I think that that you have managed to get a permission to participate in web forums only after conceding to draconian restrictions. And finally, I think that you bite your tongue and bang your head against the wall every time you see a question that you could have easily answered (with no harm to Panasonic) but are not allowed to.

OK, 1 more question just to clarify the issue:

Are you allowed to talk about information that is publicly available (in books or on the web) but was not released by Panasonic? Can you point to web pages containing such info?
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 3:46 PM   #25
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"Wetstuff" - thanks!
You are right on target! However, I feel I am obligated to respond to what ever extent I am able to.

Now to Alexo's comments....
Japanese companies and their management styles are VERY structured. Consider the fact that they dominate the electronics industry and none of us can dispute their results. Working in a large corporation is far different from being a consultant and changing jobs every few years ...

Yes, you are correct that I have the knowledge to answer about 98% of the questions - but I have guidelines and there are rules I must follow. Certain information is simply not for public discussion. It's that or nothing and I believe that most here will agree with my version of "Life on Steve's Forums."

As for other web sites, honestly I don't have the time or luxury to surf the web all day looking for this information. The products will be what they are. They will be released and some of you will love them - others will hate them.. and the other 99.99% of the DSC market who don't participate in discussions on this site will form their own opinions "sans Internet". Think outside the box, outside the Internet and outside this web site - it's a big world!
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 5:20 PM   #26
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Default Great support from Panasonic Bob!

Panasonic Bob has been terrific with us: he's provided us with far more solid information than we could otherwise have obtained on an unreleased, not-yet-finalized product, and has been incredibly patient and even-tempered all along. I very much appreciate what he's done in these Forums, and thank him for it: he's helped make me very eager to buy this camera.

Although the DMC-FZ10 is likely to be the first time I've bought a digital camera from Panasonic, it won't be the the first Panasonic product I've bought. We've used their VCR's, camcorders, and telephones for more years than I can remember, and have continued to buy from them for three reasons: their products work, have superb interfaces, and are very durable.

A long time ago, I, too, worked for a large company (IBM) as a field representative. From time to time, I was involved in pre-release products, and the non-disclosure rules were at least as strict as Panasonic's. I understood the reasons for those rules and agreed with them: product capabilities change right up to the last minute (and even after release), so getting too deep into details can lead to problems.

In a few hours, on October 24th, the FZ10 will be released for sale in Japan, and shortly thereafter we will be deluged in information, opinions, and real-world photos from people who are buying and using the camera. Most likely, a month or less from now, some of us will also have the camera in the U.S. and will be raving (and/or ranting) about it. Eager as I am for more information (and even more so for the camera itself), that isn't too long to wait.
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 8:10 PM   #27
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Bob:

Thanks for the clarifying with your very well thought out response. You are doing a GREAT job of keeping us all as informed as possible, and I regret that you are encountering so much "difficult" protest. This protest is very unfounded in the real world.

I have been a confirmed Canon DSLR person, but fell in love with an FZ1 I got for my lady, and so did she. I'm now obtaining an FZ2 as a "carry everywhere" camera for myself, and expect to love that too. Panasonic is doing a good job with these unique machines, and you are doing an excellent job of keeping us informed. THANK YOU, and please keep it up.

Jack Winberg

[quote="Panasonic"]"Wetstuff" - thanks!
You are right on target! However, I feel I am obligated to respond to what ever extent I am able to.... (Big snip)
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 11:48 PM   #28
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Default Bob - you are right....

Bob, you are right - internet info about the Z10 is a waste of time. I will wait for release and the reviews, if any. Thanks for your time.
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Old Oct 24, 2003, 1:26 AM   #29
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Default Re: Great support from Panasonic Bob!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Charlie Howard
In a few hours, on October 24th, the FZ10 will be released for sale in Japan, and shortly thereafter we will be deluged in information, opinions, and real-world photos from people who are buying and using the camera. Most likely, a month or less from now, some of us will also have the camera in the U.S. and will be raving (and/or ranting) about it. Eager as I am for more information (and even more so for the camera itself), that isn't too long to wait.
Well said Charlie. The fun and creative factor of the FZ-10 is going to be great. It has been a long time since I have been this excited about a camera, and I have been taking photographs for over 40 years.

Bob, thanks for all the good info you have been able to provide. It is appreciated. I would much rather have you here with a few restrictions, then to not have you here at all.
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Old Oct 24, 2003, 12:24 PM   #30
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Let the reviews begin!

jmb~
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