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Old Oct 22, 2003, 7:22 PM   #1
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Default FZ10 sensor

I wonder, about the sensor used in the FZ10.
Is it the MN39482PT that is mentioned on the Panasonic Japan site?

Update: The document is available again...

Part No.: MN39482PT
Size: 6.9 mm (Type-1/2.5)
Nominal pixel count in total: 4.24M
Effective pixel count (H x V): 2336 x 1774
Scanning mode: Interlace Scan
Saturation output Typ. (mV): 800
Sensitivity (F8.0) Typ. (mV): 330
Aspect ratio: 4 : 3
Package: WDIP018-P-0400A
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Old Oct 22, 2003, 9:02 PM   #2
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The MN39482PT would have to be it since that's the only 4mp sensor listed.
Looking at others on the list, it appears that the fz1/2 sensor is the MN39472PJ. The fz1 specs say the sensor is 1/3.2". That sensor measures 6.0 mm. There has been some speculation that Panasonic would come out with a fz3 - 3mp in the fz1/2 body. The only 3mp sensor listed is 6.6 mm. I quess that puts the screws to a fz3 in a fz1/2 body.
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 9:47 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fmoore
The MN39482PT would have to be it since that's the only 4mp sensor listed.
Unless the FZ10 uses a new sensor that is not mentioned in that document.

Quote:
Originally Posted by fmoore
Looking at others on the list, it appears that the fz1/2 sensor is the MN39472PJ. The fz1 specs say the sensor is 1/3.2". That sensor measures 6.0 mm. There has been some speculation that Panasonic would come out with a fz3 - 3mp in the fz1/2 body. The only 3mp sensor listed is 6.6 mm. I quess that puts the screws to a fz3 in a fz1/2 body.
I wonder, is it always the case that enlarging the sensor would neccessarily cause a corresponding enlargement of the lens.

Maybe Bob could comments (in general terms about the optics/physics of the problem, no inside information is needed).
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 10:50 AM   #4
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The "MN" series are commercially available. Any manufacturer can purchase these from Matshshita. Though it might be similar, usually we use custom version of existing designs.

I'm sorry, but I'm unable to provide more info at this time as I have not received the service manual and other documentation we will receive. When I receive it I'll see what is permissable to share and I'll be happy to answer some questions.
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 11:19 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panasonic
I'm sorry, but I'm unable to provide more info at this time as I have not received the service manual and other documentation we will receive. When I receive it I'll see what is permissable to share and I'll be happy to answer some questions.
As the question was: "is it theoreticly possible to keep the same aperture and focal distance while increasing the sensor size and resolution without increasing the lens diameter?" I very much doubt that it would be written in the service manual.

Feel free to ignore it. I'm just playing with ideas...
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Old Oct 23, 2003, 3:48 PM   #6
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I'll ask Steve to create an Optics 101 forum!
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Old Oct 24, 2003, 1:04 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alexo
I wonder, is it always the case that enlarging the sensor would necessarily cause a corresponding enlargement of the lens.
In simple terms think of it this way. A lens creates what is essentially a circle of light or more specifically a circle of focus. For any given lens, that circle of focus must be of sufficient size to cover the recording medium. In the case of digital cameras, that is the sensor. If you increase the size of the sensor, then the circle of focus must be increased as well.

Now an F-stop let's say for example, F2.8, is a mathematical measurement of light intensity, hitting on the circle of focus. When you increase the size of the sensor (recording medium) you must increase the size of the circle of focus to cover it. This means that more light must be passed through the lens, in order to maintain the same intensity (F2.8 ) all across the larger sensor or recording medium.

In simple terms, the lens (of a specific design) must either be larger, or slower, in order to cover the larger recording medium or sensor. Or in the case of zoom lenses, the zoom range can sometimes be reduced to provide a shorter maximum focal length. (longer focal lengths are proportionately larger relative to the light passing through the lens).
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Old Oct 24, 2003, 9:31 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brdavid
Quote:
Originally Posted by alexo
I wonder, is it always the case that enlarging the sensor would necessarily cause a corresponding enlargement of the lens.
In simple terms think of it this way. A lens creates what is essentially a circle of light or more specifically a circle of focus. For any given lens, that circle of focus must be of sufficient size to cover the recording medium. In the case of digital cameras, that is the sensor. If you increase the size of the sensor, then the circle of focus must be increased as well.

Now an F-stop let's say for example, F2.8, is a mathematical measurement of light intensity, hitting on the circle of focus. When you increase the size of the sensor (recording medium) you must increase the size of the circle of focus to cover it. This means that more light must be passed through the lens, in order to maintain the same intensity (F2.8 ) all across the larger sensor or recording medium.

In simple terms, the lens (of a specific design) must either be larger, or slower, in order to cover the larger recording medium or sensor. Or in the case of zoom lenses, the zoom range can sometimes be reduced to provide a shorter maximum focal length. (longer focal lengths are proportionately larger relative to the light passing through the lens).
Thank you, this is a good explanation.

There is just one thing that I still find peculiar.
All the other manufacturers' zoom lenses are faster at their wide angle end than at the telephoto end. I guess it is just more simple to design them that way.
Therefore, if Panasonic + Leica managed to design a lens that is F2.8 at the 72mm focal length, why didn't they make it even faster at the 6mm end? What am I missing here?
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Old Oct 24, 2003, 12:21 PM   #9
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quote:
All the other manufacturers' zoom lenses are faster at their wide angle end than at the telephoto end. I guess it is just more simple to design them that way.
Therefore, if Panasonic + Leica managed to design a lens that is F2.8 at the 72mm focal length, why didn't they make it even faster at the 6mm end? What am I missing here?
endquote:

Alexo,

The F/stop # is a ratio of lens optical lens to aperture diameter.
(someone correct me if I'm wrong)
So an F/stop at WA is a smaller diameter then the F/stop at the
Telephoto end. The lens' optical length is longer at the telephoto end. Other cameras max F/stop decreases when the lens is zoomed out because they are designed to keep the same diameter of aperture opening so the resulting F/stop (ratio) is smaller.
BTW - F = optical Focal length.

FZ10 is designed with the largest F/stop in mind and when the
lens is zoomed in to wide angle the diameter of the aperture is
actually closed down to maintain the same max F/stop.

Regards,

jmb~
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Old Oct 24, 2003, 2:40 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by myfatbratcat
FZ10 is designed with the largest F/stop in mind and when the lens is zoomed in to wide angle the diameter of the aperture is actually closed down to maintain the same max F/stop.
And the question I had in mind was, why not keep it open in wide angle to get an even lower F/stop number?

Yet another of life's little mysteries...
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