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Old Jul 15, 2004, 2:23 PM   #11
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Thank you for your info Lawrencew, You just helped me to make up my mind Thx!!

A TIFF as good as RAW format to me, therefore I will just return the FZ10 and wait for July 20. I only lost$48.90 plusshipping. I do understand that new model won't sell for discount anytime soon. I wouldhave a second chance to makethechoice again to buythe one I really happywith. Or even upgraded to FZ20 if it is less than $900 USD

By the way, I do know that FZ20 is going to cost a lot more than the FZ10,or FZ15, just that if you can get the Zoom Len with 35mm-420mm (f2.8 all the way) with 5MP(if with acceptable noise level), where can you find a combo come close to FZ20 for value per $.

I was thinking about Canon300D (very low noise at high ISO) too, but the good zoom lens would cost my legs and my bank account, if I try to get a 200mm-400mm with better f2.8. (a f4.9 cost$1500)It would be out of myprice range. Anyway, thank you for your help!



Thx!





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Old Jul 15, 2004, 4:32 PM   #12
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How long is their return period? If it's long enough, you might wait until the 20th to verify you want the new features. But yeah, barring a significant price difference, you might want the 15 or 20. Again, though, we don't know exactly what they bring just yet.
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Old Jul 15, 2004, 5:12 PM   #13
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Part of the problem is probably Panasonic's biggest regret -- releasing the firmware upgrade for the FZ1. Even though they released it to a limited market, I think they now understand that we now have a literal world market and not the isolate pockets that they're accustomed to. Basically, from the sound of things, the FZ15 is an FZ2 and the FZ10 is the FZ1. When they release the FZ15 without a way to upgrade the FZ10 to the FZ15 functionality, people are going to be crying, "foul!", because there's precedence with the FZ1/2.

Of course, the situation is a little different because at least the FZ15 will be available in the USA...the FZ2 never made it here. Also, the FZ15 and the FZ10 has pretty big number difference -- probably more feature differences than the FZ1/2, as well. It's a stretch, but think how the FZ1 buyers felt when six months after their FZ1 purchase, the FZ10 was released with little to no warning.

As for a firmware upgrade being easy...I'm a network engineer with close to15 years experience. Yes, I was doing the computer thing before the internet was called the internet (or even really existed as far as the public was concerned), and I used to create my own menu systems because that fancy thing called Windows just doesn't exist. I have to disagree -- a firmware upgrade or any major system change that affects MANY units like this is NOT easy. And the one gentleman is right -- this type of attitude *is* why so many computer system just don't work. The hacker mentality that most computer support people have now is just not acceptable if you want to be able to stay in business. You have to plan, test, test again, test again, release it in production, and then plan on a major support increase, because you're guaranteed to miss something in the testing process.

Honestly, Panasonic is crazy to release an upgrade, especially when they're such a niche market. Where else are you going to go to get a camera with a 12x OIS Leica lens? That's right, no where. Which is why we'll all keep buying the FZ10, FZ15, FZ20, FZ55, etc., as they come out, our needs change, or our equipment dies. After owning a FZ10, try going back to some other camera with a 3x optical zoom. I hope you enjoy disappointment! :-)

============

Chris
www.FZ1Club.com


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Old Jul 15, 2004, 6:10 PM   #14
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cageyman wrote:
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How long is their return period? If it's long enough, you might wait until the 20th to verify you want the new features. But yeah, barring a significant price difference, you might want the 15 or 20. Again, though, we don't know exactly what they bring just yet.
I can wait till the July 24th, so I can reallyhold on to the FZ10 till July 20th to see what Panasonic offer on the FZ15 and FZ20. So, 10% re-stock fee use it for renting it lol. Once again thank you for your input.


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Old Jul 21, 2004, 5:32 AM   #15
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What no-one seems to have mentioned is that if you live in the UK, the FZ10 has only been available for 2-3 months as Panasonic didn't deem us worthy of being customers at the same time as America and the Far East. This is simply taking the p*** by announcing new models which have functionality the FZ10 should have had in the first place so soon after making the FZ10 available. A firmware upgrade is the LEAST that Panasonic could do about this situation, and I would be willing to pay to add more functionality to my FZ10, namely multi-spot metering and ability to save as TIFF.
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Old Jul 21, 2004, 5:55 AM   #16
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Put simply the FZ15 & 20 will be judged on their initial reviews, since we know that any specification limitations won't be address with a firmware update. Unlike other cameras where you may buy them knowing that a couple of small issues may be fixed, the Panasonics are a done deal. What you see is what you get...forever!
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Old Jul 21, 2004, 5:06 PM   #17
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What Bobsterlobster has said is true....
Most of the camera shops here in the UK have only had the FZ10 for only 3 months.
And the FZ15/20 may not even get here for another 6 months at least...! :?
In the mean time Panasonic should at least help its customers by fixing some of the many flaws mentions on this forum. :idea:
A firmware FIX can only help them in the long run & it'll put them in our good books as well.
Other companies not only help its customers by issuing updates, its customer service speaks in plain english instead of some other language. :P
In time Panasonicwill not be the only ones with its camera having all the functions & features you every wish for..and where will its customer base be then.
I know it sound like I'm flamingthem or something, but they should at least go some way to help us out.
Or the knock-on effect could be pasted onto its other products...

Thanks for reading this....
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Old Jul 21, 2004, 5:44 PM   #18
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rn5577 wrote:
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What Bobsterlobster has said is true....
Most of the camera shops here in the UK have only had the FZ10 for only 3 months.
And the FZ15/20 may not even get here for another 6 months at least...! :?
I emailed Panasonic UK today and this is what they said

"...we are looking forward to the FZ20 becoming available in the
UK in September. The FZ15 will not be sold in the UK and finally there are
no plans to discontinue the FZ10 at present."

So it looks like the FZ20 will be available almost immediately.

The slightly good news is that as the FZ10 is going to remain available the 2nd price isn't going to plumment, and you could always sell your FZ10 2nd hand for a reasonable price and upgrade to the FZ20 if you think the features are worth it.

The only negatives I can see to this (and they aren't small....) is

1. you wont get any firmware upgrades to th FZ20 either. Any bugs will be considered features
2. the noise on the FZ20 may be unacceptable (it doesnt look good so far from the sample picture), in which case you might not want an FZ20 anyway!
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Old Jul 21, 2004, 6:57 PM   #19
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I'm not hoping for an upgrade to the FZ20, that would be a like a MIRACLE...
All I would like is some of the flaws to be corrected by a Firmware fix.
If they can't (or will not) correct for flaws, then at least give us some tips on how to get round them - instead of trying to sell us another camera.
And as to the value of the FZ10 not going down, then you havn't seen some of our camera shops.
Unless I return the camerawithin the normal 30 days (its there returns policy), the camera shop where I brought the FZ10 from will only give me some of the money back (I could be looking at a drop of at least 10% of the market value). :P
And seeing I already use the policy for another camera & have already used the FZ10 (and to the extent that I order extra bits for it), I don't think I could return it without loss & this is for a camera I've only just brought....
So if (and when) I decide to upgrade again - it may not be Panasonic I will be going for...
I know this will be my choose and it'll be like a pin pick to Panasonic.
But if they decide to not speak plainly to they're customers, then what can you expect.

Thanks for reading...
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