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Old Jan 14, 2005, 8:09 PM   #1
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Seems panasonic have a lumix coming with removable lens BUT not an SLR
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/re...ssage=11841252
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Old Jan 14, 2005, 9:21 PM   #2
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boyzo

Thanks for posting that .. very interesting if it is true. I wonder how much a 4/3 based Lumix with a Leica lens is going to cost ? I'm sure the camera would rock.

Harj

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Old Jan 14, 2005, 9:23 PM   #3
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You know, that makes sense. What do you need a mirror and mirror slap for with digitals anyway? The image is displayed electronically... you don't need the mirror. Hence, a non-SLR, "interchangeable lens" system. Stupid simple + original + effective = brilliant.

Now if someone can introduce Panasonic to the concept of EVF "gain up" they would be good to go.
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Old Jan 14, 2005, 10:10 PM   #4
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NickTrop wrote:
Quote:
You know, that makes sense. What do you need a mirror and mirror slap for with digitals anyway? The image is displayed electronically... you don't need the mirror. Hence, a non-SLR, "interchangeable lens" system. Stupid simple + original + effective = brilliant.

Now if someone can introduce Panasonic to the concept of EVF "gain up" they would be good to go.
Its a cool idea no one has done it yet.
you could have
36-430 zoom f2.8
limited zoom lens but fast like f2
macro lens.
fixed wide angle lens
pretty cool
but I love the fz1v2
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Old Jan 14, 2005, 10:27 PM   #5
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NickTrop wrote:
Quote:
You know, that makes sense. What do you need a mirror and mirror slap for with digitals anyway? The image is displayed electronically... you don't need the mirror. Hence, a non-SLR, "interchangeable lens" system. Stupid simple + original + effective = brilliant.

Now if someone can introduce Panasonic to the concept of EVF "gain up" they would be good to go.
I come from a SLR background and I have to say that in my opinion there is nothing like an optical view finder on an SLR for composing shots. You see 100% of the image that will be photographed and it is much clearer than any EVF I have seen. Now if they (Digital camera companies) can improve the EVF so that they rival SLR viewfinders... well I would be first in line. ) The main exception I can think of for using the LCD would be the macro or digiscoping stuff. For most of what I shoot though I still use the EVF on my FZ20 almost exclusively because 1.) It's more familiar to me and 2.) For action shots you naturally hold your arms in tighter to your body and have better camera stability. Personally I would like them to increase the size of the ccd's so we could all use higher (1600-3200) iso like the DSLR's. Imagine what we could do then. Mirror slap is music to my ears.:G As for longer exposure times, that's what a mirror lock is for. From my experience the marriage of the two technologies makes perfect sense, Though, I feel I am about to find out why it doesn't from the eagerly vocal members of this fascinating form.
:bye:smac
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Old Jan 14, 2005, 10:29 PM   #6
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Nick

I would not be suprised if they left the EVF without a gain up just to drive everyone nuts .. grr.. I can just see the Panasonic design team.. "ok, team this new FZ rocks but we got to keep the price down so what shall we do .. I know lets cripple the EVF again !"



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Old Jan 14, 2005, 11:01 PM   #7
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smac wrote:
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I come from a SLR background and I have to say that in my opinion there is nothing like an optical view finder on an SLR for composing shots.
Oh... I don't disagre at all. My film SLR is a 100% manual thing of beauty... maual shutter, metering is just a +/- affair... Love the camera. Only went digital when it began to fail. (...after 10+ years) It was a $100 el-cheapo K-mart "special" Vivitar bought at a time when those mechanical AF systems were all the rage (no thanks). It was the only one I could find outside of the used camera market. It was down to that or the Pentax K-1000. But this had a faster (1.7) prime lens, a better shutter speed range, plus it was new.

And - no, you can't beat an optical viewfinder. That includes a rangefinder system (except very close up...)

However, the mirror system is a bit of a Rube-Goldberg piece of engineering. It adds to the weight, it adds to the production costs, it's a "moving part"... Also (allegedly) images lose a hair of sharpness due to it. Also, the frame blacks out when you squeeze the trigger, which I always found a bit annoying at lower shutter speeds. It's unnecessary because it (the mirror) blocks the film from being exposed. Since there's no film to expose in a digital, the mirror system just doesn't seem a fit for the technology.

You know what? I wouldn't mind if the digitals had two systems. A simple optical system (basically a hole in the camera) like the disposables, or a simple optical rangefinder system, so you can compose medium and long shots without the evf, and only use the evf for macros and close-ups where parralelex (sic - I'm sure) shift becomes a factor.

Ultimately, I assume the major advantage of a non-SLR (or electronic) viewing systems with interchangeable lenses would be lower consumer costs, no moving parts, and easier to produce as it would not involve mechanical engineering/compoents. All this equaling lower market costs...


HarjTT wrote:
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would not be suprised if they left the EVF without a gain up just to drive everyone nuts
So true. It's almost like they went out of their way to mess up something simple. I just don't see the logic of it and don't buy that it is a design issue. I think it's just stupid.

More than the image quality of the EVF, this is the one thing a simple (relatively) crude mirror reflex system of film SLRs have over an evf. You can compose a shot in moderately low (like interiors at night) lighting conditions and see what doing without issue! (And, is that too much to ask?)


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Old Jan 15, 2005, 12:18 AM   #8
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Nick,
No arguments here. But, I have wondered why the EVF and LCD also black out when you press the shutter release. Is it to fain the appearance of a shutter opening? Does the view finder or LCD need to blackout for the ccd to expose the picture? I really don't know. I just assumed that it must, but I was basing that on my SLR experiences. It's most acute when I am using the burst mode trying to follow a moving object. I remember reading that other cameras, the the Canon G5 comes to mind, don't lose the picture in the LCD during burst mode making following the subject much easier.
Back to my original thought, I loved my SLR days, but I don't want to go back I just want the best of both worlds without having to drop $2K-4K to have it. That's not asking too much is it?

:roll: smac
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Old Jan 15, 2005, 12:47 AM   #9
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HarjTT wrote:
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Nick

I would not be suprised if they left the EVF without a gain up just to drive everyone nuts .. grr.. I can just see the Panasonic design team.. "ok, team this new FZ rocks but we got to keep the price down so what shall we do .. I know lets cripple the EVF again !"



Harj
Mac your right took my SRT102 out of its bag and peeped thru' the viewer argh !!! its clear and huge like a sports field.
The lumix are toys (the EVF) (((
The srt102 is huge 1.05 KG GREAT slr still works like new.

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Old Jan 15, 2005, 12:56 AM   #10
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OH MAN! Boyzo,

That brings back fond memories. My first SLR was a Minolta SRT-101. I loved that camera right up to the day I forgot to close the case and it bounced out and off the back of my motorcycle onto a dirt road. RIP! Actually it servived after I sent it in to get a few things realigned, and replaced the lens. What a tank. I eventually sold it to buy my Canon F-1 in 1972. I still have that camera. But, now I only use it occasionally with my telescope. Thanks for that flash from the past.

smac

Nice pair of tomatos BTW.:lol:
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