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Old Jan 17, 2005, 10:28 AM   #21
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.... indeed sad to see someone sign out ...

agree with most things sad here.

I was thinking; The photographic quality can only be kept high if we do wat Goldstar notes; otherwise there will be some 10+ images posted every day. And it than will require me to create a few template cheers and comments to copy and paste; just to prevent from RSI :GWithout the jokes, there really isn't much to recommend for me to others. But I do get some inspiration/lessons by every posted image.

I think it is simply impossible to have a living and kicking forum with high quality talk only; Because there are so many rookies around, it will be a matter of days and nothing is left to say. Images are also posted to just show something of the world we live in, or just because the subject is funny. This may reduce the overall photographic quality, but adds to the nice athmosphere, which isIMO important too. It is right thatthe pana forumshould not become simplistic club; But on the other hand, also no snobby elite.. (No offence!)

Another thing; What's a newbie frame to some, can be a top-10 result for the beginning photographer. In that case, the photogr. is in cheer, and wants to share his/her result with the rest. Not everyone is at the stage where he/she can really start improving the results; I wouldn't be able to explain to someone how to get an interresting frame. The composition of lines, surfaces etc. is a feeling one has to develop.I can onlyrecommend people to study professional photos, and try to find out what makes it such a great image. ...And besides that, to read the manual and learn the basics before firing away here; that's rather dissapointing for sure...

Cheers! GB
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Old Jan 17, 2005, 10:51 AM   #22
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Oh BOO HOO ...

If he wants to go let him ...of course he will be missed but his last few posts to newbies ...or would be newbies ... proved he was agitated about this forum.

I think it is good that he take some time and cool off ...

The forum has changed alot but it is not a social club ...although it substitues as one for many. It seems like some live on this forum ... get out enjoy life because it is short!

Happy shooting mates!
Well, it's similar to the folks that first used the internet, like IRC (internet relay chat). At first, it was fun, because there was less 'pollution' since the users were all more or less technically oriented, intelligent etc. But after some time, as the internet developed...there came with it the pollution. However, the internet is publicly accessible, so these are the things we just have to live with and deal with. We can't change it back to the good times that we had at the beginning. It's the same with (for example) what you're talking about treemonkey...that is, we have anybody and everybody that just posts almost anything they want, even if it's out of focus, noisy etc...ie just grabbing any digital camera...snapping pics, and going to town with the uploading.

This doesn't bother me enough to stop coming to the forums though, since there are folks that do post some really decent pics up, and sometimes it's fun to check out interesting photos and listen in on the trends in digital camera development. I like seeing pics that other people take ... just as long as they don't go to town with uploading anything and everything. I wouldn't disappear completely though...since we would just be limiting ourselves to do that. I'd rather just go away for some time without indicating anything, and then just come back whenever I want.

To actually say that we're leaving because we feel that people aren't posting 'quality' pics can be somewhat taken in the wrong way by some of the users...such as they can interpret it to be arrogance, or snobbiness etc. So better to just leave without saying anything, but come back when we feel like it.
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Old Jan 17, 2005, 11:50 AM   #23
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Well said Kenny ... best sometimes ... I repeat sometimes ...to say nothing at all. Could there be a Newbie postings, stickies, etc that are easily accessible like some other forums have ... that may reduce alot tof the newbie chatter and we can get to business ... critiquing, encouraging each others efforts in photography.



comments. suggestions?
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Old Jan 17, 2005, 12:31 PM   #24
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Well, his biggest issue seems to be bandwidth:

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My biggest issue is the massive number of photos that have been posted in a single thread, now we have 10+ images in a thread. While I have a broadband connection it traffic is capped and after a week or so I no longer have the ability to see any of these photos as I have chewed my bandwidth reloading the whole thread trying to see one extra comment.
Kalypso took action a while back, and started moving images to the Post Your Photos forums setupfor this purpose.

But, the forum members preferred the current atmosphere, so a decision was made tolet them stay (at least for right now). But, we may need to revisit this issueas the forums grow.

We do get some complaints from time to time from dialup users, too. Keep in mind that it's hard to tell what's going to be found in a thread until you actually open it.

So, that means that if you're on dialup, and a lot of photos are posted, then you may have a LONG wait for a page to load. Unfortunately, not everyone has a high speed connection with unlimited bandwidth.

It would be nice if we could come to a compromise that would keep everyone happy --perhaps a warning in athread titlethat pics are included. I've seen users in other forums do this from time to time, out of courtesy to users on connections that are limited -- ending their subject title with (PICS).

As technology advances, hopefully more users will have high speed connections with no bandwidth limitations. Then, we'll have other issues to worry about. ;-)




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Old Jan 17, 2005, 12:38 PM   #25
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JimC. I think your idea of warnings about PICS is a good idea. IF any of us notice that the file has PICS and doesn't contain a warning, we could post to that user to remind them to do that. Maybe after time it would become routine. 2 cents:arrow:
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Old Jan 17, 2005, 12:40 PM   #26
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Or maybe it's better to link the photos. That is, don't allow photos to just automatically load, but instead, requires the user to click on the link to view the images.

Otherwise, have thumbnail pics (eg 100x75 pixel), so that you have to click on the thumbnail in order to see the full size image.
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Old Jan 17, 2005, 1:15 PM   #27
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nooner wrote:
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IF any of us notice that the file has PICS and doesn't contain a warning, we could post to that user to remind them to do that. Maybe after time it would become routine. 2 cents:arrow:
I just noticed looking through the current threads, that some forum members are already doing this.

There is no one perfect solution.... I see another threadtitled "What we need to do here" started by tacticalnuke. So, perhaps the forum members can come up with some ideas to make the forums better.

There are multiples sides to this... The forums setup for posting photos are really the bestplace for getting feedback. Then,you'd eliminate a lot of the complaints (since users would know that if they open threads there, images will be in them).

The Manufacturer Specific Forums would be a better place to get model specific tips and demonstrate techniques unique to them -- perhaps even using Kenny_Leong's suggestion and posting links to photos instead.

Yet,we see so much enthusiasm in the individual forums from users posting pics that they're proud of (which can be an inspiration to others), that it's hard to make a judgement call on what's the best approach.

But, if users were accustomed to posting photos in the forums setup for this purpose, then we wouldn't have the debate over this now (many would probably already be using them instead). People tend to resist change.


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Old Jan 17, 2005, 1:27 PM   #28
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Jimc, What about having our own place to put pictures in this forum? (Like a sticky at the top) This way people could post pics from their FZ's, and people entering the threads will know up front that pictures are inside. At the same time we won't have to leave the Panasonic forums to view our pictures.
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Old Jan 17, 2005, 1:39 PM   #29
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Fox wrote:
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Jimc, What about having our own place to put pictures in this forum? (Like a sticky at the top) This way people could post pics from their FZ's, and people entering the threads will know up front that pictures are inside. At the same time we won't have to leave the Panasonic forums to view our pictures.
Keep the ideas coming.We may take the best ones, and discuss them with Steve (he'll have to make the final decisions on these types of issues). Keep in mind that we've got multiple manufacturers forums here -- not just one for Panasonic.

So, if a decision was made to give each manufacturer specific forum their own space for photos (probably a different forum for them, versus one LONG thread setup as a sticky), then we'd need to do the same thing for all of the rest, too.

This means more forums for us to monitor and maintain (as well as more places a forum member would need to look for photos). This would also create a lot of redundancy (since we already have forums setup for posting photos).

So, there are pros and cons to any approach. -)


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Old Jan 17, 2005, 2:06 PM   #30
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JimC It's great to have access to the moderators here. This forum is unique in many ways and I'm sure will continue to get better, Thanks
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