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Old Jan 27, 2005, 2:37 PM   #1
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actually i haven't printed enough pics to notice the noise yet but i've been reading that at maybe 100 or at least 200 and above speed, the noise may be an issue for at least the larger 8 1/2 x 11 print. So far i have only done 4x6 and i have not noticed any noise.

some have suggested the ccd is not large enough for the 5 mp to deal with this issue. i am not a pro so i am not certain how big an issue it will be to me but my question is that if i step the camera down to the 3mp size, would that make any difference in the noise, if any, in the 8 1/2 x 11 prints? my other camera, which is the first, is a kodak dc 290 and for its day it was a fairly sofisticated camera at 2.1 mp. i was able to set the camera to effect 3.1 mp and the small and large 8 1/2 x 11 prints were great. i didn't notice any noise...amatuer that i am. i have read that the fz15 at 4 mp has less but i do not know. any feed back regarding your conclusions or suggestions will be appreciated.
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Old Jan 27, 2005, 3:09 PM   #2
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:arrow:http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/s...p;q=fz20+noise
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Old Jan 27, 2005, 4:07 PM   #3
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thanks for the link nooner. i have been overwhelmed with great information related to my post and i continue to be happy with my decision to purchase the fz20...just need to practice more under a variety of settings and environments. thanks again.
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Old Jan 27, 2005, 4:10 PM   #4
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The FZ-20 has "slightly" higher noise than other cameras. Claims that it is a noisey camera are overstated, as the graph below from Imaging-Resource illustrates. http://www.imaging-resource.com Panasonic did a good job boosting megapixels while keeping the noise acceptable at higher isos.

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Old Jan 27, 2005, 10:47 PM   #5
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all of a sudden there's all these posts about noise.. yes, as Nick's post shows, the FZ20 is not noise free, but neither is anything else. i've seen some noise from my FZ20 even at ISO 100, on low-light shots i've blown up to 8x10, but it's not objectionable, no worse than the grain from 200ASA film in a 35mm SLR under the same conditions. And unlike the 35mm film, the noise in the FZ'z images is easily dealt with using one of the noise-cleanup programs you can get.

to answer your other question, no, selecting the 3MP setting on the FZ won't change the amount of noise the CCD produces. noise is a function of the number of pixels in the CCD and the amount of gain applied to the device during image capture. selecting the 3MP setting only tells the camera to save it using fewer of the pixels it captured. there's a possibility you might 'notice' the noise a little less, but in my opinion, i'd rather have the pixels there, in case i want to crop the image and still make a large print. noise can be removed, but lost pixels can't be added back in...

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Old Jan 28, 2005, 10:01 AM   #6
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squirl033,thanks for responding to my question regarding noise reduction at 3mp. i really enjoy this well made camera and i appreciate this forum which allows one to interact with others throughout the world regarding our common interests and issues.
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Old Jan 28, 2005, 10:13 AM   #7
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Maybe the noise is slightly above average because the FZ20 CCD size is perfect for 4Mp, more than for 5.

Anyway I do not use (except than in some shots) any Noise removal software and instead I find that ISO 200 is perfectly usable even without NR processing.

ISO 200 shots (not night shots, but those made during the day in shady places or to achieve higher shutter speed) do not cause any color shift and only you can detect some more noise and, in the full 5Mp image, a slight loss of detail and biting up of edges.

But the resized (at about half size than original) -and prints I guess too-are quite good and usable.
Only at ISO 400 a NR processing is necessary, unless you don't want to print card size or use the on screen image reduced at 1/4 of its original (thus about to 640x460 from a 2560 x 1920 pixel image). And at ISO 400 the loss of edge details and underexp. zones noise is obv. higher.

I usually remove noise (as in underexposed skies) with some Blur Brush passes, generally in the Blue channel, the noiser one (sometimes also in the red one).

Francesco
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Old Jan 28, 2005, 12:23 PM   #8
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For the occasional large print a program like Neat Image will smooth it out nicely. I think the demo has sufficient features for that and doesn't expire. I like the pro version because it works as a Photoshop plug-in and you can apply different amounts of noise reduction to different parts of the image by selecting it.

I don't think you would notice the noise that much in an 8 X 10 unless you shot at very high ISO. And again it would be worth using Neat Image to reduce the noise for a print in that case.

Neat image works great for film grain in scanned images BTW. Film scanners seem to accentuate the grain and the images are almost unusable from ASA 400 film without noise reduction software.

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Maybe the noise is slightly above average because the FZ20 CCD size is perfect for 4Mp, more than for 5.
I think the people with full sized sensors on pricey DSLRs would probably say the CCD on the FZ20 is about right for a one quarter Mp camera. Everything is relative. My 4Mp FZ10 has a lot more noise than even a half size sensor on a 6Mp DSLR. But both the FZ10 and 20 are quite useable IMO.

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