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View Poll Results: Is the no gain up idea a feature?
Yes it is a feature, I love it. 2 1.63%
No it isnt a feature, its a problem. 71 57.72%
I want Panasonic to remove this feature in future models 49 39.84%
I do not want panasonic to remove this feature in future models 1 0.81%
Voters: 123. You may not vote on this poll

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Old Apr 25, 2005, 6:49 PM   #31
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Well, a $600 camera certainly warrants asking questions and you are encouraged to ask until satisfied..

What I am saying is that indoors, under normal room lighting (yes, one or 2 60w bulbs), it is possible to frame your shot. At least on the LCD.. Admittedly, I don't use the evf much indoors.. In my experience, others may differ, 2 60w bulbs is plenty to see what you are doing.. Now, I DO take a lot of photos and yes, some of them are junk. I guess the answer for you will depend on what you expect or hope to capture.

In near total darkness, I like to use the attached photo for demonstration purposes.. Taken using the aid of the AF assist lamp. Here, you won't see on the screen what you are taking a picture of. It isn't impossible, not even that uncomfortable, it just takes a little getting use to.. Especially if you are Use to an SLR. And btw, 99% of my photos are at ISO 80 and -1/3EV.. I don't fiddle around with those settings very much.

SLR like viewing, I'm afraid will only be available on an SLR.. I don't like to compare the 2 because with an SLR you are looking at an actual image reflected off of mirrors, not an electronic (tiny) television type device.. Also, you are looking at wide open aperture, at least on an auto lens.. When you press the shutter button the aperture then stops down for the photo.. What the Lumix does in manual mode ( and at half press in S and A ) is similar to an SLR DOF preview. I still don't know if that's a "feature" built into these cameras or if it's the nature of the mechanical lens. The voting seems to support the former and suggests it's an unwelcome feature.

For framing purposes, I think an optical viewfinder would work far better than the EVF.. In case you are unfamiliar, an optical viewfinder is just a window, sometimes with a graphic printed on it, to show what you are aiming the camera at.

If a store near you doesn't carry one, perhaps one that will accept a return without restocking charges (for exchange).. I know the place I bought mine from, cameta camera, will give 2 weeks for that purpose.. I asked when I bought it, "what if I absolutely hate it??"... The above was thier answer.

Jeff
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Old Apr 26, 2005, 3:52 PM   #32
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Thanks very much Jeff, must say you have been most helpful, thanks for taking the time to post such an informative answer



OK so it looks like I am still interested in either the FZ5 of FZ20, most of my images will probably be of my kids and quite a few of those will be taken indooors. I think the view changing to a kinda SLR depth of field preview screen is acceptable. Does it actually preview DOFor serve any other purpose though?

What I was trying to say about the SLR style of viewfinder is actually any kind of optical viewfinder, afterall if you only have a optical viewer you can't see much in low light anyway! It is the amazement of technology that lets LCDs see more when they actually do gain.

Thanks again I will have to travel further to test one:roll:
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Old Apr 26, 2005, 4:25 PM   #33
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Yes you would be making a big mistake to remove the FZ20 from your list ..It is a great camera with a minor problem as someone else said.

Myself I use program mode a lot and it really has to be dark not to be able to see thru the viewfinder.

In fact in a pitch black room I can see the focus assist light thru the EVF... its just it would be nice if the viewfinder gained up or at least did not darken.
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Old May 2, 2005, 5:14 PM   #34
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One question about the FZ20 problem. How do you do to make picture if you can't see what you are shooting ?

Actualy, I asked if I have to buy an other cam specialy for inside or low light. what you thinh about this ?

regards.......... aiglobulles
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Old May 2, 2005, 9:05 PM   #35
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Update from panasonic Bob. I sent a PM to him a while ago indicating the concern members of this forum had. It is clear from his message that they dont care.

The following is from Panasonic Bob

Please forgive my delay in responding. I've been very busy with my job responsibilities and travelling. My participation is contingent on having free time from my official responsibilities.

This issue was discussed at length and in detail over 1 year ago. I personally discussed it with our factory while in Japan. They demonstrated and explained why the current design will not accomplish this via firmware alone. I realize that many people have opinions and I respect them to the extent that factual issues permit.

If it were as easy as new firmware it would have been done. If you believe otherwise, please tell me why?

I'm haven't responded because nothing has changed. The limited time I have that can be devoted to answering questions is better spent on new topics that have not been previously discussed. I guess I'm trying to say that entering another debate where nothing has changed would not accomplish anything.

Again, please accept my apology for the delay in responding.

Bob

_____Original Message_____
From: Treemonkey
Date: 2005-04-23 19:43:31
Subject: Listen to the people

Hi Bob,

I hope you are paying attention to a thread I have started. "Feature" well it doesnt look like the users of the camera see it as a feature. Listen to the customers.

I am no expert in electronics so I will believe that you cant fix it via firmware but you had a chance with the FZ3, FZ5, FZ15 and FZ20 to fix it and you didnt.


Simon

http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/v...23&forum_id=23
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Old May 2, 2005, 9:24 PM   #36
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Treemonkey wrote:
Quote:
If it were as easy as new firmware it would have been done.
Bullshit.


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Old May 2, 2005, 10:03 PM   #37
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I couldnt have said it better myself.
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Old May 2, 2005, 11:45 PM   #38
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what can we do?
a petition signed by people on all forums with mail an ID number?
a legal action?
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Old May 3, 2005, 12:27 AM   #39
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Buy a different brand of camera is the only thing you can do. Bottom line is that common sense people aren't making the decisions at these companies anymore (if they ever did) but the bean counters..

Q: What's going to sell more cameras (not what's going to make a better camera)??
A: I know! A VIDEO mode.. :blah:
My response... Puh-leeez..

Bottom line is, if you are unhappy with the camera, sell it. If you are really concerned you Won't be happy with it, don't buy it to begin with. There are plenty of other options out there.. I chose the FZ20, really haven't looked back, and have no regrets about the purchase. Will I purchase the next model?? (fz30?) Don't know.. I'll have to wait and see what they come up with.. I can tell you that if they just simply cram another MP into the same sensor, the answer will be no.

Jeff

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Old May 3, 2005, 1:11 AM   #40
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Quote:
I can tell you that if they just simply cram another MP into the same sensor, the answer will be no.
Precisely!

But then again, they'll have to come up with something really irresistible to make me change from the FZ20 to anything else.
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