Raw vs Jpeg Debate

[Alex 007]

Dear Folks!

Now with my last acquisitation a Pentax K10D...seriously I decided to shoot ONLY at JPG "Top Quality". Mainly because when all the files are download to my Picasa photo organizer...automatically are transfered to JPG...if you shoot right or adjust your P-P well the final results it's really very good.

Here I decided to attach from my yesterday photograph session near my home when I was waking with my dog...this flower!

Of course...any constructive critic will extremely welcome!:P

Peace,

Alex 007:|

[robar]

benjikan wrote:

Hello all...

The RAW vs JPEG Debate is one that has been raging for quite some time now. I wish to share with you some of my own observations and how it might aid in your decision as to which to choose. It will not be a technical discourse as I am not in a position to do so. It will be based on my observations and how the decision will affect the final outcome i.e. the print media.

RAW is akin to a recording that is done directly to Pro Tools without compresssion and JPEG is what that recording might sound like after converting the signal for MP3 listening. That signal has been compressed and as a result has lost some of the high end and low end definition as well as the dynaamic range. This anolgy can be directly transposed to visual media. In photography RAW is the pure unadulterated signal. Now why would anyone even consider JPEG unless they felt that their image was not worthy of that kind of rendition. It should not come down to a question of memory or cost of storage etc. It is an image that merits the best resolution possible that may in the future be used for a support that needs the kind of resolution that only RAW can provide.

You may think.."Well it is only a snap shot." Well todays snapshot may be tomorrows historical archive. You are leaving a trace of history for future generations to view. Give your image the respect it deserves. Shoot in RAW...

i agree...

[Monza76]

Until I can afford to upgrade my computer I will seldom shoot RAW. Life is too short to wait for a celeron with 512MB of RAM to process more than two or three RAW files. This is a practical point that needs to be addressed as well. Yesterday my wife Annette and I went to the RCMP musical ride, we return with nearly 500 files. If we had been shooting RAW it would take a tremendous amount of time to complete the project because of computer issues (our son won't let us use his computer).

I shoot some RAW when I know the output has a specific purpose and must be top quality, I shoot jpeg the rest of the time because I would rather be making images than processing them.

With a better computer I will shoot RAW. I understand fully the advantages of shooting in a RAW format but I just took nearly ten minutes to do one conversion on my machine using Pentax PhotoLab, Adobe CR isn't much different and Lightroom works well with my style but is designed for 1GB of RAM so it chokes on my machine. When I am in the market for a new computer I will be certain to get the features I really need.

Ira

[bilybianca]

Edit: Roy says "I agree". I answered to that. Ira slipped in right between:-).

So do I... It's very rare that I get more than a few keepers from the same event/session, so thereis really not that much work to process and convert them. And if they're good they're worth to be as good as possible. As I learn more about PP I can go back to old RAWs and improve them further.

The rest goes in the bin. At some stage I realized that my not yet born grandchildren will have cameras of their own. They might be delighted if I leave hundreds of pictures behind, but will never bother to go through 30-40 thousand.

Kjell

[Keithw]

As a relative newcomer to the ability to shoot RAW (just over 4 months) I started shooting just jpgs on the grounds that was all I knew. But with the ability to shoot RAW+ that is what I now do. The RAW files are backed up separately and are my equivalent of a 35mm neg. The jpg is effectively my print that is ready to show people immediately. If I then want a poster or really top class print I can go back to the RAW image, tweak it (if only I knew how ...) then print it.

The only issue I have is one of space. RAW does take up a lot of space, especially if you are cheap like me and have the Samsung - only DNG files. I've just checked one of my 3 x 2Gb cards. It contains 107 images (so 214 files) with the RAW files sized between 16.5Mb and 17.1Mb while the JPGs vary between 1.0Mb and 2.6Mb.

So without backing up my cards I am restricted to about 300 shots in RAW+. When I was on holiday recently I took in excess of 1200 photos but I had a laptop with me, not so easy if you are travelling by plane. So as well as the quality issue you also have to consider the practicalities. Early on in the "digital revolution" you'd hear digicam owners go on about never having to buy film. But if you fill up your cards you'll find it a lot harder to buy another memory card than a roll of 35mm film.

I guess that there isn't a really easy answer other than lots and lots of memory cards. Fortunately they are coming down in price; so will definitely be on my list for Santa. Then all I'll need is the time and expertise to do the PP...

[bilybianca]

Keithw wrote:

But if you fill up your cards you'll find it a lot harder to buy another memory card than a roll of 35mm film.

I guess that there isn't a really easy answer other than lots and lots of memory cards. Fortunately they are coming down in price; so will definitely be on my list for Santa.

To find film will be as hard as finding hen's teeth in just a few years. Even before I bought my DS I had problems finding slide film, even at Charles de Gaulle airport in Paris! That was when P&S digital cameras had become popular, but the DSLR revolution was still around the corner.

Cards are coming down in price rapidly, but when they still cost around 100 USD per one gigabyte, I bought a very handy little 40 GB harddrive with card slots. It cost me ~200 USD. Connected to the computer with an USB cable it works just like any external harddrive, but unconnected you can still download your cards (it has an internal battery). That's enough space for 4000 RAWs from my 6MP DS, lasts for several holidays for me. I still only have one 1GB card. There are more expensive versions with a screen to look at your pictures too.

Kjell

[Dal1970]

Keithw wrote:

As a relative newcomer to the ability to shoot RAW (just over 4 months) I started shooting just jpgs on the grounds that was all I knew. But with the ability to shoot RAW+ that is what I now do. The RAW files are backed up separately and are my equivalent of a 35mm neg. The jpg is effectively my print that is ready to show people immediately. If I then want a poster or really top class print I can go back to the RAW image, tweak it (if only I knew how ...) then print it.

The only issue I have is one of space. RAW does take up a lot of space, especially if you are cheap like me and have the Samsung - only DNG files. I've just checked one of my 3 x 2Gb cards. It contains 107 images (so 214 files) with the RAW files sized between 16.5Mb and 17.1Mb while the JPGs vary between 1.0Mb and 2.6Mb.

So without backing up my cards I am restricted to about 300 shots in RAW+. When I was on holiday recently I took in excess of 1200 photos but I had a laptop with me, not so easy if you are travelling by plane. So as well as the quality issue you also have to consider the practicalities. Early on in the "digital revolution" you'd hear digicam owners go on about never having to buy film. But if you fill up your cards you'll find it a lot harder to buy another memory card than a roll of 35mm film.

I guess that there isn't a really easy answer other than lots and lots of memory cards. Fortunately they are coming down in price; so will definitely be on my list for Santa. Then all I'll need is the time and expertise to do the PP...

Being cheap doesn't mean not having the required shooting space. As you are in the UK, can I suggest you go here



http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/default.php?cPath=777



Or more specifically here



http://www.7dayshop.com/catalog/defa...EARCH&comp=



This is where I get my cards from. Been using them for around7 years now



First 1Gb card I bought here was around £18+postage. Those same cards are now £5+postage. I know they are good cos I have bought about 12 of them in the past year! G/F now has most of them, plus 1 in a compact and step-son wanted some..



When I got the K10D I invested staight away in 4 of the SDHC cards, and in RAW+ the maximum I have used is 2 cards. However, when I go on holiday I may use 3-4 cards per day.



I got the Class 4 ones for £16.49 plus postage.



Darren

[Keithw]

Thanks for the links Darren. 7dayshop is usually my first port of call for all kinds of purchases. However, when I bought the Samsung they were still charging about £40 for the 2Gb Extreme III, which was still cheaper than most sellers. I bought 2 then found that Play.com were selling them at £17 each, although they didn't have them in stock but I found someone else selling them for £21 each. 7dayshop couldn't do a price match but said I could return them. So I got the 3 cards for less than the price of 2.

Now you can get a 4Gb card for £16.49 - what a fantastic bargain. Better practise the speech as to why I need more memory cards. I'll try the old "The more I buy, the more money I'll save!"

The reference to cheap and Samsung is that the DNG files are all around 17Mb whereas the K10D saves in PEF - around 10Mb. That's around another 70 - 80 shots per card.

I'd forgotten how easy it is to spend money on cameras. Good fun tho'

Kjell - I also use my old 40Gb iRiver MP3 player that has a USB port. It's only USB1 so is painfully slow so one of these new photo banks, with USB2, sounds like a good idea.

Yet another gizmo for my Chrisytmas list!

Keith

[bilybianca]

Keithw wrote:

Kjell - I also use my old 40Gb iRiver MP3 player that has a USB port.

Does it have card slots, so you can download from your card?????

Kjell

[robar]

bilybianca wrote:

Edit: Roy says "I agree". I answered to that. Ira slipped in right between:-).

So do I... It's very rare that I get more than a few keepers from the same event/session, so thereis really not that much work to process and convert them. And if they're good they're worth to be as good as possible. As I learn more about PP I can go back to old RAWs and improve them further.

The rest goes in the bin. At some stage I realized that my not yet born grandchildren will have cameras of their own. They might be delighted if I leave hundreds of pictures behind, but will never bother to go through 30-40 thousand.

Kjell

i agree