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-   -   First impressions on Pentax 12-24mm (https://forums.steves-digicams.com/pentax-samsung-dslr-k-mount-mirrorless/157452-first-impressions-pentax-12-24mm.html)

Goldwinger Jul 16, 2009 8:24 PM

First impressions on Pentax 12-24mm
 
My new 12-24mm lens arrived this morning and I took it out this evening after it started cooling down a bit. My first thought was, man, I got to get used to taking pictures all over again! :lachen001: It makes the 18-55 kit lens look like a long telephoto by comparison. Seriously, I'm going to have to do some practice to get the hang of this thing. I'm totally awed by how close you can be to your target and still git more than you really wanted in the frame. I'll have to wait a couple weeks before giving a real qualified report but, my initial feeling is I'm going to like this one. I have mixed feelings regarding the distortion this lens can produce but, I believe it is partly due to how the camera is positioned in relationship to the subject being recorded.

Notice in this first shot (f:9.5 16mm, 1/350th ISO200) the building looks pretty good with little distortion.

I'll have to tell you an interesting story about this building one day...
http://goldwinger.zenfolio.com/img/v5/p35714295-4.jpg

Enterabce to the city park, Not to bad here either...

http://goldwinger.zenfolio.com/img/v4/p207121509-4.jpg

This use to be the old railroad station. the city moved it to this location and remodeled it a few years ago.
http://goldwinger.zenfolio.com/img/v2/p352413129-4.jpg

Kids at play...
http://goldwinger.zenfolio.com/img/v4/p114396565-4.jpg

http://goldwinger.zenfolio.com/img/v5/p270801823-4.jpg

Now, in this one you can really see the distortion! The flag pole should be strait up.:)

http://goldwinger.zenfolio.com/img/v2/p235027876-4.jpg

Well, its getting late and 3:30 comes early so I'm gonna hit the hay. I'll post more tomorrow.
cheers

nhmom Jul 16, 2009 8:48 PM

I've been waiting all week for you to say you got it. Cool!

I don't know anything about these lenses, but wouldn't the flag pole (and palm tree) be straighter if you shot from a lower vantage point? Don't ask me how that relates to the other images seeming to be "straight".

Anyway, the images look very sharp and clear. Is that your bike in the first one?

Patty

mtngal Jul 16, 2009 10:02 PM

Yes, making good use of the wide angle is another subject, and it's so easy to get perspective distortion.

Patty - the flag pole wouldn't look straighter from a lower vantage point - it would have even more distortion. The minute you look up some, especially at 12mm, you get significant distortion. Perhaps tomorrow I'll get out of the office at lunch and take some examples.

Rodney9 Jul 16, 2009 10:06 PM

Interesting shots, hope to see more soon.

Rodney

nhmom Jul 17, 2009 6:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mtngal (Post 984779)
Yes, making good use of the wide angle is another subject, and it's so easy to get perspective distortion.

Patty - the flag pole wouldn't look straighter from a lower vantage point - it would have even more distortion. The minute you look up some, especially at 12mm, you get significant distortion. Perhaps tomorrow I'll get out of the office at lunch and take some examples.

Okay. Now that I think of it, buildings from lower down with a regular lens do curve more. I would have trashed that image once I'd tried it. Or, maybe not. Might be interesting with a horizontal flag pole.:o

Patty

Mark1616 Jul 17, 2009 6:14 AM

I would say that this lens performs very well regarding distortion when related to a lot of others I've seen.

Glad you got your new toy and welcome to the world of wwwiiidddeeee!!

Wingman Jul 17, 2009 6:55 AM

Me definitely wants one of them lenses!

interested_observer Jul 17, 2009 9:13 AM

I had wanted this lens for quite some time and actually acquired mine about 8 months ago. The lens is very sharp and does great everywhere. You will always have the flagpole problem, so it becomes a framing or cropping problem or just accepting it. I do find that for wide angle lenses, natural shapes do much better than nice sets of square lines at the edges. But this lens does much better than all of the other wide angle lenses out there.

Also, for sharpness f5.6 up through 18mm and f8 through the rest of the range is the sweet spot. dpreview has a nice tool that is very usable for this. Also, this is essentially the same lens as the Tokina 12-24...

http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/..._n15/page3.asp

Also, a while back, I came across this gem of an observation, that the 12-24 lens has better sharpness than the new Pentax DA 15mm f4 LIMITED
"Compared to the Sigma 10-20mm F4-5.6 EX DC HSM (at 14mm), the 15mm F4 comes out on top; it's a hair sharper, and has lower distortion and falloff. Unfortunately it doesn't come out so well against the excellent Tokina AT-X PRO SD 12-24mm F4 (IF) DX, which we'd expect to perform near-identically to Pentax's own smc DA 12-24mm F4 ED AL (IF) - in this case the zoom is sharper, and has lower falloff and equally low distortion, although it does show more chromatic aberration."
http://www.dpreview.com/lensreviews/..._p15/page3.asp

I have never really had a flare problem, or really bad CA, as has been reported with the Tokina version. I chalk it up to the SMC coating that Pentax uses.

So, all in all - it is probably as good a lens as you can fine. You may loose a very small bit of field of view when compared against the slightly wider lenses (the 10mm to 20mm), but this makes up for that in many other ways. I really like mine for sunsets....and for everything else - for that matter.

Keltech Jul 17, 2009 9:55 AM

Congratulations on your new lens. The results you got show it to be a fine copy.

I agree with what interested_observer said in his opening paragraph. The flagpole problem is something you learn to deal with over time with wide lenses. The center of the lens is more forgiving to such objects.

PTlens is a good program for dealing with distortion. You can download a free trial version and see how it works with your lens.

Lou

hercules Jul 17, 2009 11:43 AM

Very nice shots you know this is my next lens, don't mind me asking but how much you pay for it as i am in the States now and thinking of buying it here;)

Goldwinger Jul 17, 2009 12:27 PM

Also, for sharpness f5.6 up through 18mm and f8 through the rest of the range is the sweet spot. dpreview has a nice tool that is very usable for this. Also, this is essentially the same lens as the Tokina 12-24...

.[/QUOTE]

Hey IO,
Are you saying the Tokina 12-24 is the same lense as the Pentax?
I could have saved $220 if I'd have known that!
:mad:
Oh well, Live and learn as they say...

Wingman Jul 17, 2009 12:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Keltech (Post 984866)
PTlens is a good program for dealing with distortion. You can download a free trial version and see how it works with your lens.

Lou

In addition to Lou's suggestion above, CS & PSE also have a very versatile perspective correction tool as well as "correct camera distortion" tfilter that works very well.

Biro Jul 17, 2009 12:44 PM

I'll be very interested to find out how this lens works out. I'm trying to decide if I want to go for the Pentax/Tokina 12-24mm f/4 lens or the Tokina 11-16 f/2.8 lens.

penolta Jul 17, 2009 12:44 PM

It is a common misconception, but what you are seeing exemplified by the last picture technically is not distortion - it is a matter of perspective (convergence of otherwise parallel lines into the distance which is not necessarily undesirable), and there are ways of correcting it in pp. (defishing, etc). Holding the camera level and cropping off unwanted space is the best way to minimize it. Lines bowing outwards from the center or inward towards the center are true distortions (barrel and pincushion distortions) - barrel distortion is most frequent at the wide end and pincushion at the long end of zooms. A wide angle lens that is free of pronounced barrel distortion (as opposed to a fisheye) is considered rectilinear and is the most desirable one to have. Hope this helps.

Goldwinger Jul 17, 2009 12:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nhmom (Post 984742)
I've been waiting all week for you to say you got it. Cool!

I don't know anything about these lenses, but wouldn't the flag pole (and palm tree) be straighter if you shot from a lower vantage point? Don't ask me how that relates to the other images seeming to be "straight".

Anyway, the images look very sharp and clear. Is that your bike in the first one?

Patty


Hey Patty,
Yeah, like Harriet said. It makes things worse the more out of parallel you are to the subject, the more distortion you see. I don't think this will be a big problem because as others have mentioned, you can correct it fairly easily with PP.

Yes, that's my bike. It was kind of a strange feeling parking there yesterday, I use to park there all the time years ago when I lived upstairs. I'll share that story with you another time. :)

Goldwinger Jul 17, 2009 1:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mark1616 (Post 984842)
I would say that this lens performs very well regarding distortion when related to a lot of others I've seen.

Glad you got your new toy and welcome to the world of wwwiiidddeeee!!

Thank you Mark.
and a strange new world it is too!
:lachen001:

Wingman Jul 17, 2009 1:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biro (Post 984904)
I'll be very interested to find out how this lens works out. I'm trying to decide if I want to go for the Pentax/Tokina 12-24mm f/4 lens or the Tokina 11-16 f/2.8 lens.

Unless I am mistaken the Tokina 11-16 f/2.8 is only available in Nikon and Canon mounts. I also think that the Tokina 12-24 and the Pentax 12-24 share a common heritage (similar to the Tokina and Pentax 50-135).

Goldwinger Jul 17, 2009 1:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hercules (Post 984882)
Very nice shots you know this is my next lens, don't mind me asking but how much you pay for it as i am in the States now and thinking of buying it here;)


Hey Hercules,
I don't mind a bit, I got this one from B&H Photo for $719 but, if this is actually same as the Tokina 12-24mm f/4 AT-X 124AF Pro DX II, then you can get that one for $499 :dontknow:

Goldwinger Jul 17, 2009 1:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jelpee (Post 984846)
Me definitely wants one of them lenses!


So... what's stopping you? :D

Goldwinger Jul 17, 2009 1:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by penolta (Post 984905)
It is a common misconception, but what you are seeing exemplified by the last picture technically is not distortion - it is a matter of perspective (convergence of otherwise parallel lines into the distance which is not necessarily undesirable), and there are ways of correcting it in pp. (defishing, etc). Holding the camera level and cropping off unwanted space is the best way to minimize it. Lines bowing outwards from the center or inward towards the center are true distortions (barrel and pincushion distortions) - barrel distortion is most frequent at the wide end and pincushion at the long end of zooms. A wide angle lens that is free of pronounced barrel distortion (as opposed to a fisheye) is considered rectilinear and is the most desirable one to have. Hope this helps.

Thanks Pen, its so easy to get the terminology messed up. :nuts:
Glad you got us straitened out.
http://usera.ImageCave.com/myplace46...leys/agree.gif

Goldwinger Jul 17, 2009 1:28 PM

:) Thanks everybody for your comments, I took some more pix this afternoon and I'll post some more soon as I can.

Wingman Jul 17, 2009 4:01 PM

GW...let me know your thoughts on the lack of internal focusing on this lens. How's the noise as well...compared to a regular Pentax Internal Focusing lens and also the HSM.

Goldwinger Jul 17, 2009 8:58 PM

jelpee,
It does have internal focusing and noise is less than my 55-300mm and much quicker. :)

Goldwinger Jul 17, 2009 9:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jelpee (Post 984918)
Unless I am mistaken the Tokina 11-16 f/2.8 is only available in Nikon and Canon mounts. I also think that the Tokina 12-24 and the Pentax 12-24 share a common heritage (similar to the Tokina and Pentax 50-135).

No, you're correct, but, they should be coming out with the Pentax and Sony mounts very soon from what I read. :)

snostorm Jul 17, 2009 9:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Goldwinger (Post 984919)

Hey Hercules,
I don't mind a bit, I got this one from B&H Photo for $719 but, if this is actually same as the Tokina 12-24mm f/4 AT-X 124AF Pro DX II, then you can get that one for $499 :dontknow:

Hi Herc and GW,

Unfortunately, Tokina doesn't make any of the lenses that have shared optical designs in Pentax mount. I've heard that there is a non-compete clause in their arrangement. In fact, I've heard that Tokina has decided not to produce any new lenses in K-mount because Pentax doesn't meet their relatively new market share requirements in DSLR sales (@ 10%), so it's questionable that they are going to make K-mount lenses -- at least in the near future.

I believe that this info came second hand from a Tokina rep, so take it for what it's worth. . .:dontknow:

Scott

interested_observer Jul 18, 2009 1:06 AM

Just as Snostorm has indicated Tokina does not produce any lenses in the K mount. Years ago they did, but not any longer. However, there are a number of lenses that Pentax and Tokina seem to share. the 10-17, 12-24, 16-50, 50-135. The optical train are reported to be the same, however the external barrell design and the autofocus clutch are different, along with the coatings used.

Its been reported by some that Pentax does the optical design on some and then each company does their own externals, etc.

Monza76 Jul 18, 2009 3:27 PM

nice lens, great shots. I have the DA 14mm f2.8 and the DA 10-17mm fisheye. I passed on the 12-24mm because at the time I could only afford the 14. (I purchased them a year apart, all my budget will allow)

Goldwinger Jul 19, 2009 8:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by interested_observer (Post 985085)
Just as Snostorm has indicated Tokina does not produce any lenses in the K mount. Years ago they did, but not any longer. However, there are a number of lenses that Pentax and Tokina seem to share. the 10-17, 12-24, 16-50, 50-135. The optical train are reported to be the same, however the external barrell design and the autofocus clutch are different, along with the coatings used.

Its been reported by some that Pentax does the optical design on some and then each company does their own externals, etc.

Thanks for the info I/O,
I feel better now
:D

Goldwinger Jul 19, 2009 8:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Monza76 (Post 985215)
nice lens, great shots. I have the DA 14mm f2.8 and the DA 10-17mm fisheye. I passed on the 12-24mm because at the time I could only afford the 14. (I purchased them a year apart, all my budget will allow)

Thanks Ira,
I had a chance to try out the 10-17 last year and was very impressed with it.
http://usera.ImageCave.com/myplace46...leys/agree.gif


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