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Old Jul 26, 2006, 12:31 PM   #1
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http://www.jessops.com/Store/s35453/...481&comp=y

don't you think it looks just like ist?? from specs it's exactly istDS, so why do they bother??
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Old Jul 26, 2006, 12:36 PM   #2
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It's probably a good thing. The more cameras Pentax makes, under anyone's nameplate, the more they can lower the price and still make a profit AND the more other lens manufacturers will want to make K-mount and derivative lenses. I'm all for it. Congrats Samsung on chosing a good design. This isn't much different from the 1970s when Sears was selling it's own brand of cameras that were essentially Pentax cameras and used the K-mount lenses. Makes good business sence for Pentax which makes more cameras, and Samsung, which doesn't have to manufacture a new line of lenses.
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Old Jul 26, 2006, 1:06 PM   #3
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I just bought one in from Jessops in Dublin

It's actually just a rebadged *ist DS2, not a DS, so it has a larger LCD screen, the updated firmware already installed and I don't know what else! Even the lenses are rebadged Pentax lenses.

I'm happy, as I got the camera + 2 lenses for the price of DS + 1 lens

-Nick
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Old Jul 26, 2006, 2:19 PM   #4
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Hi qfurm,

Samsung and Pentax have an agreement to co-develop and co-produce DSLRs using the K-mount form factor. One of the main reasons was probably that there are regions (China most notibly) where Japanese companies aren't that popular for mostly historical reasons. Korean companies (like Samsung) fare much better, and I see this as an attempt to penetrate markets that had previously been largely unexploited --- and China is a HUGE market. There are also a lot of markets where Pentax has little exposure, but Samsung is well recognized.

Samsung gets a proven, mature, and respected (though admittedly limited)DSLR product line, Pentax gets the benefit of R&D and marketing from the largest electronics company in the world (IIRC), significantly increased exposure in the global market, and a potentially huge user base for its proprietary lens mount form factor.

Pentax users should reap significant benefits -- increased demand for K-mount lenses will encourage 3rd party lens manufacturers to offer their full lines for the mount instead of the present limited lines compared to N, C, and KM, the larger user base will encourage Pentax to develop more advanced body designs for these users to upgrade to, not to mention expanding their lens lineup, and the potential for more advanced sensors of Samsung design and manufacture as Samsung devotes more R&D money to develop APS-C (and FF?) sensors resulting in lower cost as Pentax no longer has to rely on Sony (or whomever) for their sensors.

What's not to like about this?




gfurm wrote:
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http://www.jessops.com/Store/s35453/...481&comp=y

don't you think it looks just like ist?? from specs it's exactly istDS, so why do they bother??
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Old Jul 26, 2006, 3:28 PM   #5
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I agree that the "partnership" is a good business relationship that makes real sense. However, I would like to see the GX-1S and GX-1L prices come down much closer to the Pentax DL level in the USA. I would like to see a deal like Chenick found at Jessops in Dublin, Ireland available here in the USA.

Sarah
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Old Jul 26, 2006, 3:58 PM   #6
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i agree. the partnership will help everyone, even when it trickles down to us. so far i've seen samsung pushing their product more in advertisements more than pentax ever did..

roy
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Old Jul 26, 2006, 4:57 PM   #7
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I don't say it's bad for any reason, it may be good for all reasons you mentioned. But stamping a samsung name on 1 year old camera and calling it "brand new" seems misleading to me. If someone was looking for new camera, did some research and compared both of them side by side might come to a conclusion that Samsung is unable to make it's own camera and trying to cash on old technology saying it's new.I still think they are both great cameras but somehow this move doesn't work for me. I think it would be better for both firms to develop two similar cameras together and sell them under two different names, this way nobody would think that they are being ripped off. If Iwas complete beginner and bought "brand new" Samsung and found out later that's an 1 year old camera with different name I wouldn't be very happy. And that's why I said: why do they bother?
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Old Jul 26, 2006, 5:49 PM   #8
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However, with the almost $200 (100pounds) rebate being offered to UK residents, it is a pretty good deal.

Sarah
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Old Jul 26, 2006, 6:30 PM   #9
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Hi gfurm,

I'd be the last to say that I totally understand marketing, but here is how I see it.

Samsung has no experience or track record in building DSLRs -- Pentax has a proven track record -- if not making state of the art DSLRs, making very reliable, competent ones. To reach the level of customer confidence that is immediately available for the "old" DS2 and DL2, Samsung would have had to start from scratch many years ago to develop a truly feasible design and manufacturing capability.

Samsung, with their worldwide distribution network, can reach countries where Pentax either can't or won't. To these areas of the world, the cameras are indeed "new" because they were never easily attainable before, and they are indeed brand new -- not just old stock with taped over names.

Any "beginner" who is going to spend over $500 on a DSLR system (the body is only the beginning) is going to do a at least a little research. There has been absolutely no subtrefuge concerning the Samsung "clones"
(and clones isn't even a good word for it -- they are Pentax-made Samsungs) of the Pentax models. They look the same, perform the same, and even share the S and L designations. Any salesperson selling DSLRs who is awake enough to show up for work already knows that they're "clones" and will mention it -- if nothing else to add credibility to the camera's quality and guarantee the backwards compatibility of the older lenses.

The technology is not that old -- I maintain that my DS images will stand up to any other DSLR in its class. Besides, most of the DS2s and DL2s are gone now, so if someone wants one (and there are those that do), he can still get one -- but it'll pretty much have to be a Samsung.

If I was a complete beginner, my first DSLR wouldn't be from a company who's never designed or built one before, unless they were literally giving them away, and I didn't have anything to lose. I'd certainly consider it though, knowing that it's a proven product, having been on the market for a couple of years.

We're also talking entry level here -- there's been a lot of buzz about the DL rebate -- certainly old technology -- especially after the announcement of the K100D (which, if you discount the SR and focus points is pretty much the same "old technology" as the DL -- Image quality will be comparable, if not equal). New technology doesn't really show up at this level, and isn't really expected -- just reliability, image quality, comfort, comparible feature set, expandability, ease of use, and meeting a price point.

I don't think your "disappointed and ripped off" scenario will be the case for the great great majority of those who choose these cameras.

Scott




gfurm wrote:
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I don't say it's bad for any reason, it may be good for all reasons you mentioned. But stamping a samsung name on 1 year old camera and calling it "brand new" seems misleading to me. If someone was looking for new camera, did some research and compared both of them side by side might come to a conclusion that Samsung is unable to make it's own camera and trying to cash on old technology saying it's new.I still think they are both great cameras but somehow this move doesn't work for me. I think it would be better for both firms to develop two similar cameras together and sell them under two different names, this way nobody would think that they are being ripped off. If Iwas complete beginner and bought "brand new" Samsung and found out later that's an 1 year old camera with different name I wouldn't be very happy. And that's why I said: why do they bother?
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Old Jul 26, 2006, 7:19 PM   #10
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Hey chenick, welcome to the forums & congrats on your purchase! I agree whatever pentax can do to keep the design viable & more lens manufactures producing Kmount lenses... more power to them!

Nick, I've been hoping for someone to join this forum who is a resident of Ireland! My wife & in-laws visited there in 2004 & LOVED our stay there! In fact, I just got off of the telephone with a friend who is going to be there in September, not 30 minutes ago. Anyway, any pictures that you would be willing to post with your new camera (or any camera for that matter!) would be greatly appreciated! I took like 34 rolls of film while I was there (before I went digital) in 9 days! The whole country is a photographers dream ...just Beautiful!

Good shooting!

Ron
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