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Old Feb 6, 2008, 7:42 PM   #881
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Amazon.com shows a few good refurbisheddeals, wondering if it is or was due to those who now have returned their devices to the company
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 8:12 AM   #882
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fishycomics wrote:
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Amazon.com shows a few good refurbisheddeals, wondering if it is or was due to those who now have returned their devices to the company
Hi all, I'm new here. And I just got one of those refurbs from Amazon yesterday. Heck of a deal.... about $280 including next day delivery. It arrived in like new condition too.

First impression..... well, if I hadn't read this entire thread I would be returning it. Out of the box (ie., fully auto settings), its low light performace is awful. But when I set the high sensistivity to ON and the ISO to 100, it looks a lot better. It seems to hold the ISO higher than is necessary for a clean image in auto mode.

Has anyone else noticed that the image is quite a bit more compressed and noisy when played back using the component video outputs direct from the camera versus playing the file in Media Player or another PC player? I have the docking station connected to a nice Phillips 1440 X 900 widescreen monitor/TV via component video and I am using my Thinkpad X41 for file playback (because my desktop is only a PIII 750). Thesmaller screen on the X41 may be part of it. But even upon close examination, the playback looks less compressed with less noise when compared to the camera playbeck on the widescreen monitor. . Ditto for still images..... they look pretty awful played back through the camera to my monitor. But examining them on a PC (even cropped) they look a LOT better. I'll have to get an HDMI cable and try it that way.

I briefly had an Aiptek A-HD and I have to say that the HD700 image is not that much better so far. But I have done all my testing indoors at night so I have not tried anything in "normal" lighting conditions. The HD700 is nicely made but I have to say that I was more impressed with the Aiptek than I thought I would be. I got it as an open box special for $99 and returned it because it had a broken joystick. But I really liked the fact that it charged via USB. I miss a USB port (and USB charging) on the HD700.

Paul
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 9:27 AM   #883
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It seems to hold the ISO higher than is necessary for a clean image in auto mode.
I would agree with this, and find myself using manual ISO most of the time (I have ISO as one of my shortcut settings). It's especially true with stills when using flash. Generally speaking, if you're close enough for the flash to be effective, the auto ISO is almost always too high.

For video, I usually prefer a slightly darker, cleaner image than the auto provides. Fortunately, the monitor provides a fairly accurate representation of what the different ISO settings will produce.
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 10:59 AM   #884
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Have you noticed any difference between the file played back on a PC vs. through the camera to a monitor? I find it quite noticeable on both stills and video. What could be called objectionable noise in stills and video is a lot less pronounced when you play the file on something other than the camera.

A while back in this thread there was a lot of traffic about the noisy zoom motor. Mine is fairly quiet but is noisier at wide angles than zoomed in. If I put my ear up to the camera and listen carefully, it sounds like the motor is being driven by variable width / frequency pulses instead of by DC. The pulses change about 1/3 of the way from wide to telephoto, and whan they do, it gets a lot quieter. If I were to guess, I would guess that they change the zoom speed during the zoom to linearize the zoom effect. But in any event the zoom is quiet enough that is would not be noticeable in recordingsin anything other than a quiet room.

I have seen references to the stabilization making the image "jittery". When I first stated playing with my HD700, I found the stabilization to work rather well. But later, it was so jittery that it was unusable... it made the image shake more than it did with it off, in fact. This puzzled me until I discovered that the jitter goes away if you turn "high sensitivity" off. Not sure why unless it affects the shutter speed and confuses the stabilization algorithm. Too bad too... I find that "high sensitivity" increases low light performace FAR better than bumping up the ISO.

One last item.... anyone had the camera reset the shortcuts for no reason? Mine did this morning. As far as I know, they were OK until I tried playing with the "full automatic" function button. At some point after that I discovered that all four shortcuts had reverted to OFF and several other settings had changed. Maybe the firmware crashed and reset everything??

Paul
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 11:28 AM   #885
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Have you noticed any difference between the file played back on a PC vs. through the camera to a monitor?
For me, there's no difference between playing from the camera to a monitor or playing from the hard drive to the same monitor. If you're comparing a computer monitor to a television, there are a lot of variables that could affect what you're seeing.

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I find that "high sensitivity" increases low light performace FAR better than bumping up the ISO.
But, you do this at the cost of FPS, which goes from 30 to 15 in high sensitivity.



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anyone had the camera reset the shortcuts for no reason?
If I remember correctly, you need to switch out of full auto before you turn off the camera, or the full auto settings are saved as your regular settings.
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 11:51 AM   #886
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I just tried switching into and out of full auto mode and turning the camera off while in full auto and it did NOT reset any settings. When I turned the camera off (closed the display) in full auto, when I opened the display the camera was back in manual with all previous settings intact.

If "high sensitivity" mode lowers the shutter speed, that could explain why the stabilization algorithm gets confused. Too bad they didn't optimize it for both settings though..... when it works (high sensitivity off), it works pretty well.

When I view a video directly from the camera, it is fed via component video cables to the component video input of my Magnavox (Phillips) 19" widescreen monitor / HDTV. When I view via PC playback, I am using the 12" display on my Thinkpad X41. Granted, the X41 screen is a lot smaller, but even mentally making allowances for that, the noise still seems much finer on the Thinkpad. For example, if I view a still image directly from the camera to the monitor, it looks compressed and any pixel noise is exaggerated. That same image viewed on the Thinkpad and magnified to a similar scale does not have any compression artifacts that I can detect and looks FAR better than the direct camera view. I assume the problem is that in order to get the image from the camera to the monitor, there is a D/A step (with accompanying decompression artifacts) that is not needed when viewing direct from the file on a PC. I will be very interested to see what happens when I use an HDMI cable.

Tonight I plan on stopping at Circuit City to pick up an HDMI cable (they have one for $9.95) and an SDHC compatible card reader. With those, I will finally be able to directly compare the camera feed vs. PC playback on the same monitor and will know for sure if I am imagining the difference.

I guess the next step after that is to upgrade my motherboard.... I doubt my PIII 750 will be able to play HD recordings very well

Paul

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Old Feb 7, 2008, 1:54 PM   #887
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lol

congrad's you seem to know already how to use the cam. and it s spankin new:G

"Aiptek, or sanyo. you're comparing a simple auto point and shoot , to a sophisticated , near fully loaded manual cam

"camera is not turned off if you just close the screen. it is in a hybirnaion mode using less than a watt of power, can stay in that state for what the manual tells you.

"with the prope rrequirements and correct pkg loaded all goes smoothly

"just grab any aud vid cable , that is what they are if, just if the doxk orcam have those plugs, not
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Old Feb 7, 2008, 2:43 PM   #888
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Yes, I know that comparing the Aiptek to the Sanyo iscomparing apples and oranges. But.....while the HD700 is a better camera,the Aiptek was more than I expected for the price.... both performance wise and feature wise. I would have kept it if it had not had the broken button. Since it was a $99 open box special, they would not exchange it for a new one unless I made up the difference between $99 and $149.

As far as I know, there IS a difference between using an HDMI cable and component video. Component video is analog, so the digital image(s) have to be converted back to analog to use a component video cable. The HDMI connection is (I believe) digital all the way to the screen in an LCD monitor so there is no intervening D/A and accompanying decompression. Since Circuit City has one for less than $10, I figure it is worth a try.

Paul
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Old Feb 8, 2008, 12:57 AM   #889
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*derxxsfilmer* wrote:
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yes, it´s a much better hold with the 22mm ring, without the ring my m-power lens easily and often droped off the cam.
the ring also holds the pol-filter (comes without security loop) perfectly. it was too risky to use it without the ring - even though it´s magetic the hold on the cam was not strong enough.
the pol-filter is a hama pl cir 27mm magnet (uv-filter incl.).
i have to mention that the 22mm ring does not affect the field of view at all.
HAS ANYONE BEEN ABLE TO LOCATE A 22mm adhesive ring in U.S.? ALSO VISORBLUE, DID YOU EVER EXPERIMENT WITH TRIMMING THE RING THAT COMES WITH THE PHOENIX .045?
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Old Feb 8, 2008, 4:15 AM   #890
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it may be best to research a company that dealswith these. and send out an email
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