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Old Nov 21, 2005, 12:18 PM   #1
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I see a lot of interest/posts speculating on the merits of the new C6 but what about the other update to the Xacti range the C40?

For a start its already on sale here in the UK as of last week, priced £245. There is the beginnings of a positive review here but the link for full text is broken I think.

http://www.pixmania.co.uk/uk/uk/1688...movie-c40.html

What I want to know is this... I already have a decent digital camera for still so I'm looking mainly for good quality movies from the unit.

But am I right in believing that the extra 2MP on the C6 wont really have any impact on the movie performance of the Sanyo as shooting movies only uses a fraction of the actual pixels on the CCD?

As I'm looking mainly for a movie camera the C40 may foot the bill and I'd save myself $$$ over the C6 which looks like it's taking longer to appear. From what I've read, it looks like the C40 would have better low-light performance than its predecessor the C4, which, I understand, was already better than the C5's in the first place.

One negative though; It seems that, unlike the C4, the C40 doesn't come with any docking station to recharge and transfer files just cables. This is a real shame as the C4's docker looked really useful.

So anyone seen the C40 being sold anywhere else, in the US? Any reviews out yet?
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Old Nov 21, 2005, 2:36 PM   #2
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Yeah I think the C40 sounds great. If it's cheaper than the C6, it's definitely worth considering. A little longer zoom, a little bigger lens, a little easier to handle but not as small as the C6. It appears to be the C4 with the additional "4 mixed pixels" technology and 60fps TV output. This should enhance low light performance, but perhaps not as much as the C6 ("9 mixed pixels" technology), Sanyo claims max. movie ISO of 1600 for the C40 and max. movie ISO 3600 for the C6.

That's the big difference you missed withthe new models, they don't use a fraction of the sensor's pixels, they use the entire sensor this time.

Thanks for the link, but that review isn't really a review. If you still can't access it, here it is:



I wonder if the C40 was even available in the UK on the 16th? Perhaps this person (if they even exist)confused this model with the C4? No mention of low light performance.
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Old Nov 21, 2005, 3:31 PM   #3
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By the way, at this time,Claboo (€343) is selling the C40for slightly less than Pixmania (€ 363)... and Claboo is also selling the C6 (€ 550).

Edit: Hmmm, Pixmania-Pro has the C40 for €303 without tax, I imagine the prices above include tax? And the C6 is starting to appear onlinein Europe, the lowest I've seen so far is €492, including tax from XlTrade(They also carry the C40 for €335 including tax). I'm sure availability will be more widespread in the near future as will price competition.
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Old Nov 22, 2005, 8:20 AM   #4
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Thx for the links!

I've been looking over and comparing the specs for the Xacti range on Sanyo's Japanese website. It turns out that the C40's sensitivity for movies is unchanged from the C40, that is ISO 200-800 in automatic and ISO 200/400/800/1600 in manual.

http://www.sanyo-dsc.com/products/li...pec/index.html

So it looks like the "4 mixed pixels" technology is a bit of a white elephant as far as the low light performance goes in the C40.

Interesting though, is the increase in the ISO range on the C6 which, as you say, goes from a maximum of ISO 400 in automatic and ISO 800 in manual on the C5 to a max of ISO 3600 in both manual and automatic on the C6!

Other than being 7g lighter, the C40 seems to have no significant updates to the C4, this includes the zoom and lens size, no changes there: F = 5.8 - 33.8mm, zoom; Optical 5.8 time zoom F3.5 (Wide) - F3.7 (Tele).

In fact, in some ways, the C40 looks like a cheaper version of the C4 as it lacks a docking station, remote and a case all of which the C4 had. If this really is the final product then, as I don't want to spend £340 on a C6, I think I'll just look for older C4 if I can still get one?
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Old Nov 22, 2005, 8:47 AM   #5
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Panita wrote:
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[...]It turns out that the C40's sensitivity for movies is unchanged from the C4, that is ISO 200-800 in automatic and ISO 200/400/800/1600 in manual.

http://www.sanyo-dsc.com/products/li...pec/index.html

So it looks like the "4 mixed pixels" technology is a bit of a white elephant as far as the low light performance goes in the C40.[...]
That's strange I didn't see that the claimed movie ISO rating was the same as the old model. Stranger that they would release a new model with a higher sounding number that isn't an improvement over the older one? We'll have to see if it ever gets explained.
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Old Nov 22, 2005, 9:15 AM   #6
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Indeed,

And I just found more evidence in the specs that the C40 may be a dumbed-down version of the C4...

The C4's great TFT screen -praised by Steve in his review- although still 1.8 inch, is now a cheaper amorphous silicon version. The C4 has a poly-silicon TFT screen which has 13,000 pixels compared to the C40's 8,500 pixels.

Here's some background explaining the difference in TFT screens from a Toshiba laptop website:

"The advantages of the Poly-silicon display technology over the current amorphous silicon standard are very impressive. The most noticeable feature will be the clarity of the display. Poly-silicon displays have a much higher resolution than those of amorphous silicon and this means that the display is much sharper and brighter (and kinder on the eyes). It is also more reliable than the current display standard, uses less power and the screen can be of a much slimmer design."

Anyone know where I can still buy a cheap C4?
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Old Nov 22, 2005, 9:40 AM   #7
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Panita wrote:
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[...]Anyone know where I can still buy a cheap C4?
What I've been seeing so far is that the C5 isalmost as cheapas the C4, very marginal difference in price at this point. Plemix has the C5 for $352, PrestigeCamera has the C5 for $331, you'll have a difficult time finding a C4 for that price, unless it's used on ebay or you're lucky and find a deep discount liquidation sale.
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Old Nov 27, 2005, 2:06 PM   #8
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WhatI've seen so far corroborateseverything you've said. The C40 definitly appears to be a cheaper C4. As you pointed out, no more docking station or remote and a lower grade LCD screen. The whole "4 mixed pixel" thing I'm a little confused about, because Sanyo made a big deal about the new "9 mixed pixel" technology for the C6. You cansee "4-pixel mixture technology" on the C40 site, but it also states that this technology is present on the C4 site! So perhaps it's only changed from the C5 to the C6, thus explaining the movie ISO differences between the C5 and C6 but hasn't changed from theC4 and C40? The C40 is already cheaper than the C4 at online retailers. It could be that Sanyo couldn't produce the C4 much cheaper than the C5, thus the insignificant price differences, so they addressed that by cutting costs on the C40 to make it more competitive. I suspect they did put a new engine in the C40 since it does boast the "new" 60fps TV output over the C4, and the built in red-eyecorrection feature. What, if anything else does this engine provide to the C40 over the C4, only someone with access to both could tell us. But it does seem that if you can get a C4at the same price as a C40, the C4 would be the better choice.

The good news in all of this is that the C6 is not a cheaper version of the C5. It still has the better LCD, docking station, remote, better low light performance, etc. The specs on Sanyo's site confirm all of this. So the C6 is definitely an improvement over the C5, no question about it. But of course, you pay for this.

Thanks forbringing all of this to our attention!
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Old Nov 27, 2005, 3:31 PM   #9
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and once again....

Where the heck is a COMPLETE FULL review of that darned C6. I am sooo drooling.
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Old Nov 27, 2005, 11:30 PM   #10
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The sad thing,theranman, is that if you want to touch and feel a C6 in a "brick and mortar" store, as you said, thatcould take some time. SanyoNorth Americahas not announced the C6 yet. The C5 was announced in Japan March 1, 2005, and was released there at the end of March. The C5 only arrived in the US June 29, 2005, that's three months later. The C6 was announced in Japan October 20, 2005 and released there November 18, 2005, so if this is a pattern, does this mean the US will get the C6 in February? I don't know. If the C5 was considered a flopin the US, there is a possibility Sanyo might decide not to release it there? Until SanyoNorth Americaannounces something, or an insider can tell us, we won't know.

The good news is that in this globalized world we can individually import electronics from almost anywhere in the world as soon as they are available.
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