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Old Jan 19, 2006, 9:38 AM   #131
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Did you read the Steve's C6 review posted today? Did you find anything new there that we didn't discuss yet?
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Old Jan 19, 2006, 4:24 PM   #132
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I saw the C6 review, I wasn't too impressed. A lotof content wascopied from the C5 review and not much emphasis has been placed on the downsides of the camera such as noisy photos, the LCD washing out in the sunshine, poor low-light photography, no red-eye reduction flash, overall weak flash, poor stabilization. I'm not complaining about the camera but there are downsides to it that I don't think the review talked about enough.

By the way, that bridge picture was simply magnificent,it's too badthe really fine detail is lost in noise. I'm going to try to download a demo version of Noise Ninja and see how well it can clean up that picture.

Hybrids are getting a poor reputation as "gimmick" devices that do everything, but nothing particularly well. I think Sanyo worked hard to fix some of the nagging deficiencies of the Xacti C-series with the C6 and the new HD1. It's hard to be too critical if you've looked at old 8mm film strips lately, the quality of that is downright abominable. With my C6 I intend to record some family memories to last the ages, and perhaps there are better cameras that take cleaner, sharper photos and video but for the price and performance, this is working great for me.
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Old Jan 19, 2006, 7:14 PM   #133
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And that's right there: It works for you Grunchy.

I have gone through 8 or 9 cameras in the last three years, and none of them have been perfect. However, they have all been good at something, each one giving a little more than the previous one. I have owned Sony, Canon and Nikon cameras and also a Sony MicoMV and a Canon DV video camera. For the most part I have been happy with the cameras, celebrating their innovations while accepting their limitations. Most cameras are out of date as soon as you buy them, and the C6 is no different. However, as the leading hybrid on the market right now I have been pretty satisfied so far. I have had my fill of being a "serious photographer" and at this point in my life am happy to take snap shots. Whats the point in having great equipment if its such a pain to carry around that you never bother? Having kids will humble you as a photographer, since there are so many "Kodak moments" in a kid's development that after a while all you care about is capturing the moment and less about what camera you use, whether the white balance is correct, what F stop you need, etc, etc. The C6 fills a gap for me - I get 6meg shots I can crop and I get decent video I can use and more importantly, I can carry it around ALL THE TIME. Sure some of the pictires are noisy when I compare against my Sony or Nikons, and sure some of the video is not as good as that from my dedicated video cameras, but who cares?? In the short time I have had this camera it has become my go to camera of choice, and I figure I can deal with the less than perfect shots. Besides, they are still pretty good, and I can clean them up after the fact anyway.



Bottom line is, like Grunchy, this camera works for me, despite the very real limitations. I may check out the HD1, but honestly, its easy to become anal about this stuff, so maybe I won't.
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Old Jan 20, 2006, 7:26 AM   #134
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Grunchy wrote:
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I saw the C6 review, I wasn't too impressed. A lotof content wascopied from the C5 review and not much emphasis has been placed on the downsides of the camera[...]
He might be trying to please the manufacturers, howeverin this case it's less likelyconsidering Steve's indicated that he purchased his own Xactis. I could be wrong, but I think that Steve, with his undeniable experience with a wide range of cameras,simply assumes we knowthat ultra-compacts, with their tiny lenses and sensors, can't measure up to normal or even compact sized cameras. I expect he reviews cameras based on their performancerelative totheir category, without feelingthe needto spell this out (although he does, regarding the flash). I've readquite a fewultra-compact reviews and flash, noiseand red-eye issues are pervasive.The ultimate portability factor for snapshots is the selling point of these cameras, nottheir pro photo capabilities. The C6 has the bonus distinction of ultimate videocam portability.
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Old Jan 20, 2006, 7:10 PM   #135
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Hey, I got around to trying out that Noise Ninja plug-in with Irfanview, and all I can say is....

With just the default noise-reduction, it took that dog picture and totally rescued it. WOW. Apparently it can do even a little bit better if you do the noise calibration procedure! Edit: you can try the software for free (either as standalone or as a photoshop/irfanview plug-in) but it puts a grid on until you buy a license.

Here's a link to the full-sizecorrected shot:
http://static.flickr.com/18/89171719_7f74a153a7_o.jpg



Incidentally, the stand-alone program is much nicer than the plugin, because it supports a "batch" mode which can batch correct entire directories of photos. I think this software is a total necessity with the Xacti camera, and any camera or scanner really. Take a really close look at the sample image comparison below: you can barely see a row of white dots leading out into the sky past all the buildings. I don't know exactly what they are, perhaps they are a line of marker buoys! While you could sort of see them in the original noisy image, they stand out much more prominently in the filtered image, and the amazing thing is that the filter did not destroy those tiny details! That Is Amazing!!!
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Old Jan 20, 2006, 9:34 PM   #136
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Hmmm...attached a snippet comparing before and after. Must say I can't see a huge difference, certainly not to the "totally rescue" level...

Grunchy wrote:
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With just the default noise-reduction, it took that dog picture and totally rescued i
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Old Jan 21, 2006, 2:36 PM   #137
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Grunchy wrote:
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[...]a row of white dots leading out into the sky[...]
Yeah, what is that? I too am surprised it did not eliminate those, impressive. I've mostly heard good things about Neat Image (they nowmake Neat Video as well!),many people inCGuse it. Your Noise Ninja results look good. But the fact that it's opening a lossy JPEG, modifying it, then reencoding itas a lossy JPEG, doesn't that ensue a loss of information? I guess itmostly losesthe noise information. :G Oh and the update without the grid looks good, it did a really nice job.
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Old Jan 21, 2006, 3:16 PM   #138
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Actually the update without the grid is the original image. I was just trying to compare the untoched with the filtered to see the difference. The excerpt was saved with minimal JPEG compression.
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Old Jan 21, 2006, 11:05 PM   #139
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:lol:, Grunchyedited/updated his post. I was addressing it.:G
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Old Jan 22, 2006, 12:47 AM   #140
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Ah.**[img]/forums/images/emoticons/icon_lol.gif[/img]
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