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5hane Apr 11, 2006 6:11 AM

Sony DSC H1

Can anyone suggest a good value wide lens for this camera? (cheep and good if possible)

Perhaps there are many sizes to choose from, but as my understanding is limited, perhaps I can rely your judgement.

I am guessing I would want this lens when I want to take more scenic shots.

Here is the dumbest part of my question:

Can you still use the zoom with this lens attached?.. If so, why not just make the camera wide angle to start with?

Thanks










5hane Apr 12, 2006 4:06 AM

This must be a joke http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/...635335-5195964

£110!!!, plus the reviewer says it leaves a shadow on photos taken using the flash.

I guess being Sony it was bound to be a rip off, but please if any of you can suggest a good one without the shadows and not silly money, plus answer my previous questions

Thank you





5hane Apr 12, 2006 5:21 AM

EEP my questions are building up :-)

Are these any good? http://www.raynox.co.jp/english/digital/h1/index.htm



5hane Apr 12, 2006 6:34 AM

London Camera Exchange told me to only go for the Sony one's as they are specifically designed for my camera, and ANY other manufactures lens's could deteriorate the photo's, especially with digital cameras that are now so sensitive. Sigh.

Incidentally, London Camera Exchange don't sell the Sony ones, in caseyou thought they were trying to get a sale out of me.

The chap also told me raynox are rubbish.

Anyone alive out there withsome answers to all my Q's?

Cheers



fraser36 Apr 13, 2006 3:09 PM

I received the wide angle and tele lenses from Sony today and will use over the weekend - I like you, was looking for alternatives, but these lenses are specifically designed for the H1 hence the reason I bought them £185 for both - I'm a novice at the camera game but I'll take some shots at the weekend and post and give you some feedback

Sintares Apr 13, 2006 3:58 PM

5hane wrote:
Quote:

This must be a joke http://www.amazon.co.uk/exec/obidos/...635335-5195964

£110!!!, plus the reviewer says it leaves a shadow on photos taken using the flash.

I guess being Sony it was bound to be a rip off, but please if any of you can suggest a good one without the shadows and not silly money, plus answer my previous questions

Thank you




Well obviously it leavesa shadow on photos taken with the flash when the subjects are too close for example taking picturesof a typical room.

The light from the flash(which is only slightyraised above the camera)travels outwards and down and hits the large solid thing sticking on the front of the camera (thats the wide angle lens..)

Being as solid objects block light , a fundamental property of physics, the lower part of the picture is thus in shadow.

Options.

Light room better and don't use flash

Bounce/direct the H1s flash sidewards to a slave flash to light the room.

Bounce/direct the H1s flash upwards off a white ceiling for example, probably have to use the flash on + for the loss in power caused by the bounce.

Stand further back from the subject and crop the bottom of the photo to removeany shadow.






5hane Apr 15, 2006 1:01 PM

Thanks fraser36, I look forward to seeing the results!! oh and please let me know which wide angle lens you are using, as im not sure which would be my best bet out of the Sony selection.

and thanksSintares, I suppose I have to wonder just how often I would want the flash to fire anyway, after all I think I will probably only use the wide angle lense in no flash situations,... mostly.

Sorry to ask but can I still use 12xzoom?, if not what happens when I try zooming??



eR1c Apr 21, 2006 12:35 PM

you guys really need to search these forums before you post a new thread, I find like 5 threads on the same subject...these forums are a mess!!!

anyway, here is a great wideangle lens review:

http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/v...mp;forum_id=28

5hane Apr 21, 2006 2:17 PM

Thanks eR1c

Search facilty could do with some improving then.

I spent my money on a tripod in the end, I think that was a more important purchase after trying to take photos of Brighton by night and getting nothing but artistic blured images :-)



eR1c Apr 21, 2006 4:49 PM

no worries,

I do love my wide angle lens though,

I found that many people felt strongly about getting only a Sony branded lens, -I have actually been more impressed w/ the Raynox lenses for their price and quality than I have w/ the Sony ones... just my 2 cents,

(you can read my review on the lens)

5hane Apr 22, 2006 12:23 AM

Quote:

I have actually been more impressed w/ the Raynox lenses
You were?... I was hoping to hear that.

So maybe I can afford the new lens with the change I got for my wallet thinning tripod.

I will read your review, thanks!!!!



eR1c Apr 25, 2006 12:52 PM

Yes, I've purchased two Raynox lenses (one for my H1 and one for another camera)..both were of excellent quality and worked as expected.


5hane Apr 27, 2006 3:41 AM

I need to asktwo questions that are baffling me.

Why doesn't the H1 just have a wider lens to start with....is it so we spend more money on the upgrade later?

Can we still get full zoom capabilitywith any other lens including the wide angle lens attached?.... if not then why?.... is it because the zoom will hit the new lens that is screwed on to the H1?

Thanks



eR1c May 1, 2006 2:13 PM

Basically the wide angle is focused (or made) for getting everything in a closer view as well as the perriferal area ...in short, a "wide angle" is what it's best for.

A zoom lens focuses on subjects at far distances, but not good at getting all the information from a wide area ...it's a concentrated point that it focuses on.

A macro lens focuses on the super close subject.


One lens that does all three is going to be what comes w/ most cameras. It does everything decently but not any one really well.

hence why many of us like to buy additional lenses, for extreme cases where you want to get a photo of an entire room (wide angle), or a super closeup of a flower or bee (macro)...



5hane May 1, 2006 2:22 PM

Thanks fot that, but is there any reason why I cant still get full zoom with the wide angle attatched?

eR1c May 1, 2006 8:16 PM

yes, it's because the wide angle is made for capturing from a wide angle, it uses a completely different set of lens elements than a zoom lens does.

It's like putting on near sighted glasses versus farsighted glasses.. you can't have one that does both really really well. it's either or,

a zoom lens is made to focus at farther distances, whereas a wide angle is made to not zoom at all rather to capture wide angles.

w/ my Raynox lens I can only zoom in a little bit... 2x zoom that's it. It would probably begin to distort and be out of focus if Sony allowed the lens to zoom more than that. -It's because of the glass optics.

5hane May 2, 2006 3:33 AM

Thanks eR1c

Youmake it all sound so simple, but I do like to have a clear understandingthese things before I use them.

s_grins May 2, 2006 8:08 AM

Shane wrought:

Youmake it all sound so simple, but I do like to have a clear understandingthese things before I use them

Shane, I appreciate you desire to learn more about optics and its implementations.
The best place for it is a library.
Good luck in your endeavor.

Tullio May 3, 2006 10:14 AM

I have an H1 and I've been researching the wide-angles for weeks. A couple of days ago I finally made up my mind and bought the Raynox DCR 6600PRO. I have the Sony DH1758 1.7x tele converter and find it to be an awesome lens. However, the WA is not nearly as good (from the many, many reviews I've read and sample pictures I've seen). Raynox has two models that are (apparently) identical in terms of lens construction: HD 6600pro and the DCR 6600PRO. The differences between them are:

DCR =it has a removable (and thicker)mounting thread; it's lighter; it comes in 52mm mount size only (at least I haven't been able to find it in any other size); cheaper

HD = fixed mounting thread (shorter); heavier; it cames in many sizes; more expensive

The good thing about the H1 is that one can use a step down ring (58-52) without experiencing any vignetting. Since the HD 58mm version does not mount well on the H1 unless the original H1 lens adapter is used (which it is not my case), I opted for the DCR version. I haven't received it yet but I'll post some samples as soon as I get my hands on it.

s_grins May 3, 2006 7:15 PM

Tullio, the problem is Shane wants lens with wide range of focus let's say from 18mm to 240mm and because Shane really wants them very mutch we have to explain him why such a lens does not exist.
Trust me, it is not easy

eR1c May 3, 2006 7:35 PM

It isn't easy to explain, but once you get it you get it!

Maybe this will help a bit more:

A camera lens is actually made up of several glass lenses.
Moving these glass lenses closer and/or farther from each other gives a different focus. It's like looking through a magnifying glass, this is only one lense, -but have you ever noticed how you have to move it closer or farther from a subject to get the image inside the magnifying lense into focus? This is the same principle with focusing the glass elements inside your camera lense.

does this make sense?

Now, the curve of the lense, -or how it is designed will give a different effect.

So, with all that, you have manufacturers who have crafted lenses to focus at objects that are really close, really far, and inbetween. One lense hasn't been invented that I know of that does all three things really well. Most likely for this to occur the actuall glass elements inside the lense would have to change shape as they focused/moved closer and farther from each other.

if you still don't get it, then I'd suggest getting some photography books from the library with nice diagrams that explain all of this. (as was mentioned)


5hane May 8, 2006 5:56 AM

That makes perfect sense eR1c, thank you.

and thanksfor the other comments from people too.

Now to choose the lens that most suits my needs

Tullio May 15, 2006 1:02 AM

I received my Raynox DCR 6600PRO and I must say...it's an impressive WA lens. But, the first thing you need to haveis the Raynox 52mm adapter (RT5256H). W/o this adapter, you will experience strong vignetting. I have a short58mm adapter + the original Sony 58mm adapter that comes with the H1 and both presented the same exact problem. However, with the Raynox 52mm adapter there is absolutely NO vignetting. You can not use filters either or vignetting will be present (I bought the UV and Polarizer 72mm filters before receiving the lens and now I have to try to return them). Now, what is very impressive about this lens is the sharpness and low distortion produced by it. While most WA adapters show significant barrel distortion (visible primarily on photos of tall buildings, lampposts and anything else that has strong straight lines), the Raynox is virtually distortion free and that is priceless (not sure this word really applies since I paid only $99). There is also the new Raynox model HD 6600PRO58, which in theory is the same lens but with a 58mm mount. Please note the use of the word "theory". This is because the DCR and HD lens are not quite the same (beside the thread size, of course). The bottom lens of the58mm version sticks out beyond the thread level and in order for it to fit properly, I've read people adding adapter rings andglassless filter rings tocreate the space needed to prevent the H1 lens to jam against theWA.I've also read that the DCR lens produces sharper images. Those were the two primary reasons I decide in favor of the DCR and I'm glad I did so.

5hane May 19, 2006 7:33 AM

Thanks forthat wonderfully detailed reply. Of which most of It I understood :-).

I know you said there was no vignetting (I still need to look up that word as well), but the image on this site showsvignetting.


http://www.raynox.co.jp/comparison/d...htm#dcr6600pro

Although in all honesty, unless your looking for it, who the hell would even notice?

Thanks






Tullio May 19, 2006 3:36 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Yesterday I wentwith my son on a school field trip and for the first time Iwas able to take many outdoorpictures with the Raynox DCR 6600PRO WA lensattached to my H1. As I mentioned, I'm using the Raynox 52mm adapter with it. Here are some shots taken with it. Note that barrel distortion is almost non-existent, color saturation is good and...no vignetting. These photos were taken at thelong range of the zoom.

Tullio May 19, 2006 3:37 PM

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Tullio May 19, 2006 3:37 PM

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#3

Tullio May 19, 2006 3:38 PM

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#4

Tullio May 19, 2006 3:38 PM

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#5

Tullio May 19, 2006 3:39 PM

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#6

5hane May 22, 2006 3:51 AM

Very nice, especially #3 I thought.

I bet once you fit the lens you never want to remove it!

I am very disappointed with London Camera Exchange!!

1/all there products cost £10+ more than any other shop iv ever been in.

2/they fobbed me off with a useless overpricedtripod http://www.stevesforums.com/forums/v...mp;forum_id=73

3/ They tell me to avoid any other lens's for the H1except Sony's own brand.

Thanks Tullio, you have made my mind up



Tullio May 22, 2006 10:00 AM

I have the Sony 1.7x tele converter and it's an excellent lens. However, the WA is not nearly as good, not because of the image quality it produces but the amount of barrel distortion evident in every single shot (even outdoor shots in the wide open, which usually mask this effect). You can't go wrong with the Raynox and for the H1, even though you already have the 58mm adapter (it comes with the camera), I suggest you buy the DCR-6600PRO model, whichhas a 52mm thread and the Raynox 52mm adapter. You'd be better off than buying the HD-6600PRO58, which although it appears to be the same exact lens but with a 58mm thread, it is not, really.

5hane May 22, 2006 10:52 AM

Great thanks.

How did you decide on the size of lens?



Tullio May 22, 2006 11:51 AM

I've read about some of the issues at lensmateonline.com as well as lots of people's comments about the tricks they had to put in place to make the 58mm lens work well with the camera. Besides, I also read people saying that the DCR lensproduced sharper images than the HD version. Those were the reasons that made me buy the DCR 6600PRO instead of the HD 6600PRO58.So, I now use the 52mm adapter all the time. I bought a step up ring (52mm to 58mm) so I can use the filters and the teleconverter I havewithout having to switch adapters all the time. It works real good.

5hane May 24, 2006 11:01 AM

It looks like you have done all the homework and saved anyone including me the work involved infinding out which of the wide angle Lens is right for this camera.

Sorry but I have a couple more newbie questions:

Will the extra dimensions be visible on the LCD monitor?

Will I know when I have zoomed to the max with this lens connected? That is to say "will the barrel (for want of a better word) hit the wide angle lens if zoomed too far, or do I have todecide for myself when I have reached the max zoom capability for the attached lens"?

I am sure that's all I need to know b4 I commit to buy.

Thanks











Tullio May 24, 2006 3:26 PM

As long as you use the Raynox 52mm adapter with no filters, you will not experience any vignettingon either range of the zoom. One of the options under theH1setup 2 menu isto select an adapter in case you are using one.By choosing the appropriate setting (WA or tele), you tell the camera to adjust the focal length based of the converter in use, so it will not let you take picturesfrom distances the camera can't focus.

5hane May 25, 2006 3:10 AM

Excellent and im guessing that although the zoom will still extend fully, the WA lens attachedwill mean thatmaximum zoom will be dissipated by the WA lens.

and so the full zoom range will not be available.



Tullio May 25, 2006 11:49 AM

The primary use of aWA converter isto increase field of view. It does not make sense to use 12x zoom with this lens (even if you could). The more you zoom in, the less WA effect you get. This adapter should be used to take landscapepictures or pictures of objects located in small, confinedareas, impossible to be captured bythe normal 36mm lens. If you are taking landscapepictures and you have the need to zoom in, it defeats the purpose of having the WA. You'd be much better off using the normal camera lens with the zoom. I did not think I needed the WA adapter as much until I got it. As it turns out, Iuse it all the time, even more so than the tele. For $100, I say go ahead and buy it. You will not regret.

eR1c May 25, 2006 9:24 PM

exactly, -seems odd to use the zoom w/ the wide angle ... unless your going for some specific technique or shot?

i too use my wide angle lens as much as the lens that is built into the camera.
-it's proved to be a very useful and wise purchase!



Tullio May 26, 2006 1:57 AM

Absolutely. I sometimes use the WA and macro mode combined but never WA and zoom.


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